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Thread: Built-in FM loader in Thief version 1.19 and beyond

  1. #26
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Germany
    Is it possible to let the FMSelector show the FM Names instead of the archive names ?

  2. #27
    Southquarter.com/fms
    Registered: Apr 2000
    Location: The Akkala Highlands
    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue View Post
    I'm having two issues with it.
    1) It is not recognizing sub-folders in my main FMs folder. If I click a folder with subfolders, it treats it as if it's an FM itself (what it looks like, e.g., if you click "info files" it shows files from multiple FMs in there), and then it just starts the vanilla game.
    2) If I drop a .zip file in the top folder, even if I click refresh, it's still invisible in the FM Selector.

    The only way I've gotten it to run an FM is if I manually unzip the .zip in the top FMs folder myself. Then it can see that and I can play it from there when I click on its folder.
    Hmm, some of this is confusing, but it sounds like you've got your FM folder locations mixed up. The /fm directory within your Thief installation directory is where FM Selector will extract your FMs, but you shouldn't put the zip files here yourself. In fact, the directions say not to. Your FM zip files should go in a completely different location, and then that location should be specified within FM Selector under the gear icon.

    By example, for testing, I put my FMs (the zip files) into: j:/T2 FMs. When I install an FM through FM Selector, it extracts all the files for me into C:\games\T2\fms. It creates a new directory for each FM, so for instance if I installed Black Frog, all of the unzipped files for that mission would be in C:\games\T2\fms\TheBlackFrog\.

    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue View Post
    I also had a question, where do the saves go? Would it possible to migrate my old saves into a new folder so I could still use them with FMSelector?
    If you look in the fms directory under your Thief installation (c:\games\T2\fms in my example above) there should be a directory below that for each FM, and within that directory, a "saves" directory. Again, using the above example, it would be something like C:\Games\T2\fms\TheBlackFrog\saves\.

    In other news -

    I also updated the original post with the info on the 64 bit version of libmp3lame. Hoping to experiment a bit this weekend with T1, Thief Gold, and T2X, I'll always update the original post with any updated instructions. Also want to play around with using FM Selector while also using other FM loaders like Darkloader and Garrettloader.
    Last edited by Brethren; 28th Sep 2012 at 11:20.

  3. #28
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006

    Language problem

    While testing 1.19 I tried the German only TG mission Das dunkle Geheimnis1.
    Unless I cut The files in the folders

    "D:\ThiefG\FMs\Das_dunkle_Geheimnis1\intrface\miss20\german"
    "D:\ThiefG\FMs\Das_dunkle_Geheimnis1\books\german"

    and paste them respectively to

    "D:\ThiefG\FMs\Das_dunkle_Geheimnis1\intrface\miss20"
    "D:\ThiefG\FMs\Das_dunkle_Geheimnis1\books"

    books and mission goals were empty.

    I'm using the English version of TG.

    The mission may have been translated into English but I've got the German only version.

  4. #29
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    I'm just now starting to look at this new FM loader. It's nice and compact, although I still don't know how to fully set it up.

    UPDATE: Alright so I figured it out. Now my question is, after I've loaded a mission up w/ FMSel, can I delete the original zip?
    Last edited by Albert; 29th Sep 2012 at 00:17.

  5. #30
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    Only if you never plan to uninstall it, I guess.

  6. #31
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    Well alright then, that isn't so bad. This files are readily available anyways.

    I'm ready to accept FMSel as my Savior!

    Although I'm wondering, is start FM supposed to launch the game straight into a mission? Because it only seems to do the same thing as play FM, for me.
    Last edited by Albert; 29th Sep 2012 at 00:29.

  7. #32
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    I must say, from my use of it so far, FMSel isn't perfect, but like Yandros has said: If someone knows how to work w/ the code, I can see it becoming as feature-heavy as Darkloader, and even TFMM which had some great ideas but was bogged down by it copying all the resources over for every FM. Which takes up memory a lot faster, obviously. With FMSel, although uncompressed files do eventually take up space, the fact is that it has more pros than cons in the long-run. Obviously, all it needs now is more customization in the interface -- Ala Foobar2000 or something like that. Things like a manual tab, a support for other compression formats (Unless it already has this?), and the ability to distinguish some FMs from others (T1/TG/T2/SS2, as I personally like to keep all those in the same download file).

    I think the theme customization is a positive step, there.

  8. #33
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Germany
    @cattamer

    I have this problem on Fms with only english language with this installer. I have the german version of thief. But fibanocci found out what to do. We need to change a line in the darkinst.cfg
    language german is my entry in the file and i must change to this language german+english
    Now FMs with english language only text and goals works fine

  9. #34
    Sneaky Upgrader
    Registered: May 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Albert View Post
    I can see it becoming as feature-heavy as Darkloader, and even TFMM which had some great ideas but was bogged down by it copying all the resources over for every FM.
    TFMM and ModernLoader don't copy the files, they link them. So very little extra space is needed.

    I'll be having a look at the FMSel code to see if I can make it work with T3 (to go together with my patch). Having a common interface for all 3 games would be good.
    Widescreen and tweaks patches: The Sneaky Upgrade for Thief 3, the Visible Upgrade for Deus Ex 2

  10. #35
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Quote Originally Posted by Firehawk View Post
    @cattamer

    I have this problem on Fms with only english language with this installer. I have the german version of thief. But fibanocci found out what to do. We need to change a line in the darkinst.cfg
    language german is my entry in the file and i must change to this language german+english
    Now FMs with english language only text and goals works fine
    I've just have posted the mentioned problem as information on the behavior of the new mission loader, considering that most of the people here use the English version of the game and that dark loader and possibly garrett loader which I never used for TG/T2, automatically fix this while loading any non English mission.

    As most of the missions are already in English, users of the English version of the games won't run in any language problems unless English is missing. But there are missions in many different languages out there that miss English -not only German but French, Polish, Japanese just a few to mention.

    The solution that you use is not quite right in this case in that it adds English to the game. Here we have to add any possible language to English version. Dark Loader copes with the problem by moving the non-english language files to the higher directory. Your problem's solution is to force the use of the files that are already in a higher directory.

  11. #36
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Quote Originally Posted by snobel View Post
    TFMM and ModernLoader don't copy the files, they link them. So very little extra space is needed.
    The used space is not much more than ModernLoader. This also copies only the necessary files but only to a subfolder in the game directory. Used space is roughly the unzipped size as
    ModernLoader uses and here no hardlinking is necessary. (btw. I use ML)

  12. #37
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    Thanks Brethren, yes I used the same folder for the zips & installs so that must be it.

    I can see the advantage that it basically just unzips the contents into the FM folder and it can just play from those assets there, right? That's an improvement over the old loaders... Don't have to worry about "uninstalling" or having loose assets in your T2 folder. Does the FM Selector uninstall too? Can you just delete the folder from the FMs folder? (I'd imagine yes to that.)

  13. #38
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    Quote Originally Posted by snobel View Post
    TFMM and ModernLoader don't copy the files, they link them. So very little extra space is needed.
    Well I can't speak for Modernloader (I could never get it running on any system), but I read the system files for TFMM and it indeed copies files over. Now I dunno if this was a bug or how my file system reads the programs links, but it definitely was taking up more hard drive space per small FM.

    Quote Originally Posted by snobel View Post
    I'll be having a look at the FMSel code to see if I can make it work with T3 (to go together with my patch). Having a common interface for all 3 games would be good.
    Well it was designed for only New Dark engine in mind, and I don't think you can load it by itself. Besides, I think T1/T2/SS2 loaders should be kept separate from T3, from now on. Just my opinion.

    I mean, I'm sure you could get it to work, but I don't see why you should. There's more FM makers for the dark engine games anyways, besides SS2. Thief 3 is a completely different engine with a different group of followers. Or FM makers rather, of which there aren't many for T3.

  14. #39
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    Anyways, I decided I'd put up an image of FMSel, seeing as there really isn't one out there, and I wanted to show off a part of Thief running successfully in Linux (It all runs well. Well enough that an in-game screenshot just seems redundant).

    So here you all go:



    Marvel in it's beauty.

  15. #40
    Sneaky Upgrader
    Registered: May 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Albert View Post
    I read the system files for TFMM and it indeed copies files over. Now I dunno if this was a bug or how my file system reads the programs links, but it definitely was taking up more hard drive space per small FM.
    Files that can get written to by the game are copied, but the vast majority are linked. IIRC there was talk of a bug in Windows, where the size of a linked file would be added to a total for each link - maybe that's what you've seen?

    Well it was designed for only New Dark engine in mind, and I don't think you can load it by itself.
    That's why I wrote "to go with my patch". For a long time I've been playing FMs on linux using a union mount to put an FM folder on top of the game folder - I'm sure you're familiar with the concept? Working on the next version of my T3 patch I realized that I could achieve something like it by patching the game to load files from two directory trees. It's a very similar mechanism to what the 1.19 patch is doing, so I think FMSel will fit nicely into my plans.

    There's more FM makers for the dark engine games anyways, besides SS2. Thief 3 is a completely different engine with a different group of followers. Or FM makers rather, of which there aren't many for T3.
    There aren't many FMs for T3, but some of them are excellent. I'm quite agnostic myself, I just want to help keep all the FMs playable.
    Widescreen and tweaks patches: The Sneaky Upgrade for Thief 3, the Visible Upgrade for Deus Ex 2

  16. #41
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    Well alright then, I won't tell you what to do. I'm thinking FMSel is pretty good for it. You'll just have to make it load up with T3 too though, I imagine.

    And I won't lie; I've always been a trial by fire sort. Linux still mystifies me in so many ways. But I keep at it, learning all sorts of system commands in the process. But now that I know that Thief 2's early problems were Thief 2 itself, I'm not so scared anymore.
    Last edited by Albert; 30th Sep 2012 at 15:03.

  17. #42
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Is there a way to make FM Selector scan Darkloader.ini and set the "Completed" flag, matching on file names? If not I'll write a Python script to do it. Can't be arsed to do it manually!

  18. #43
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2002
    Location: thief.wikia.com
    So I was going to give my 2 cents about a couple things this loader didn't do... but then I found and read the manual that came with it.

    FMSel.pdf from the new_dark.zip /doc folder, also fmsel.odg from the contrib_src.zip /fmsel_src folder, if you haven't seen them.


    Anyway, I though that I would have to go to the install folder and delete used FM folders after I was done with them, but you can actually right-click on the FM and there is an Uninstall option, which allows you to delete the folder as well as back up save games and screenshots.

    There is also a tagging system and other options in the right-click menu.


    If anyone is looking into adding options to this loader, I would suggest adding:
    *a column for archive directory location, called "path" in darkloader
    *fixing column widths, name and rating should have a separator, and all separators should be movable.
    *some kind of converter to transfer the darkloader ini info to the new ini file

  19. #44
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2009
    Location: Damp cavern
    Alright, I've discovered one thing that kinda sours FMSel a little. It loads FMs just fine from their directories, but it won't load scripts that come with some/all FMs (I've only tried Sensut's Bathory campaign thus far, which uses 3-4 scripts). A bit of an annoying thing, as it means I have to hunt these scripts down yet again and dump them into the main directory for Thief 2.

    Still, I doubt the creator had taken the scripts into consideration. It's definitely the most underdeveloped part of this otherwise magnificent patch.

  20. #45
    Member
    Registered: May 2005
    Unfortunately, it is yet. Here is the solution.

  21. #46
    New Member
    Registered: Oct 2006
    Interesting,maybe it could explain the problems i noticed in cosas2 (the drop key objective not being checked despite being achieved and acknoweldged ingame and the game not ending when you go to the exit) and rose cottagev2 (the game not ending when you go to the exit).
    And some AI odd behaviour i noticed in both missions (an AI that is alerted and investigating , then after a while go into a "calm" behaviour, i save then load and suddenly the AI is alerted and investigative again).

  22. #47
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: Tailem Bend, South Australia

    FMSel won't start

    Did a fresh Thief 2 install.
    Copied DromEd files.
    Patched game to 1.18.
    Copied DromEd 1.18.
    Installed T2 1.19 as per instructions, including DromEd.

    Started and setup the game to my preferences. Was able to select 1440 X 900 X 32 so all is working.

    I saw in the forums that the scripts weren't included, so I installed these as well.

    Printed FMSel instructions.
    Removed the semi colon ";" from appropiate settings (as listed below) and saved.

    fm
    fm_path D:\Fan Missions\Thief 2 (Where my Fan Missions are stored)
    fm_selector fmsel.dll

    When I start the game there is no selection item for the FM Selector.

    What have I missed?


    Solved
    Somehow a couple of the files in the Contrib zip file were corrupted sometime after I installed them. This stops the Intro movie working (either from initial start or being called from the main menu) and the FMSel from running. Did a full re-installation again as listed above and all is ok.
    Last edited by rastas; 6th Oct 2012 at 02:02.

  23. #48
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Texas
    I finaly got around to upgrading to 1.19 and setting up the new fan mission loader. Thanks for all your help. That first post made everything easy as pie! Much appreciated! I'm even thinking of upgrading to the new dromed to see if I can learn it!

  24. #49
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2002
    Location: Central Texas
    Ok, working with Snobel (Thief 3 Sneaky Upgrade creator,) a couple of changes have been added to FMSel. The new dll file and full source are available here FMSel.zip I have no idea about the file server I'm using (just did a google search for file hosting and picked one that didn't cause a bunch of pop-ups when I went there. So if someone wants to mirror it, please do so

    The changes:
    First Snobel put in some changes I don't know the details too that will make it work with the next version of Sneaky Upgrade currently being tested. He also helped by checking over my code and cleaning it up for me (I'm not very good at programming.)

    Second, I added in a method to Clean the Database of bad entries. The original had an advanced option (hold CTRL down while right clicking on an entry or left clicking on the gear icon,) that would allow you to delete an entry in the database. The problem with what was included is that if you had multiple entries that needed removing it could get tedious. Now, if you hold CTRL and left click on the gear icon (settings,) there is an entry "Clean DB" that will scan the entire DB and remove all entries that do not have an archive or an install. May not really be needed but I like it. If you remove a batch of FMs from the archived directory and delete all the install folders, you can just use that to clear them all out of the DB without having to lose any of your other DB info (missions completed, ratings, etc...)

    Finally, I added in an option that will allow the sorting process to ignore leading articles in the mission names (The, An, A) while sorting. In most cases when something is alphabatized (sp?) those are ignored (Books, Music, etc...) The option defaults to off, though, so if you don't want to use it, you don't have to do anything. If you do, just click on the gear icon (settings,) and click the little check box. Currently it only works with english, as that is the only language I know. I have considered trying to come up with localization code that would change what is looked for depending on the language set by the host sytem. The problem is, I don't know if anyone really wants or needs it and I don't know what words would be skipped in other languages.

    The final change I thought about, but haven't done anything with, mainly because I don't particularly want it, is to have the displayed name actually move the leading articles to the end like other programs did. It would be another on/off option, and I really would only do it if a lot of people really wanted it.

  25. #50
    Clearinghouse
    Registered: Aug 2002
    Location: Siberia, Russia
    Quote Originally Posted by Pheonix View Post
    Ok, working with Snobel (Thief 3 Sneaky Upgrade creator,) a couple of changes have been added to FMSel. The new dll file and full source are available here FMSel.zip I have no idea about the file server I'm using (just did a google search for file hosting and picked one that didn't cause a bunch of pop-ups when I went there. So if someone wants to mirror it, please do so
    Mirror: FMSel.zip

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