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Thread: The Voynich Manuscript has finally been decoded.

  1. #26
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by dj_ivocha View Post
    Erm...
    I'll get your coat. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolya View Post
    We should talk more about the faces of Dustin Hoffman and Katharine Ross after they get on the bus.
    That's the look people make after the excitement dies down, and they've had the time to reflect on the stupid shit they just done.

  2. #27
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Cologne
    I think they realize that they haven't escaped becoming adults. That's the passage the film is about and adults are depicted as shallow and manipulative throughout. That's what he tries to save her and himself from.

  3. #28
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Cologne
    Or maybe I'm confusing it with Salinger. I'd have to watch the film again.

  4. #29
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2001
    Location: Somewhere
    you can never escape from becoming an adult. Well possibly for a little while and why doesnt muzman post here anymore

  5. #30
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    It's the ending of the romantic phase of their relationship, which usually lasts about 5 to 6 months.

  6. #31
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2001
    Location: Somewhere
    nah i am pretty sure thats not the reason

  7. #32
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    Once you take off the rose coloured glasses it all changes. I think they dropped theirs getting on the bus.

  8. #33
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    I haven't seen The Graduate, so I wouldn't know.

  9. #34
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    One word: you know the one

  10. #35
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Cologne
    Plastics.

  11. #36
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Melbourne, Australia
    I really need to watch that movie someday.

  12. #37
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Cologne
    I felt the only minor downside was that Dustin Hoffman looks too old for the part he's playing. He's supposed to be 21 (but actually is 30). But then everyone looked skinny and more mature back then apparently.

  13. #38
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: Montreal, Canada
    Come for the medieval manuscripts. Stay for Dustin Hoffman

  14. #39
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: Cologne
    So I watched it again and here are my notes:
    - I forgot how funny this film is. Really laugh out loud funny at some moments, especially in the first halve.
    - I'm not one for tan lines but Mrs. Robinson is certainly the most interesting character in the film. She's the one you want to know more about.
    - Roger Ebert in his (second and retrospective) review called Ben Braddock a creep. And I guess his stalking of a daughter after fucking her mother technically meets the definition. But Ebert must have been really old to forget the crazy things one will do when love hits.
    - Elaine's character could have done with some more scenes, that explain how she comes from suspecting Ben of having raped her mother to falling back into love with him. It doesn't take much to imagine her motive but it's not explained at all, because the film is centered on Benjamin.
    - Mrs. Robinson could have had her own spinoff series. It took a long time until directors eventually took up that thread in Sex and the City, Desperate Housewifes, Cougar Town, etc.
    - Simon & Garfunkel certainly helped this film and their music is well used, but it's not as integral to the film as you might suspect given their own fame. The film would have well worked with other music too.

    As for the question what drives Ben Braddock, he's obviously not happy with all the expectations cast upon him. But when he finds Elaine to be the only person he could ever talk to and feel comfortable with, he pursues the plan of marrying her with such intensity - which isn't exactly an act of youthful rebellion as the enthused reaction of his parents confirms - that the only question remains, why Mrs. Robinson hates this idea with such a vengeance. Her motives can be guessed at. She's using Ben for her pleasure and doesn't really want him to intrude on her life in any way that she doesn't completely control. As the conversation with Ben about the origins of her marriage shows, she has been deeply hurt and forced into an unhappy marriage that took her from being an art student to an alcoholic housewife. And she now not only resents her husband but has developed a distrust of men in general, unless she can control them.

    Ben Braddock himself remains largely a cipher of limited interest, despite the film and two women revolving around him. Did he try to save Elaine from the adult world that screwed with him? On re-watching he seems too self-centered for that. Why doesn't he drop out, smoke a joint and relax? It's 1967 after all. Instead he puts everything - his salvation - on one card: Elaine. And when he gets her, finally on that bus, it might dawn on him that this wasn't the way to a different future than his parents had. He might still very well end up in plastics.

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