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Thread: object not being properly illuminated by sunlight

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)

    object not being properly illuminated by sunlight

    This is weird, i have this streetlamp in this place and despite being completely under sunlight it appears dark as if it was under shadow, but if i move slightly back it becomes illuminated :



    also if i change the model dimensions it can affect whether its illuminated or not.

    How can i fix this? i tried extra light, but its not the same because the objects gets illuminated in all surfaces.
    Last edited by Cardia; 26th Jul 2017 at 13:15.

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Formby, NW England
    I'm not certain, but if you modified one of the default lamp post objects, it may be inheriting some properties that don't work properly with such bright sunlight. Try assigning that model name to a different type of object and see if it behaves differently.

  3. #3
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by R Soul View Post
    I'm not certain, but if you modified one of the default lamp post objects, it may be inheriting some properties that don't work properly with such bright sunlight. Try assigning that model name to a different type of object and see if it behaves differently.
    this is a model i got from a 3d site, its actually a wooden spoon that i changed to this object.

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2007
    Location: LosAngeles: Between Amusements
    Did you change the dimensions of the spoon to match the lamp post? Also object illumination has to do with the light hitting the center of a face. Very flat surfaces should be forced to have multiple facets in in order to get them reasonably illuminated. And yes, changing an object's size will affect whether the engine thinks it should be illuminated.

  5. #5
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by LarryG View Post
    Did you change the dimensions of the spoon to match the lamp post? Also object illumination has to do with the light hitting the center of a face. Very flat surfaces should be forced to have multiple facets in in order to get them reasonably illuminated. And yes, changing an object's size will affect whether the engine thinks it should be illuminated.
    Thanks LarryG, but if you mean adjusting the object physic dimensions is pointless in this case, im not sure about the multiple faces, i just moving the lamp post a bit backwards and it gets illuminated, doesn't make any sens, because there's much space in front of the lamp that is under the light sun :



    i move the tree backwards and it gets illuminated. if i load early saves from this project that problem doesn't happen. so i have no idea what's going on here.
    Last edited by Cardia; 26th Jul 2017 at 17:50.

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    so i decided to test also other models from thief 2 and it happens the same thing, its weird... so it has nothing to do with the lamp street i was testing.

  7. #7
    Member
    Registered: Sep 1999
    Location: Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardia View Post
    so i decided to test also other models from thief 2 and it happens the same thing, its weird... so it has nothing to do with the lamp street i was testing.
    Are these objects buried in the ground a little? I had issues with this and had to have them slightly above the ground, as that end what solely responsible to receive light information.

  8. #8
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by gamophyte View Post
    Are these objects buried in the ground a little? I had issues with this and had to have them slightly above the ground, as that end what solely responsible to receive light information.
    i use "floor me" , i lifted up a bit off the ground, still doesn't work, i have no idea what's causing this problem, i did full mission process, build_dlg, quick optimize, optimize and yet the bug persists , if i resize it for a small size it gets illuminated by the sun, but only in a very small size. Im open to more suggestions

  9. #9
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2007
    Location: LosAngeles: Between Amusements
    Quote Originally Posted by LarryG View Post
    Did you change the dimensions of the spoon to match the lamp post? Also object illumination has to do with the light hitting the center of a face. Very flat surfaces should be forced to have multiple facets in in order to get them reasonably illuminated. And yes, changing an object's size will affect whether the engine thinks it should be illuminated.
    Check the dimensions of the lamppost.

  10. #10
    Desperately dodgy geezer
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: The Wailing Keep
    The reason Larry keeps mentioning that (presumably) is because objects are lit when their centers are lit. If the lamppost's phys model is the size of a spoon, maybe it isn't getting lit due to the small size. Plus, you of course want the player to collide with it properly as well anyway.

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    The reason Larry keeps mentioning that (presumably) is because objects are lit when their centers are lit. If the lamppost's phys model is the size of a spoon, maybe it isn't getting lit due to the small size. Plus, you of course want the player to collide with it properly as well anyway.
    Russ, as i mention above i did adjust the lamp physisc dimension, i also tested with other objects from Thief 2, look at the tree above. the problem is not only with the lamp, it happens with any object that is tall.

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: X:0.0000; Y:0.0000; Z:0.0000
    @ Cardia

    Just wondering. Do you have this in you FM.cfg file?
    sun_runtime_obj_shadows 0

    I have to use this for the last two missions in TROTB 2 because the sunlight wouldn't light up the objects correctly.

  13. #13
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by GORT View Post
    @ Cardia

    Just wondering. Do you have this in you FM.cfg file?
    sun_runtime_obj_shadows 0

    I have to use this for the last two missions in TROTB 2 because the sunlight wouldn't light up the objects correctly.
    Yes i do, i added that line when you mentioned in another post, here's what i have in my FM.cfg:

    ; an FM (that is loaded through the built-in FM support) may contain this in the root
    ; to ajdust configuration to better suit the FM.

    ; (Shock) custom first level when starting a new game
    ;first_level earth.mis
    ; (Thief) custom first misison when starting a new game
    ;starting_mission 1

    ; a '+' separated list of movie filenames to that should not be played. This eliminates
    ; the need to include an empty movie to override an original one and it will also be
    ; handled nicer because it won't result in a short UI screen switch in an attempt to play
    ;fm_movie_disable cs1.avi

    ; a '+' separated list of movie filenames to exclude from cropping
    ; (only has any effect if "crop_movies" is enabled by the user)
    ;fm_movie_crop_exclude intro.avi+credits.avi

    ; (Shock) disable hardcoded OM patching. By default the game changes various object
    ; properties in some OMs. This is done simply when a mission filename matches.
    ; To avoid potential unexplainable bugs in SS2 FMs, that happen to use missions with the
    ; same names as OMs, it's recommended to disable OM patching.
    ;fm_no_shock_om_patching

    new_mantle
    obj_min -18192
    obj_max 7900
    max_refs 50000
    sun_runtime_obj_shadows 0

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    I'm not at home to check, but are there any settings in the Sunlight rendering that would affect how the light looks on objects? Is the sunlight being rendered evenly across the map?

  15. #15
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by john9818a View Post
    I'm not at home to check, but are there any settings in the Sunlight rendering that would affect how the light looks on objects? Is the sunlight being rendered evenly across the map?
    This is the rendering settings im using:



    Yes, all map is evenly rendered , until now... it used to work even with other models i added previously in early steps of this project, and now if i add or move one of them slightly they no longer get illuminated by the sunlight.

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    I wonder if sunlight is calculated differently than a normal light source. Instead of calculating a radius around a light maybe the sunlight is calculating the map in separate areas or cubes and somehow the objects are being affected depending on where they are in the cube. This is just a theory but maybe the sunlight is rendering in a checkerboard pattern instead of sweeping the whole map from one end to the other.

  17. #17
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by john9818a View Post
    I wonder if sunlight is calculated differently than a normal light source. Instead of calculating a radius around a light maybe the sunlight is calculating the map in separate areas or cubes and somehow the objects are being affected depending on where they are in the cube. This is just a theory but maybe the sunlight is rendering in a checkerboard pattern instead of sweeping the whole map from one end to the other.
    Probably due to having many objects the light cannot or has difficult now to render illumination to all objects?

  18. #18
    Member
    Registered: Sep 1999
    Location: Portland, OR
    If you view by bounding boxes or physics boxes, are there any overlapping your lamp? I know how dumb I sound, because then you'd run into it in-game but maybe it's on a edge and you haven't gone that far. Also if you resized it would suddenly get out of the way of the other box.

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by gamophyte View Post
    If you view by bounding boxes or physics boxes, are there any overlapping your lamp? I know how dumb I sound, because then you'd run into it in-game but maybe it's on a edge and you haven't gone that far. Also if you resized it would suddenly get out of the way of the other box.
    lol, like i said, the problem is not in the lamp , and to answer that, no, its not out of the bounding box, Rsoul taught me how to adjust the objects position in blender. Forgetting now the lamp, for example i have placed for a long time these street lamps from DC project, but if i eliminate one of these street lamps and create another in its place it no longer gets illuminated by the sunlight, that being said, if i were to place only now the DC street lamps i wouldn't be able to get them illuminated by the sunlight, this is weird right? i mean who can guess what's causing this issue.

  20. #20
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: Lexington, KY
    I had this issue with double doors. I didn't technically solve it, but I found a solution that satisfied me. Sometimes I will have a set of double doors where one door is illuminated more than the other, and if I move them backwards or forwards very slightly, the illumination will change. I just do this until both doors illuminate the same. I always assumed this was a bug, so I never tried to find a technical solution.

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Thanks Phantom, luckily i had already street lamps installed (the dc project models) before this light bug appeared with anything tall i place now in the map. i wanted to use more realistic models, but i think ill be fine with the DC project models, theyre fit well and besides i guess no one else will use them, and since TTLG studios never made use of them at least ill give them some purpose in my upcoming mission.

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