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Thread: Final Fantasy XV looks: good, not like a Final Fantasy game

  1. #1
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland

    Final Fantasy XV looks: good, not like a Final Fantasy game



    What's this? A Final Fantasy game that doesn't have that standard turn based combat but instead like... actual combat where you need to press buttons and do combos and dodge and shit? And it's OPEN WORLD? And there's A CAR!? YOU GET TO GO ON A ROADTRIP WITH YOUR SCREAMO-METAL BAND AND HAVE ADVENTURES AND SHIT*? WHAT WHAT WHAT? I must admit I completely tuned out wrt Final Fantasy games ages ago. When did the series get awesome? How long has the turn based combat been gone? I mean I'm no fan of spectacle fighters either, but I can tolerate them a lot more than that dumb turn based system they used to have where two teams would line up opposite each other and then take turns running up and slapping a memeber of the opposite team.

    This looks good. Wasn't on my radar at all but after stumbling across this trailer just now I'm excited for it. It looks kinda like a futuristic Dragon's Dogma. Apparently there's a demo coming out at the end of March.

    *I'm just guessing at the story might be

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Um.. not having played a single FF game, what does a Final Fantasy game look like usually? Isn't spiky hair and ridiculous swords the default look for the series?

  3. #3
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland
    Yes. I was refering to the gameplay not looking like a typical FF game, not the characters.
    Last edited by henke; 19th Jan 2015 at 07:14.

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Are RPGs really that much defined by their combat system, though? It's not completely unheard of for an RPG to change the combat system. Just look at Torment for a recent example -- the old one was real time with pause like all the other Infinity Engine games and the new one has turn-based combat.

  5. #5
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    I'd say that FF games have been defined by their combat system (and emo protagonists).

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2008
    And the fact that some attacks involve summoning monsters who hit the enemy with the fucking moon.

    And you can cast them repeatedly.

  7. #7
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    Limit breaks (and their like) are also good:

    "I can probably more or less end this fight in a few seconds, but only if I'm sufficiently aggravated"

  8. #8
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by faetal View Post
    "I can probably more or less end this fight in a few seconds, but only if I'm sufficiently aggravated"
    Anime combat frequently works exactly like that.

  9. #9
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    I love it really, and gameplay would be broken if you didn't limit stuff like that, but I just love stuff like:

    "Now you've done it!" (pulls out giant one-shot-kill cannon I had ALL ALONG)
    Last edited by faetal; 19th Jan 2015 at 11:28.

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Ah, I had no idea that FF had a series-defining combat system. I thought it was just some variation of your typical JRPG combat. At least it was when I tried to get into the series a long long time ago on the NES.

    As an outsider, it seemed to me that FF is more about melodrama, characters, and cinematic effects. All of which seem to be present in the trailer.

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2011
    Location: Trapped in Constantine's couch
    Wow! This actually looks pretty sweet. I kinda gave up on Final Fantasy after I figured they perfected the game with FF12. This new (teleporting?) sword seems like a nice advantage and the combat looks impressive.

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Location: Switzerland
    This is a tangent, but I'm curious: are there any Japanese RPGs that follow a more 'western' template, just like there are western JRPGs (for want of a better word)? Is there something along the lines of a Japanese Baldur's Gate or Fallout?

  13. #13
    Member
    Registered: May 1999
    Location: on the socio path
    I tend to enjoy FF games even though I can admit they are ultra-cliched, grind-y affairs and are all around ridiculous as hell. I also order sour patch kids at the movie theater, I don't care what you think

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Thirith View Post
    This is a tangent, but I'm curious: are there any Japanese RPGs that follow a more 'western' template, just like there are western JRPGs (for want of a better word)? Is there something along the lines of a Japanese Baldur's Gate or Fallout?
    Dark Souls?

  15. #15
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Location: Switzerland
    Dark Souls is completely its own thing, though. It's no closer to the Black Isle RPGs, for instance, than it is to Final Fantasy.

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Thirith View Post
    Dark Souls is completely its own thing, though.
    Is it, though? There's Enclave, Rune, Blade of Darkness and even perhaps Dark Messiah that offer at least something comparable. It's not like From invented the action RPG.

    But yes, if you define Western RPGs strictly by Black Isle RPGs and exclude things like the Elder Scrolls and Gothic series, then I suppose it is as far removed from WRPGs as it is from JRPGs.

  17. #17
    verbose douchebag
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Lyon, France
    Blade of Darkness is such a huge influence on Dark Souls.

  18. #18
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2004
    Hmm, interesting... really looks different. Story-wise, it also seems to lack the overarching "some grand evil is trying to destroy the world, STAPH IT". Wonder if it still does that or is trying to be different? It looks like it might focus on the characters and exploring their relationships more (which could be plenty of material for full game).




    Quote Originally Posted by faetal View Post
    Limit breaks (and their like) are also good:

    "I can probably more or less end this fight in a few seconds, but only if I'm sufficiently aggravated"
    In their defense, it's not like many other games don't have the "your damage doubles when HP drops under 30%" kind of upgrades (like Shadow Warrior).

    Personally, while not at all realisitc, I do like the FF style combat (particularly 5 and 7). It was a fun way to experiment with different combinations of styles, abilities, jobs, materia etc. The occasional grinding would be my only real pet-peeve (exacerbated by the magic-drawing in 8 oh dear god)

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Location: Switzerland
    Quote Originally Posted by Starker View Post
    Is it, though? There's Enclave, Rune, Blade of Darkness and even perhaps Dark Messiah that offer at least something comparable. It's not like From invented the action RPG.

    But yes, if you define Western RPGs strictly by Black Isle RPGs and exclude things like the Elder Scrolls and Gothic series, then I suppose it is as far removed from WRPGs as it is from JRPGs.
    I haven't played Enclave, Rune or Blade of Darkness, so those might be close to Dark Souls, but then I thought it would be clearer from my first post (which I specifically ended with "Is there something along the lines of a Japanese Baldur's Gate or Fallout?") that I wasn't talking about action RPGs, where the stat building is solely about fighting. As I said, there are western JRPGs (such as Anachronox), and what I'm wondering is if there's the reverse: Japanese RPGs that are less linear, that offer NPC interaction and options beyond "Talk to character X to get a canned conversation, with little to no interaction." Even a Japanese Elder Scrolls or Gothic, really, because I don't think these games are all that close to a Dark Souls.

  20. #20
    Dragon's Dogma is basically a Japanese TES/Gothic isn't it?

  21. #21
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    Shadow of the Colossus was open world. Zelda and its clones were too for that matter.

    I think that Japanese players are more set in their ways than a Western audience though (and not just for games), so they're not going to tolerate dropping accepted tropes as easily, or anyway that's how companies seem to feel.

  22. #22
    Member
    Registered: May 1999
    Location: on the socio path
    Could just be the Japanese audience isn't interested in the particular tropes of Western RPGs, another genre that's just as easy to pick apart for being clichéd, soulless, and devoid of much meaningful content despite their more open and complex natures

    (I also like Western RPGs)

    BTW, aside from Anachronox, what other examples of Western made jRPGs are there? subsidiaries don't count (Secret of Evermore etc)

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Location: Switzerland
    Quote Originally Posted by Abysmal View Post
    ... another genre that's just as easy to pick apart for being clichéd, soulless, and devoid of much meaningful content...
    I'm not entirely sure how an entire genre can be criticised for this, when the content differs from example of the genre to the next. That's a bit like saying "The novel can be criticised for being badly plotted, full of shallow characterisation and inherently conservative in terms of its form", as far as I'm concerned.

    Anyway, it's not about saying that one genre is inherently better than another. It's more that I find it interesting that certain genres seem to be much more culturally specific than others.

    Edit: On the topic of western JRPGs, there aren't many but there are some, like the Costume Quest games or Lord of the Rings: The Third Age. Isn't Stick of Truth also at least JRPG-inspired? Then there's a bunch of retro/indie games from the last couple of years that would fit the bill.
    Last edited by Thirith; 20th Jan 2015 at 04:11.

  24. #24
    Member
    Registered: May 1999
    Location: on the socio path
    Just saying the more open nature of western RPGs leads to a hollower, unfocused narrative comprised mostly of filler side quests, soulless characters, and forgettable content, the kind of third-rate content which we would all be better people if we didn't waste so much time experiencing it (I'd say over 90% of side quest content is third-rate content though, Japanese or Western)

    I always remember a jRPG's characters and story quite vividly, but Western RPGs? not so much, mostly just the graphics and gameplay. Gameplay does count for a lot though, and who doesn't like exploration, so that's why I still enjoy them.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Abysmal View Post
    BTW, aside from Anachronox, what other examples of Western made jRPGs are there? subsidiaries don't count (Secret of Evermore etc)
    Septerra Core is one of the most obvious ones that comes to mind. Also, Silver... kind of... at least from an aesthetic standpoint.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thirith View Post
    On the topic of western JRPGs, there aren't many but there are some, like the Costume Quest games
    Costume Quest in particular has some pretty obvious Mother influences.

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