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Thread: Improving some low-quality original objects?

  1. #926
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    finally some answers, i will try to not to go beyond 2048x2048 resolution. Thank you both .

  2. #927
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2011
    Location: Ferrol - Spain
    There have been some recent fan missions with weird texture resolutions (paintings mainly) like 635x263 or something. But nobody said a word about that and I never had a problem for that reason. 18 months ago I said I had a texture converted to 1280x960 and some people here called that heresy and that I should be sent to Cragscleft.
    But nobody said a word of complaint when two or three recent missions came with dozens of that weird resolutions.
    I think modern hardware/sotware is safe in that sense.
    I've just converted a texture (ripoff5) to 277x561 and nothing went wrong.
    Windows 7 Ultimate X64 with Radeon 7870 2GB.

  3. #928
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2007
    Location: LosAngeles: Between Amusements
    Some graphics cards may support non-powers of two texture resolutions, but NewDark does not. So such missions will crash and burn for any players whose cards don't support those textures and may unexpectedly fail even for those whose cards do support them.

    From the NewDark modders_notes.txt:

    Texture size limitations have NOT changed, they have to be power-of-two (POT) sized, i.e. 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32,
    64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, 2048, 4096.

  4. #929
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Ireland
    I don't think that's a NewDark limitation, textures always have to be power of 2 in all games.
    Some cards will cope, others will not. Just because it works on yours doesn't mean that someone else won't randomly crash and not know why.

  5. #930
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    Quote Originally Posted by bassoferrol View Post
    18 months ago I said I had a texture converted to 1280x960 and some people here called that heresy and that I should be sent to Cragscleft.
    But nobody said a word of complaint when two or three recent missions came with dozens of that weird resolutions.
    In your case, you brought it to our attention, and so we offered advice. Had the authors of those missions done the same, we'd have given them the same advice. I rarely play other missions, let alone dig through their resources looking at texture resolutions. That's probably why nobody here said anything about those other missions - we didn't know.

  6. #931
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2006
    Location: On the tip of your tongue.
    I accidentally had some object textures in Death's Turbid Veil that weren't power of 2, and it did cause problems for some people as I recall.

  7. #932
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    I'd use PNG over TGA, too.
    A word of caution here. I still use Paint Shop Pro for most of my graphics work, and I've found that when you save a PNG with alpha transparency, it changes all full transparent pixels to black. If the image has light pixels on the edges of transparent regions, this results in a visible thin black border in-game. So for me at least, TGA still has a use in some situations.

  8. #933
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    I didn't realize that about PSP - good to know, thanks.

  9. #934
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by bassoferrol View Post
    There have been some recent fan missions with weird texture resolutions (paintings mainly) like 635x263 or something. But nobody said a word about that and I never had a problem for that reason. 18 months ago I said I had a texture converted to 1280x960 and some people here called that heresy and that I should be sent to Cragscleft.
    pretty sure non-pot textures would make it into the top ten of Dromed DON'Ts. NewDark will scream bloody murder in the console if it detects them, and I'd say it has a good reason for doing that. so just like with unsupported audio formats - don't use them, even though things may appear to work for some people, it's a sureproof way to pain and suffering.

    Cragscleft is too good for non-pot people.

  10. #935
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2011
    Location: Ferrol - Spain
    Well, I must confess that I have only used non power of two textures in paintings.
    I'm aware of the problems that could arise if I don't stick to the rules though.

  11. #936
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2012
    Location: Moscow, Russia
    I'm preparing a small set of new-old OM objects. I tried to make several models with joints, but unfortunately Blender (or nemyax's plugin) works with other joints values, so if I load this model of the Coil02 in OM, the arrow will be inactive (it needs joint 2, OM has the value 1).


    What about dml? I have a poor understanding, how it works, but as far as I understand, can I change the properties of objects there without touching the mission files? I do not really want to learn A8 for this purpose.

    I also made a new model of ship's wheel, and it will not work either. And I'm ready to do any others, including new door handles, it remains only to understand how to make it work with a less of efforts.


    It's good that the drill does not have a joint:




    But back to the Coil02. I added materials to the textures of steel and glass with the imitation of the specular map. At the coil on the left I added dirt to the glass: I think I will upload this model to the Repository for FMs. And the version with a clean glass can be added to the EP.


  12. #937
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Formby, NW England
    Have you tried Dark Exporter?
    https://sourceforge.net/projects/darkexporter/

    I've never had problems with joint numbers, and I use the above addon.

    PS Nice looking objects.

  13. #938
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2007
    Location: LosAngeles: Between Amusements
    See: Jointed Objects: a new tutorial

    For the ship's wheel, I suggest you take a look at real ship's wheels. Google "ship's wheel" and you'll find lots of them. Notice how the wheel part is not a torus (donut shape) but instead a flat cylindrical section. Also pay attention to the wood grain. It shouldn't be a uniform plastic looking brown. You have plenty of polys to make a good looking one which is properly textured. If you are going to make a new model, do it right.








  14. #939
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2012
    Location: Gèrmany
    First hank you a lot, these look nice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Tear View Post
    I'm preparing a small set of new-old OM objects. I tried to make several models with joints, but unfortunately Blender (or nemyax's plugin) works with other joints values, so if I load this model of the Coil02 in OM, the arrow will be inactive (it needs joint 2, OM has the value 1).

    What about dml? I have a poor understanding, how it works, but as far as I understand, can I change the properties of objects there without touching the mission files?
    Did you import the original with nemyax' plugin? the name of the sub objects might give you a clue.
    Sorry but I also have to ask the dumb question you are aware that @s00 is joint 1. So 01 would be Joint 2.

    ---
    If everything is not gonna work .dml really is a nice not permanent patch.

    Easiest way make the Archetype so that it works and then Hierarchy->Export->Single as dml.
    Then only // Tweq->Joints and if you changed it //Tweq->JointsState is important and you can delete the rest of the file.

    BUT I think there is a problem if //Tweq->JointsState got modified, as this property is on the concrete Archetypes as well you would need to specifically patch them individually for every mission if I'm right.
    ---

    And don't forget the shading properties I realized I forgot them to many times.

  15. #940
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2007
    Location: LosAngeles: Between Amusements
    Are you sure the pointer on the dial is a jointed sub object? Most likely it is an animated texture instead.

    Edit: You are right, it is a sub object: @s00ff. The axle is @x00aa6700, and the base object for the coil is aa. Did you try using those names?
    Last edited by LarryG; 16th Dec 2017 at 19:43.

  16. #941
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2012
    Location: Moscow, Russia
    Quote Originally Posted by R Soul View Post
    Have you tried Dark Exporter?
    https://sourceforge.net/projects/darkexporter/
    I've never had problems with joint numbers, and I use the above addon.
    That's what I'm talking about. Apparently, you used it before the plugin was changed.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarryG View Post
    I do not know much about A8. I need a tutorial on how to separate one mesh from another and how to create an axele.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarryG View Post
    Are you sure the pointer on the dial is a jointed sub object? Most likely it is an animated texture instead.

    Edit: You are right, it is a sub object: @s00ff. The axle is @x00aa6700, and the base object for the coil is aa. Did you try using those names?
    Blender ignores these things. Blender does not need an axele-object, it simply uses local coordinates. I just use the alphabetical order for objects (Cube01, Cube02, etc) to get the appropriate joints in Thief (from 2 to 6, and excluding 1)
    But yes, I entered such names earlier for verification. As I said, the whole thing is in the new version of the plugin, which changes the value of the joint from 1 to 2. In the old version everything worked (I have my first and last object - the door that works as it should if you create an OM door and assign it a new model), then the script broke (I broke it ), nemyax has repaired it, but this thing has deteriorated.

    As for the texture of the wheel, now it does not matter, in any case it is impossible to use this object in OM.

  17. #942
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Formby, NW England
    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Tear View Post
    That's what I'm talking about. Apparently, you used it before the plugin was changed.
    You said you use neymax's plugin. The one I linked to is by Elendir. The latter uses the original N3ds2e and BSP to create the bin files, whereas neymax's one seems to create the bin file directly.

  18. #943
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2013
    Soul_Tear
    Try renaming the child objects so that they are in reverse alphabetical order. This might put the "joints" right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Tear View Post
    Blender ignores these things.
    The naming conventions don't matter, but the alphabetical order of the names does. It affects how Blender lists child objects when you ask it.
    Last edited by nemyax; 19th Dec 2017 at 15:24.

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