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Thread: Death's Cold Embrace: Mission 1 "Murder Most Foul"

  1. #76
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2004
    Location: Heidelberg
    Did someone else tried ghosting yet? If yes: were you able to sneak into Harlequin commons and into Davidov's without first alerts? I also couldn't even regularly ghost the workshop - not without chemical help, I mean.

  2. #77
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    There is a way to get the journal in the workshop basement without either alerting or destroying the cherub guardian. If you shoot the light above the safe with a water arrow, it will go out for about 10 seconds, giving you time to pick the safe, grab the journal and get back to shadow before the now awake cherub spots you. It will probably take you two or three water arrows. The ghosters on the test team (Peter Smith and Tannar) both agreed that this was not a bust since the light suffers no permanent damage.

  3. #78
    New Member
    Registered: May 2016
    Is there a way to grab the gold coins outside of the Harlequin's Inn without getting frozen into the roof? I don't know how to deal with this bizarre bug.

  4. #79
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    I don't know what bug this is you're talking about. You can get to the awning above the front door and grab the coin stack pretty easily in my experience.

  5. #80
    New Member
    Registered: May 2016
    I use a rope arrow to climb up, grab the coin, and then I get stuck. Movement becomes frozen or comically delayed to where forward movement will take upward of 15s for one step. It becomes impossible to jump or otherwise move, or most importantly, get off of the awning. Is there a noclip cheat or some way to unstick?

  6. #81
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2004
    Location: Heidelberg
    Looks like you've ran into an individual situation. Everyone else (me included) had no issues with that awning. I shot the arrow into its side, if that makes a difference.

  7. #82
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    Quote Originally Posted by ultravioletu View Post
    Did someone else tried ghosting yet? If yes: were you able to sneak into Harlequin commons and into Davidov's without first alerts? I also couldn't even regularly ghost the workshop - not without chemical help, I mean.
    Good timing for answers to your questions, ultravioletu.
    My supreme ghost let's play of DCE, mission 1 is here. 2 supreme busts in total, and 2 skipped pieces of loot. No ghost busts.
    As far as the Harlequin: No . Davidov's: Yes. Workshop: Yes.

  8. #83
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2004
    Location: Heidelberg
    Ha!! I guess I gave up too soon on Boris house, I was really conviced it's not "supreme"-able.

    Your playthrough is excellent, as usual. One thing puzzles me: why didn't you dodge Linda on the staircase? There's enough room and you could have made it one "patrol round" shorter. It turned out for the best probably, you've had a good opening at artist's and jeweler's, one minute earlier or later the plaza could've been Central Station...

  9. #84
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    Guess I missed the staircase as a hiding spot. Redleaf square was empty most of the mission for me. The guards were conveniently elsewhere. Fun to try to Supreme individual buildings, like Davidov's, even though I knew the mission overall couldn't be.

  10. #85
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    So the only area you couldn't Supreme was the Harlequin Inn downstairs? What loot is in there that you couldn't get? I thought it was all behind the counter.

  11. #86
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Location: CT, USA
    It's because the woman standing by the fireplace gives an alert, so he has to avoid that for supreme and thus the loot behind the counter.

  12. #87
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    I had to take two Supreme busts at miller's, then also skip two pieces of loot. One at the Inn and one at the artist's. Check my written report or the let's play for details.
    Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
    Let's Supreme Ghost Thief - YouTube Channel with Thief Let's Plays

  13. #88
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    Gotcha. So you can't even turn off electric lights during Supreme, even if you put them back on later?

  14. #89
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    Supreme doesn't allow any removal of light sources whatsoever. That's why I had to skip the burning candlestick at the artist's too, since you have to snuff it before taking it.

  15. #90
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    I actually managed to sneak in the pub through the front door all the way to Fairbank (didn't find the short cut until later). Was this supposed to be possible?

  16. #91
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    It wasn't intentionally made to be impossible, just very difficult to clue in the player that there must be a much easier shortcut. Looks like your thiefy skills aren't as rusty as you feared! Maybe it's about time to dust off Dromed and come enjoy all the great things in NewDark, hmmmm?

  17. #92
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2004
    Location: Heidelberg
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    Gotcha. So you can't even turn off electric lights during Supreme, even if you put them back on later?
    Quote Originally Posted by klatremus View Post
    Supreme doesn't allow any removal of light sources whatsoever. That's why I had to skip the burning candlestick at the artist's too, since you have to snuff it before taking it.
    "Supreme" rules intended to forbid any means to boost Garrett's natural sneaking abilities. No turning off the lights to sneak easier, no moss arrows to dampen noise, no invisiblity potions, no free-fall, no disabling of security systems (not even the ones that can be turned on again), no engine exploits. So the workshop situation is indeed a bust for Supreme, for the right reasons and in the spirit of the rule. Regular ghost is okay, though.

    Unfortunately, the people who wrote the rules are not there anymore to adjust them to suit reality, or at least to give a formal stamp of approval to some change proposals.

    Klatremus (and whoever else followed the rule by the letter) had to skip the candlestick at the painter, because one must snuff it beforehand. IMHO the "no turning off light" rule should have an exception: if loot, and if the disappearance of the light does not give a competitive advantage to the player against enemy. There are situations in the later missions when other candlesticks MUST be skipped for Supreme, and this time rightfully so, because they are near guards or on route of patrolling guards.

    Klatremus, obviously for open scrutinity reasons, had to report busts (or skip loot for supreme) in situations, which in my opinion do not violate the spirit of Supreme rules. Like using a holy water potion to solve a puzzle. This had nothing to do with "unfairly boosting the sneaking abilities", but was forbidden by the letter of the rule. Which lacks a overdue amendment...
    Last edited by ultravioletu; 5th Dec 2017 at 10:31.

  18. #93
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    I completely agree with your arguments here. In fact, an amendment was made to rule #6, where there was a 'no use of moss arrows' wording. Added was an addition to let any arrow be used to solve puzzles, which was never the rule's original intention to prevent.

    If there is a general consensus to add a similar amendment for 'no removal of light sources' when it comes to loot or the solving of puzzles, as long as it isn't used to conceal the player, then I'm all for it.

  19. #94
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    It wasn't intentionally made to be impossible, just very difficult to clue in the player that there must be a much easier shortcut. Looks like your thiefy skills aren't as rusty as you feared! Maybe it's about time to dust off Dromed and come enjoy all the great things in NewDark, hmmmm?
    Hehe, thanks. I will have to re-learn so much stuff!

    Actually I sneaked in the pub in three different ways:
    - First I did it with an invisibility potion and a flash bomb,
    - Then I did it with two flash bombs,
    - And finally I managed to do it using only one water arrow (for the fireplace upstairs)

    And in the first two methods it was quite funny watching Fairbanks talk to Garrett while performing his signature flash bomb dance! (surprisingly it didn't break the conversation)


    Now a minor complaint (from someone with a puzzle-based-missions mindset): The note about the engineer having to relocate one of the wires sent me on a (very) long wild goose chase. It led me to think that I had to do something with the electrical systems to turn off the lights in the pub so I could sneak in.

  20. #95
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    Quote Originally Posted by Haplo View Post
    Hehe, thanks. I will have to re-learn so much stuff!
    So that's a yes? :excited_face: Maybe you could enter the T1 20th Anniversary Contest?

    Quote Originally Posted by Haplo View Post
    Now a minor complaint (from someone with a puzzle-based-missions mindset): The note about the engineer having to relocate one of the wires sent me on a (very) long wild goose chase. It led me to think that I had to do something with the electrical systems to turn off the lights in the pub so I could sneak in.
    Ah, well you're the only one to my knowledge who went on that chase, but I can see where your mind was going. I take it you did actually find the (intended) secret way in?

  21. #96
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Norway (currently Phoenix, AZ)
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    Ah, well you're the only one to my knowledge who went on that chase
    I assure you he wasn't the only one Although I think my chase wasn't as long. Wild gosling chase, maybe?

  22. #97
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    So that's a yes? :excited_face: Maybe you could enter the T1 20th Anniversary Contest?

    Ah, well you're the only one to my knowledge who went on that chase, but I can see where your mind was going. I take it you did actually find the (intended) secret way in?
    I just checked and it appears the deadline for that contest has passed but people are still working on it. What gives?

    And yes, I eventually found the secret way in, but after the conversation. The thing is I wasn't looking for one...

  23. #98
    Member
    Registered: May 2017
    Location: USA
    There's a new contest that just opened up. Deadline is next November---plenty of time to dust off your DromEd

  24. #99
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Quote Originally Posted by trefoilknot View Post
    There's a new contest that just opened up. Deadline is next November---plenty of time to dust off your DromEd
    My bad! I didn't notice the deadline year is 2018.

    I have not done any T1 missions (unless you count this, which even I had forgotten about: http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133884 ). Could be interesting.

  25. #100
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    I know of nearly a dozen people already working on missions, you must join us Ali! You have a whole year too.

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