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Thread: Played Thief for years before discovering...

  1. #51
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    Thanks, I'll give that a try next time I'm there.

    Discovered yesterday that you can unlock doors by bashing them with your sword. Or at least there is one door that this works with, a door in Blackmail. You even get the unlocking sound as if you had used a key. Not yet tested it on other doors.

    About Haunts, why do they have swords? They are meant to be resurrected Hammers so why wouldn't they have hammers?

    I actually vaguely remember them having hammers in my first playthrough of the unpatched version of DP; then when I played a 2nd playthrough a year later, this time with Gold, they had swords and I wondered whether these swords had been patched in? Or am I just misremembering that they had hammers initially.

    Also, why no Mechanist Haunts?

  2. #52
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    Haunts have swords in TDP and TG but they have hammers in T2. Mechanist haunts are theoretically possible and are even present in some FMs. Actually, anybody can become a haunt, I think.

  3. #53
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    By default you can bash down most wooden doors, unless they have been specifically set to be unbashable.

  4. #54
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Montpellier, France
    My guess for Haunts to have swords is because hammers are blessed symbols. But of course they use hammers in T2, so... There is a Hammerite mesh in T1/G that uses a sword too and has less armor than a regular Hammer guard.

  5. #55
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    I read through the sourcecode and figured out things you'd almost never think to check (or know how to check) in game, although now I'm already forgetting them.

    I think one was that sword damage is a function of your angle to the bad guy, so a shot where you're head on facing the guy hurts more than if you're facing their side and the shot still connects, which I think I'd already suspected, but it was confirmed.

  6. #56
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2009
    Location: Argentina
    Similarly to AIs, doors have hit points. Wooden doors can either be opened by bashing then with the sword or using explosives. Most metal doors can only be opened with explosives.

  7. #57
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: College Place, WA
    You can blackjack alerted guards through doors if you stand in front of the door. This is assuming the door blocks AI vision. Door with windows do not.
    You can also blackjack alerted guards around corners.

  8. #58
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    It seems a bit weird though that bashing a door would cause it to unlock, complete with unlocking sound, rather than it just crashing open.

    So the T2 Haunts have hammers. Maybe that it why I remembered them that way and so was confused by my 2nd T1 playthrough by the swords.

  9. #59
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2009
    Location: Argentina
    My theory is that Haunts in Thief Gold use swords because they are ghosts of Hammerites from older times, which is why you find them in the Old Quarter and the Bonehoard only and probably some (if not all) of the Hammerites used to wield swords back in those years. In Thief 2 they carry hammers because you find them in not-so-forgotten places (Truart's estate crypt and the Mechanist Seminary) and that proves that those ghosts are not as old. You can spot the difference in the age of the Haunts just by looking at their outfit, too.

  10. #60
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    DarkMax, could be.

    In Thieves Guild a searching enemy may say something like "You better hope I find you before the guards do". What guards? Aren't they the guards? Or are these guards not actually in the mission (like the non-existent dogs, who you are also threatened with).

  11. #61
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    Only recently discovered a useful tip for Expert: using frogbeast eggs against guards is allowed. This does not count as your kill and won't fail the mission.

    Useful for some awkward Mechanists on the rooftops in LotP.
    Last edited by Cigam; 27th Mar 2017 at 12:41.

  12. #62
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    Quote Originally Posted by Cigam View Post
    Useful for some awkward Mechanists on the rooftops in LotP.
    If you don't raise the alarm in Angelwatch, there won't be any awkward mechanists on the rooftops

  13. #63
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    Then that is another thing I did not know - you can open the safe without triggering the alarm?

    Let me guess, it involves some exploit rather than being an official possibility?

  14. #64
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    No, there is a switch to deactivate the alarm It's on the same floor, hidden in one small room.

  15. #65
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    Quote Originally Posted by Cigam View Post
    DarkMax, could be.

    In Thieves Guild a searching enemy may say something like "You better hope I find you before the guards do". What guards? Aren't they the guards? Or are these guards not actually in the mission (like the non-existent dogs, who you are also threatened with).
    That's actually one of the thieves lines.

    Btw you can grab the plans scroll in Karras' safe without opening it. Stand at the left side and move your focus around until the safe isn't highlighted but the scroll is. You'll know if the scroll is highlighted if the safe should be highlighted but isn't.

  16. #66
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Does everyone know that you can shoot arrows (including rope arrows) into grass and dirt? I designed a contest mission that took advantage of this fact and some people thought I had added in the capability. I just assumed it was common knowledge!

  17. #67
    Member
    Registered: Sep 1999
    Location: Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by Weasel View Post
    Does everyone know that you can shoot arrows (including rope arrows) into grass and dirt? I designed a contest mission that took advantage of this fact and some people thought I had added in the capability. I just assumed it was common knowledge!
    I would often take advantage of this in cave systems.

  18. #68
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2012
    Location: Gèrmany
    This reverts way back but:

    ...that there are fan missions.

  19. #69
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    "That's actually one of the thieves lines."

    Yes but who are the guards they are referring to? I may be unobservant but they all look like thieves to me. Apart from that one City Watch officer outside, but he attacks the thieves so is not on their side.

    Will have a look for that switch in Life Of The Party, thanks.

    Was going to bring back the "Thief Irritants" thread to note those mechanical spiders in Soulforge. It seems like on Expert everywhere I turn there is one there, and so I have to run away and find a different route. I thought they were especially irritating because there is no easy way to deal with them, but I discovered today that shooting them in the back with water disables them just like with the other robots.

    Think that didn't occur to me because they do not have the obvious glowing heat vents that the others do.

    Still annoying though. At least with the big robots you can encourage them to blow themselves up. The spiders, once they hae made you, well your only option is to run away. Or waste a fire arrow or a frogbeast which more often than not they nail before it gets to them.

  20. #70
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    Quote Originally Posted by Weasel View Post
    Does everyone know that you can shoot arrows (including rope arrows) into grass and dirt? I designed a contest mission that took advantage of this fact and some people thought I had added in the capability. I just assumed it was common knowledge!
    Yes. You can accumulate extra broadheads by picking up arrows shot by archers into the grass.

  21. #71
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    Before T3 came out I remember reading a preview of it in a PC magazine, which mentioned that you would be able to side with factions. The thing is, I could swear I read them saying that you would be able to side with the Hammers, Pagans and Mechanists.

    Of course in actual T3 there are only the first two, and I am not sure how Mechanists would be extant after the events of T2, but I am sure I remember reading this.

    So was there ever a development stage when Mechanists were planned for TDS, or am I misremembering/the magazine was wrong.

  22. #72
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2011
    Location: Wild and Wooly West of Ireland
    Quote Originally Posted by Cigam View Post
    Yes but who are the guards they are referring to?
    The Thief voice sets aren't mission specific. There isn't a different voice set for each mission.
    Conversations can set the scene and offer pertinent information for the player in a particular scenario. Voice sets just offer a level of immersion.
    If a thief in the Guild mentions guards, it's because that line is included in his voice set. He's reached a level of alertness that triggers such dialogue. It's there to give the situation some depth, and to let you know he's pissed off. There are no mission clues in voice set dialogue.
    The "You better hope..." line works well when you disturb a burglary in progress, as in LOTP in TMA. However, it does seem a little out of place in the Guild, but as I said it's there for atmosphere.

    Spot on, Chris.

  23. #73
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2015
    Location: Germany
    For coming back to topic:

    I play Thief2 missions sometimes in an aggressive playstyle. My favourite OM (in this case) is the one before Soulforge. Bram Gervasius' manor is stuffed with AI's and has a lot of smashable windows. It makes fun to create a little chaos . It is like a challenge to take out as much AIs as you can (I play without quicksaves, of course) before you are stopped (killed) by an AI. This mission contains masked servants. Last year I found out, that these guys are thankful for being killed. I usually kill them while casually walking away after the fatal hit with my sword. However this time I stayed on place. At first the muffled death scream came out , but after a little break these guy said "THANKS". This left me shocked sitting in front of my computer screen for some minutes. They were really thankful for being killed! I ended up with turning off my computer, it was enough for this day. I never heard these last words because I always have been walked too far away for hearing them.

    Now I am a polite gentleman and so I fulfill the masked servants wishes.

  24. #74
    Member
    Registered: Sep 1999
    Location: Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by Thinking Robot View Post
    For coming back to topic:

    I play Thief2 missions sometimes in an aggressive playstyle. My favourite OM (in this case) is the one before Soulforge. Bram Gervasius' manor is stuffed with AI's and has a lot of smashable windows. It makes fun to create a little chaos . It is like a challenge to take out as much AIs as you can (I play without quicksaves, of course) before you are stopped (killed) by an AI. This mission contains masked servants. Last year I found out, that these guys are thankful for being killed. I usually kill them while casually walking away after the fatal hit with my sword. However this time I stayed on place. At first the muffled death scream came out , but after a little break these guy said "THANKS". This left me shocked sitting in front of my computer screen for some minutes. They were really thankful for being killed! I ended up with turning off my computer, it was enough for this day. I never heard these last words because I always have been walked too far away for hearing them.

    Now I am a polite gentleman and so I fulfill the masked servants wishes.
    Yep it's ms1diec2.wav, under slave folder, in SND.CRF. Creepy.

  25. #75
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2011
    Location: Ferrol - Spain
    Just discovered that there is a small triangle-shaped hole on the floor in Bonehoard that gives a view to the caves below (you can even see a mushroom down there)
    Where?
    Once you enter the big area where Garrett says: "Piped-in music, how classy" follow up to the next big area where there is a tomb and a high column with bones behind it.
    The hole is only a few meters away from that tomb.
    Find it for yourself if you still haven´t and be careful if you put a foot in there, you can get stuck and the zombies...

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