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Thread: CoSaS: Mid 2006 Press Release (Updated!)

  1. #26
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    Sly's voice talents are amazing and go far beyond our beloved master thief.
    WHEN Polygon and I finish Death's Cold Embrace, you'll finally get to hear what's IMO his best performance to date.

  2. #27
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2005
    I couldn't believe that all of the voicework from Requiem for a Thief was Sly's. That's extremely impressive, and also shows how versatile he is.

  3. #28
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    Yep, and he was gracious enough to turn that around in just a few days too.

  4. #29
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    I think that Sly could potentially be featured in every cosas mission as a different character and no-one would know the difference.

    I'd say the chances of Garrett even being mentioned in cosas are about 0. It's not that we don't like Garrett, it's more like we'd like to think that the Thief World is big enough so that a few monumental events can take place without Garrett being involved. We make some acknowledgements to place cosas within the time line created by the Thief trilogy (like the mention of Truart in GatI), but it is otherwise completely separate.

    ALSO, we're still looking for one more volenteer for task 2 featured here, http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107445 ... so if anyone wants to step up, even if you don't think your scripting skills are up to it, you can always learn! Yametha, Anarchic Fox, and I are started cosas knowing NOTHING about Dromed, so don't be afraid to try something above your head.

  5. #30
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2005
    That is a very good idea. In the new Star Wars they reused a lot of the old characters which made the universe feel condensed. It would give the player the feeling that there aren't that many important people in the city, which is the exact opposite of what this campaign is trying to say (in my opinion). As such, by introducing many new characters (even for small roles) it makes the city feel vast and, more importantly, fresh to the player.

  6. #31
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    Thanks Taffer.

    One thing we wanted to do in GatI was have NPCs rather than just AI, and we take that up ten knotches in MX. Huge cast of characters. One thing our sound engineer is pushing in the design is to create as much subtle background for as many of our minor characters as he can.

  7. #32
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Louisiana
    Thank you for the update! It's always nice to hear how it's going.

    I signed up for the cheerleader squad months and months ago, now I get a chance to shake my pom-poms again!

    *shakes pom-poms and cheers*

    Everything sounds wonderful and I am very very eager for the day I get to enjoy, marvel, and gawk at all your hard work. Thank you all for the time, the dedication, and the love you've put into this. I appreciate it now and will even more so when I can finally enjoy it!


    ~Shaz

  8. #33
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2005
    Location: Kouvola, Finland
    I trust ghosting this mission is a viable option?

  9. #34
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    Of course.

  10. #35
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2005
    Location: Kouvola, Finland
    Thanks a lot, it's the only way I can still find any kind of challenge.

  11. #36
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    I feel a monologe coming along... I don't allow myself to talk about MX much, so maybe this time I should given in.

    I hope that MX will be gleeful for ghosters and other such power-gamers. If you remember in GatI there were more than a half dozen discrete ways into the building (and a few not so discrete ones). It wasn't about getting in and getting past the guards, it was about darting in and out many times in many different ways to bypass the guards completely. While I can't vouch for the community's likes or dislikes for this concept, I personally find it much more preferable to more static approaches.

    (And I encourage anyone who has an opinion on the subject to speak up about it.)

    Mission X uses the same concept but in a much different way. (You can't use the same trick twice... not in a row anyway... not usually... well you shouldn't...) Sure, you're still given multiple ways into The Ivory Rose, but the focus on the mission is never really on breaking into the building at all, it's about what happens once you are in. The IR is huge, (makes Anglewatch into a shack, really) so it becomes all about finding ways to move from one floor to another. Sure, you can stick to the hallways and the stair towers, but that's where all the patrols and locked doors are.

    Now, let me be frank; there's alot of tile... alot of tile. Maybe too much tile. We'll have to see. But seriously, the wide open marble clad brightly lit halls filled with the sounds of echoing patrol footfalls is part of the nerve-wracking pandemonium of it all, isn't it?

    It becomes not about finding a way through, it becomes finding a way around. (Of course if you really want to go straight through, good luck...)

    Similarly, moving from floor to floor. Sure, you can take the stair tower, but wouldn't you rather rope-arrow your way from the first floor straight up to the third, placing yourself discerely behind the 'loot' side of a locked door? Of course you would.

    So that's what I'm saying. I'm not saying that this is a bold brave new way of doing things, never before seen! ... *cough* ... I'm saying that this is what you'll be able to expect. The irony is that most of the prettiest parts of the place are the places you'll want to spend the least time in.

    This is the bold brave new part, never before seen. If I may quote...

    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue
    From what I hear, Mission X has really gone beyond the call of duty.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros
    You have NO idea how much so. It's going to really knock the socks off of everyone. I don't see any other mission, now or in the future, ever surpassing it in this respect.
    Of course this isn't because LOL our toilets flush SCRPTNG... (they don't, by the way...)

    GatI and MX are in many ways sister-missions. They're both experiments in breaking the mold for Thief missions, doing things unexpected and unique, and generally trying to deliver an experience worthy of a new Thief game over just another FM (though there's nothing ever wrong with just another FM...)

    In GatI we brought in classic adventure style quest elements (sorely lacking from today's adventure games I may add) into play with mixed (though I think mostly) success. MX is another experiment in adding something new and different to a Thief mission, though I am not ready yet to say what that is. We do have the adventure game elements ala GatI in play, though those are all relegated to optional and bonus objectives and are hopefully an improvement over what we had in GatI (though I am not sure you can compare the two sets, as MX's puzzle quests are very different...)

    What I can say is that MX has a cast of seven important characters in addition to Dante, and these are not characters that you meet along the way and then move on from. Who they are and what they're up to has a constant play on what's going on in the building, far above and beyond what the cast of merry misfits from GatI had to offer.

  12. #37
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2001
    Location: 210x200x64
    Will there be pickles? Arrrrrrrrr........ Must have pickles! Arrrrrrr...

  13. #38
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    Everything you say D.N. gives me warm-fuzzies.

    I actually really liked the "adventure" aspects of GatI ... that was the most innovative part of it IMO, and I've actually wanted FMs to start going in that direction more. Ominous Bequest & Rowena's Curse do it to some extent, but GatI was the one that made it really explicit part of gameplay in the right way, especially pushing unconventional object use and "adventure" style gameplay progression. I think the "mixed success" of it wasn't the idea itself, which has awesome potential, but maybe how it was plotted, or limited in that the game "world" was really one hotel, while adv gaming seems to work best when very different parts of a world interact, so e.g. you can take an object from one part of the world to use it in a creative way in a very different part. But as for how it was implemented I thought GatI was right on track, and it really brought me back to a much-loved period in gaming for me. I myself have been tossing around the idea of translating some classic IF into Thief as a way to build off already really well (logically) designed adventure quests and worlds into FM'dom, just to push the envelope on this. All of this is a total aside, though. Although it's good that aspects of it are still in MX.

    The part in the above post that is most intriguing to me now is the bigger role the NPCs have. A couple of FMs have toyed with in-game NPCs -- Calendra's, Embracing the Enemy/Burrick Head Inn, Gaetane's FMs, and of course Dante's friend in GatI. But they've always been sort of limited in how much they are actually a part of gameplay. It sounds like here their scope is much greater here (for one thing, the number of NPCs you have going almost invokes comparisons to Deus Ex) and their integration into gameplay ... It all sounds very exciting.

    As always, can't wait.

  14. #39
    Member
    Registered: May 2003
    Location: Tannar Appreciation Society HQ
    Eeeeek, I've just realised that despite my modest collection of ~375 missions, I haven't got GatI yet!! I think I will save it before the new mission comes out though. Can't wait

  15. #40
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    I think the problem with what we did in GatI is that people just don't expect it. In yea olde Sierra/Lucasarts games of yore, give the player a problem involving metal objects, and a nearby friendly blacksmith, and they'll be able to figure it out pretty quickly what to do. In a Thief mission, which isn't about manipulating the states of objects nor friendly blacksmiths, many players wouldn't put the two together.

    We want to go on using these types of puzzles in future missions, but hopefully in ways less alien to the setting or genre. Now, on the plus side, we're all about optional and bonus objectives here, and fully intent to try to provide some interesting and very challenging unorthodox quests involving real thought and consideration.

    As far as number of NPCs go... GatI had... what? 9? Seven is actually cutting back! But no, the NPCs in MX won't be anything like the NPCs from GatI.

    And there -will- be pickles.

  16. #41
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Sunny Finland
    Interaction is good, but you may lose some of the focus that Thief is praised for. Avoiding some guard repeatedly as I'm trying to work out this or that puzzle is sometimes too much for me. Also, there's a very thin line between a puzzle and a chore. I have no complaints about GatI in this respect, though. But, it's the infamous balancing act.

  17. #42
    Member
    Registered: Feb 1999
    Location: Yes
    I'm very excited about this. All I can think right now is:

    Were talking Thief2, right? Dromed?

    Wow. Can't wait to see this! Thanks too all who are sticking with this.

  18. #43
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2003
    Location: The Land of Beer and Cheese
    I've been off-line for a couple of weeks and come back to all sorts of great news!

    Thanks CoSaS Team for the update......looking forward to the fruits of all your labors!

  19. #44
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Dark corner
    I'm with BikerDude and the goose pimples!

    Man, this entire thread is just one big tease (in a good way). Warm and fuzzy doesn't cut it; I am down right antsy to see MX! I'm on the edge of my seat already and I think any more updates will push me over.

    The stuff Digi and the team are talking about with shaking up the FM world with MX sounds fantastic. Now, I tip my hat to anyone that takes the time to create a FM. However, I get bored with the "let's pay the rent" and box canyons mission. Immerse me in the plot. Make me work for my loot. I want to find away around that vast expanse of tile floor.

    Keep up the great work!

    I guess I have to join the cheerleading squad since I can't do a damn thing in Dromed. I'll bring homemade baked goods, if it helps.

    (Sorry, for my over-enthusiasm, the job I took 6 months ago doesn't let me out of my cage much.)

  20. #45
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    What's giving me good pimples is how well our new scripting help team is working out. Looks like we're going to be good on our milestone!

  21. #46
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Australia
    It looks like we'll be more than good, actually

  22. #47
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: cesspool
    Well, I actually think that it's a honorary debt of any talented DromEder to put work on his/her own FM by for some time and help to release this campaign.

    Really, come on guys. Base of the CoSaS team can't work on the missions as intensively as before becuase of various objective reasons, but there are more then enough talented people on the scene to help them and accelerate development. Many beautiful and professionally looking individual T2FMs with great architecture and scripting has been released recently, their authors could significantly speed up the process. Don't be so selfish! (I just have no talent in this area, no needed knowledges hehe)

    If would be nice if at least 3 missions of the project were released in the end. Of course I understand why it's going so long, the campaign aims for professional quality. And it's doing it very special to the community. It will be a real shame if we won't see Purah's mission made for this campaign.
    So, Ramirez's old fat Burrick, DrK, Troutpack, Sterlino and many many others - sign up soon!

  23. #48
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    I believe the team already has new scripters working on the remaining pieces, and hopefully an Alpha test isn't too far away now.

  24. #49
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: cesspool
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros
    I believe the team already has new scripters working on the remaining pieces, and hopefully an Alpha test isn't too far away now.

    But additional people simultaneously working on other(next) missions certainly would help to make the release of the whole campaign closer.

  25. #50
    The Architect
    Registered: Dec 1998
    Location: Lyon
    Heck, if a level designer wants to get to work on our mission 4 (yes 4... mission 3's architecture is done) ...

    Maybe I should start over...

    If a talented and ambitious dromeder wishes to complete and polish, in stone and timber, our fourth mission, using the designs of and under the tutelage of a degree seeking student of architecture, with a passion for quality detail and accuracy... ahem...

    Honestly, passion and commitment mean more than skill for a project like this. Most team members come in with enthusiasm and gain the skill as they go. A good thing about anyone who would want to work on mission 4 is that the framework is mostly there, it'd just be a matter of details.

    Which is where the devil is, naturally... or God, if you ask Mies.

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