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Thread: Help a noob.

  1. #76
    Think of all the corpses full of souls and useful items, scattered around Lordran. Do you really think you are the Chosen Undead?

  2. #77
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    Yep.
    I'm speshul.

    Cause those corpses with loot are dead. Not alive. Not undead. Not hollow. Really dead.
    And I am alive.

    (Well, I am a little acursed. That's all.
    Curses are just flesh-wounds. I'm invincible ! Gryz always triumphs. I'll bite their legs off !)

    To be honest, I have no clue what I'm doing in this game. I'm paying attention to all the dialogue of the NPCs. And I read wiki-pages. Still no clue. I'm on my way to kill some spider-chick's mum now. No idea why. But a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do.

  3. #78
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Poland
    I kind of think that the whole chosen bit is a sham, and it's just whoever gets the job done works.

  4. #79
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    That's pretty much the way I've read it. The Chosen Undead isn't some special person, born on a certain day, as foretold by prophecy. It's whoever proves themselves strong enough, dedicated enough, and crazy enough to rise to the call.

    ...and fulfill their purpose to serve as kindling, in order to stoke a fire for another thousand years.

  5. #80
    Actually, the more poor chaps willing to answer that call, the better, at least for Gwyn and his followers. So be a good boy and use as many souls and humanity in these bonfires as you can, will you

    Also, the storyline of Witch of Izalith is one of the most tragic ones, it's kinda rewarding to pay attention to this one.

  6. #81
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    The only requirement for a Chosen Undead is having been chosen. Chosen by whom and for what purpose are separate questions.

  7. #82
    It's even less. Actually, I think you could compare it to the MGS 2 storyline, in a way. There is a certain program, set of tests. If you fail, your adventure will end, and it will always be some other guy to get your souls/equipment, and become more powerful. Maybe he/she gets further, maybe not. It doesn't matter that much. Maybe you'll return to the asylum as the demon pilgrim

    Neither you nor anyone else is special, and you can only choose a side to be a pawn of, in a game you only partly grasp. And even that game isn't really changing much in this dying world, only delaying or hastening the inevitable.

    ThatLinkingParkSongChorus.mp3

  8. #83
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    Serious question.
    My apologies in advance, for the long text. I hope the explanation makes my question a bit more clear to those of you who want to give a serious answer.

    Question: Will I ever find a weapon that is better than my Halberd+15 ?

    I started playing as a warrior. With a longsword and a shield. I think that was one of my mistakes during my few hours with DS2, that I tried playing without a shield. A shield makes life so much easier for a new player. Anyway, I liked my longsword. I especially liked the R2 attack, a strong thrust forward. It would give me slightly longer reach. And I wouldn't hit walls in narrow corridors. So I upgraded the Longsword to +5 when I got into the Undead Parish.

    Then I found the Halberd in the Undead Parish. I loved it. Huge reach. And the R1 attack is a simple thrust forward. I switched between Halberd and Longsword for a while. But very quickly I realized the Halberd was just much better. So I decided to switch to dexterity. I farmed a Balder Side Sword. Almost similar to the Longsword, but with dexterity properties. I got both the Halberd and the BSSword to +10. But the Halberd turned out to be so much more useful.

    I was a bit hesitant to do O&S, so I did other stuff first. I made myself Quelaag's Furysword+4. I went to New Londo Ruins, got the ember, and upgraded my Halberd to +14. Then I did the Stray Demon, which to my surprise gave me a Titanite Slab. So I got my Halberd to +15. I used the remaining 2 titanite chunks to upgrade my black leather chestpiece to +8 (the other 3 leather items are +6).

    The Halberd+15 is my favorite weapon, by far.
    The only time I don't like it, is when fighting some bosses (Stray Demon, Centipede Demon, etc) where I need to stay at the back of the boss, in close range. Locking onto the boss will get me killed. Not locking onto the boss will make my Halberd miss a lot. So I use the Furysword+4 during some boss-fights. Just wildly swinging the sword at the tail of those demons will make it hit. One of the few occasions that the Furysword is easier to use than the Halberd.

    I love the looks of the Balder Side Sword. Or any other shorter shorts (scimitars, etc). It makes my DS character look like my rogue in WoW. Female, undead, sword-wielding, in leather. The only difference is that I'm not dual-wielding swords in DS. I try to parry and backstab, because it looks better with a sword than with a Halberd. But for some reason, I get hurt a lot more when using a sword than when using the Halberd. So when things get tough, I keep going back to the Halberd.

    I tried a few more weapons. I just tried the Titanite Catch Pole. It's supposed to be good ? I upgraded it only to +1 (lack of Demon Titanite). I'm at the last Bonfire in Demon ruins. It takes me 4 hits to kill those little fire-spewing rolling skyrim-robots. With my Halberd, they go down in 1 hit. And I can hit them from further away. I think when I upgraded the Titanite Catch Pole to +5, I will still need 2 hits, maybe 3, to kill those robots. Noticeably less good than my Halberd.

    I also read about "split damage is not as good as all physical damage". Does that only apply to Dark Souls 2 ? Or DS1 too ? Is that the reason why the Halberd seems to good ? And the boss weapons so bad ?

    I'm thinking of making the Lifehunt Scythe. In combination with Bloodshield and anti-bleeding ring that might be a nice weapon. Although I am afraid it will be useless against thrash-mobs (bleed takes too long).

    Greatswords are mainly for strength users, it seems. And even if I start using one of the few dexterity great-swords, the swings seem so slow, I'll be open to take in damage much more than with my trusted Halberd. Those greatswords just don't seem attractive. I rather do 4 quick controlled pokes with my Halberd than 2 slow uncontrolled swings with a greatsword.

    I got the lightning-spear+0 (unupgraded) from Sen's Fortress. I used it against Smough. It seemed to do less damage against Smough (who's supposed to be vulnerable to lightning) than my Halberd+15 or even Furysword+4. I had the same experience with Nito. (Although Nito went down even quicker than O&S, so I'm not sure). And against other mobs, the lightning spear+0 seemed very very underwhelming.

    The other problem I have is upgrading. Even if other weapons are better than the Halberd, they might not be until they are fully upgraded. Lots of weapons take regular Titanite for upgrades. And it's a pain to farm chunks. (I have not dared to try farm those fuckers at the bottom of New Londo Ruins yet). And slabs might be impossible to get. My experience with the lightning spear+0 made me very hesitant to upgrade split-damage weapons. Lightning is supposed to be best, but upgrades require regular titanite. I could make a +15 fire weapon (I got lots of green and red titanite). But I don't know which fire-weapon. I got the Fury sword, which does fire. Make a Fire halberd ? That seems a bit redudant. Maybe a fire dex greatsword ?

    FYI, I am level 85 now. 40 Dex, 20 str, 41 endurance, currently building my vitality up. Keeping my weight under 25% at all times (20.1/81). Using Silver Knight Shield+5 (when I plan to block) or Grass Crest Shield+10 (when I plan to dodge) mostly. Black leather set (+6/+8/+6/+6). Mostly using the Wolf ring (poise) and either the Slumbering Dragoncrest Ring (thrash) or Ring of Steel Protection (bosses).

    So please make a suggestion.
    Is there any dexterity weapon in the game which is a better all-round weapon than the Halberd ?



    Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by Gryzemuis; 17th Apr 2016 at 08:32.

  9. #84


    I actually used Titanite Catch Pole for quite some time, but I have the INT + STR build, and that worked great for it.

  10. #85
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    Great Scythe. The moveset, reach and attack speed are killer.

  11. #86
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    Thanks Judith. I watched that video a week ago. I have a Great Scythe. And I tried it for a (short) while. The problem is that I can't really experience the Scythe, unless I upgrade it. And it costs regular Titanite to upgrade, which I don't have (chunks and slab). It's clear the maker of that video prefers the Great Scythe. But it's not so clear to me why other weapons are worse.

    I got a bunch of Green and Red Titanite that I want to use. But you can only make int or faith weapons (magic/enchanged/divine/occult) with those. Or fire. And I already have a fire-weapon (Quelaag's Furysword). Lightning weapons cost (again) regular titanite. I guess I'll have to start farming Dark Wraiths soon, at the bottom of NLR.

    I did realize one thing today. When you upgrade a weapon to +10 Fire, it loses all its scaling with Strength and Dex. That means a Dex user like myself can just as well upgrade a Strength weapon to +10 Fire as a Dex weapon to +10. E.g. I got myself a Server sword (scales B with Dex) and a Murakumo (scales A with Dex). If I want to experience a 2-hander sword, it would be smarter to turn the Server sword into a Fire sword (and lose the Dex scaling). And turn the Murakumo into a +15 Dex sword (once I get the materials). But in stead of a Server sword, I could just as well use a Strength sword, as the dex-scaling won't matter anymore. Maybe I should try a Strength greatsword that stuns enemies (like the Zweihander). All I need is the 24 Strength to one-hand such a sword.

    Anyway, what I really wanted to know was: once you get to the harder areas, will DS1 have better weapons ? In most RPGs the answer is yes. In DS1 that's not really the case. The upgrades seem to be much more important than the weapons themselves. I'm afraid I will stick with my Halberd for a while (until I got more chunks and slabs).
    Last edited by Gryzemuis; 17th Apr 2016 at 16:09.

  12. #87
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by Gryzemuis View Post
    The upgrades seem to be much more important than the weapons themselves.
    It isn't so much that the upgrades are more important than the weapon itself, so much that the raw stats aren't quite as important as they are in most other RPGs. You could use your starting weapon all the way until the end of the game if you wanted to, with the only advantage of later weapons being that they have a higher starting base to upgrade upon, or have more interesting move sets.

    Think of it like this: in most other RPGs, you can happen across some great legendary sword that's so, SO much more awesome than what you could hope to buy from a store. If you want to stay competitive with the rest of the game, you have to use it. In DS, it's more like "okay, you could use some other guy's legendary sword, or you could just make your own with the right materials."

    Case in point, In DS3, I've got the longsword I started out with specced out as high as it'd go and refined (which raises it's str/dex rating), and it outputs only slightly less damage than the three specced out special weapons I've found. It's not nearly so fancy with it's moveset and specials, but it's still a competitive weapon. I could use it to beat the game if I wanted to, though I ultimately prefer the way the more spectacular weapons handle in a fight.

  13. #88
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    I kinda like it. If you grow fond of a weapon, you can keep using it through the whole game. If you want to. That's great.

    In WoW they solved this issue with "transmogrification". You make your weapon(s) look like some other weapon you posses. I used to love my "Brutality Blade", which I got in 2006. From 2011 (when they introduced transmogrification) till 2014 (when I stopped playing for good) I made all my swords look like a Brutality Blade. I'm already fond of my Halberd in DS1. So it's no problem to keep using it.

    I am just wondering if I am missing out on some other fun weapons that I should try.
    And I am wondering what I should do with all the red, green and white titanite that I have in my bags. If I'll keep using my Halberd+15, all those materials (and future materials) seem wasted.

    I see (in videos) lots of people using greatswords. But I find them a bit awkward. I wonder if I'm missing something. Maybe I'm doing wrong. Or maybe it's just the fact that I play in leather, not in full plate armor. When you are in plate armor, you probably care less if you get hit once in a while. When you are in leather, the play-style requires you to avoid getting hit at all. Maybe the combination greatsword+leather isn't very smart. And to play in leather (which I prefer) you need faster weapons (like smaller swords or halberds and scythes).

    I'm still not sure what weapon to upgrade with my green/red/white titanite. Or maybe I should just level all my stats to 40 (str/dex/int/faith) and create some divine or occult weapons. Anyway, there's no hurry. I can also just continue killing bosses with my Halberd.

  14. #89
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    You don't need to farm titanite, you can just farm souls then buy it from the Blacksmith in undead Burg and the guy at the top of Sen's Fortress.

  15. #90
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    Quote Originally Posted by faetal View Post
    You don't need to farm titanite, you can just farm souls then buy it from the Blacksmith in undead Burg and the guy at the top of Sen's Fortress.
    Sure. But that's just shards and large shards. Those are abundant. The problem are the chunks. You can't buy those. The only (or best) place to farm them is from the Dark Wraiths at the bottom of the New Londo Ruins. I've been there. It was a while ago, I had worse gear and was lower level. But I don't have good memories about that place. But maybe it's time to go back for some revenge.

    Don't forget I have wasted a few man-years playing World of Warcraft. Min-maxing is a huge part of that game (if you want your character to progress). So I am very familiar with reading wikis and websites and figuring out how to do builds, where to acquire gear, how to upgrade gear, where to get materials, etc. It's second nature. I kinda enjoy doing that. And with my "mad skillzz" (or rather: lack of) I better make sure my character has all the stats and gear and upgrades that she needs.

    In the last hour I tried different weapons while farming the 4 mobs in the Darkroot Garden (7000 souls for 4 mobs, and they die in a few hits. One riposte even). I upgraded my Great Scythe and Murakumo to +10. The Great Scythe at +10 seems to do as much damage as my Halberd+15. I still like the forward thrust of the Halberd best. But if the Great Scythe_+15 really does more damage, then it might be worth it to upgrade it. I also tried the Murakumo. I feel a lot less in control when using that. I upgraded the Zweihander, the Gargoyle's Halberd and the Server sword to +5. I might upgrade one of those (or a +5 Balder Side Sword) to +10 Fire. Not sure yet. None of those weapons have me convinced yet.

    Anyway, thanks for all the input.
    I'm continuing on Wednesday. Nito died on Saturday. It's time to continue with the Bed of Chaos. I gave it one try, but I decided to come back later, when I'm in the mood for some ballroom dancing.

  16. #91
    I used Murakumo only in DS2. Cool but weird. Useful for crowd control, but not too handy in one on one situations. That horizontal swing can miss a lot, if you're doing more than one in a row. And you really have to aim well with the heavy attack, which is awesome, but very risky if you miss.

  17. #92
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    I recall that the Darkwraiths in New Londo ruins are pretty easy to kill once you know their moves, so if you have the patience for farming, then it's worth it for the Scythe. Else, why not return to an area with lower level enemies where a +5 weapon will actually have some impact, then you can test it out to see if you like it? Also, pick a suitable boss to leave a white symbol next to and fight it with your scythe.

  18. #93
    I'm trying my hardest to like Dark Souls, having ignored it for so long. I played a little Bloodborne but never really got into it, but I got sick of my friends always raving about Dark Souls not caving to those filthy casuals without myself knowing much about it.

    I still don't get it. The more I play, the more I can't decide if fans like this game for the reason we also like QWOP: we recognize QWOP is actually kind of awful, but the challenge and the subject makes it hilarious.

    Dark Souls seems to follow that same pattern. The controls are godawful, and the camera seems to be attached to a kite trailing behind you rather than to your character; or perhaps judging by some of its wobbling, I think it actually may be mounted to a single testicle and shakes and shudders and swings violently from side to side as that testicle wobbles in my character's unsupported ball sack.

    Strangely, the game has found a niche playerbase, or perhaps more accurately has found a way to convince players as a whole to forgive its awful gameplay by calling it "difficult." But the game itself is not actually terribly difficult; instead, the difficulty comes almost exclusively from the unwieldy, sludgey, brick-like controls, and a combat system that isn't terribly consistent because it seems like they spitshined and labeled "finished" on something that barely met alpha standards.

    On that last point, one of my friends and I got in a bit of a larger debate. He insisted combat was rock solid on the grounds that he could rather predictably win almost every fight by 'skillfully' employing a set of mostly identical tactics. I asked him to stream for me so I could figure out if I was missing something, and what I saw was that, whether realizing it or not, players have found the method of winning generally involves just minimizing the ability of the game's oddball combat to inexplicably screw you, which is an entirely different animal.

    But I think what really drives me up the wall is the epic number of awful design decisions in general that get a pass because they're part of the "experience." Cough, improperly ported tutorial texts, entirely seperate and semi-conflicting abilities sharing a single keybind, neutral NPC attack behavior, the Engrish story. I JUST DON'T GET THE APPEAL.

  19. #94
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by Avalon View Post
    I still don't get it. The more I play, the more I can't decide if fans like this game for the reason we also like QWOP: we recognize QWOP is actually kind of awful, but the challenge and the subject makes it hilarious.
    The difficulty doesn't come from overcoming an awkward playing game (though admittedly, the camera has fucked me over in every single Souls game at some point). It's about always being aware of your enemies and your surroundings, knowing how close you are to the edge of that cliff, or when to take advantage of an opening for a strike that you know you can go for without exposing yourself for a hit back in return. It's all about thinking on your feet, while maintaining a solid presence of mind. The difficulty comes from the fact it's a very unforgiving game, but it's never cheap. If you rushed in too early, or swung your sword at the wrong time, it's your own fault you got hit.

    About the only thing I'd consider unwieldy about the controls would be jumping, but it's never made a requirement for the main game, so it's not that big of a deal.

  20. #95
    TPP camera will always cause some trouble and feel a bit chaotic, even in major AAA titles like Arkham series. My only problem is that turning is not smooth enough, in both games actually, it has like 2 main speeds on the gamepad.

    Otherwise, your complaining is similar to having your ass handed to you in a match vs an experienced player in a fighting game. You just don't understand why you failed again and again, and that's frustrating, obviously. Getting the hang of controls and the combat system is a bit like mastering a character in a fighting game, the only problem is that you have to invent that character. If the game wasn't consistent in its controls and combat system, it wouldn't have been such a good speedrunning material. You can check youtube for that, people are doing insane things in this game.

  21. #96
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    The thing which most people don't seem to get is that you don't get an instant attack when you press attack, you get the beginning of an attack animation that is completely determined by your weapon's move set and that button mashing is a sure way to get fucked up. Learn your weapon's move set, learn your opponent's move set and try to exploit their vulnerabilities while protecting yours. Don't hit attack unless you have a window to cause damage without leaving yourself open. Learn how to roll at the right moment to time the enemy's strike with the invulnerability window. Learn how to use your shield at the right moment to conserve stamina regeneration. Don't be hasty. Learn which enemies to stay close to (eg Black Knights) and which to keep distance from until the moment is right (eg Basilisks / Big Mushrooms).

    Once you get into the flow of the controls, rather than feel awful, they begin to feel natural and visceral and weighty.

  22. #97
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    The fact that there is a "lock-on-enemy" option in the game is proof that the controls/camera are not good. If movement and camera were good, that option would not have been necessary.

  23. #98
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    There's a lock on enemy game on pretty much all melee TPS games, which is either selected (eg Dark Souls, Blade of Darkness) or automatic (Arkham Asylum, Shadow of Mordor).
    It's not a flaw in the camera, unless you think that the camera should just know where you want to look?

  24. #99
    LittleFlower
    Registered: Jul 2001
    Location: Netherlands
    I played 10 years of World of Warcraft. The WASD do exactly what you expect, move the character from the point-of-view of the character. If you want to move the camera, or move the viewpoint of your character, you can do that with the mouse. In Dark Souls you can move and turn too, but much less precise. It really took some effort to get used to the camera and movement in DS. I use the lock-on feature all the time now, but I feel it should not exist. (I have to use it, or else you can't back away from an enemy without turning your back to it. That got me killed a lot of times until I started using the lock-on feature for every fight).

    I understand more and more games use DS's movement and camera-movement. Because of consoles. Because of gamepads. But I still find it count-intuitive. I think it (slightly) breaks immersion. It makes me aware of the fact I am playing a game and controlling "a puppet". Straight WASD movement and old-style FPS-style camera-movement is much more immersive for me. And more precise.

  25. #100
    Soon enough you'll learn that using lock-on all the time is a recipe for disaster. There are players who don't use lock-on at all.

    I don't think From wanted to create combat system where immersion is the 1st priority. It's not meant to be invisible, main focus is on player expression and numerous ways to do it. Even if it means having a fighting game controller layout for things that seem so much simpler. As with every other little thing in those games, the developers expect quite a bit more from the players, more than any other devs would do. After 3 games it's hard to believe that's a design flaw or an omission on their end.

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