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Thread: Thief: The Dark Project 20th Anniversary Contest!

  1. #51
    Southquarter.com/fms
    Registered: Apr 2000
    Location: The Akkala Highlands
    - Remember that Thief 1 doesn’t support optional objectives! All objectives are mandatory as soon as they're activated!
    There's a difference between activating/deactivating objectives, and optional ones. The THC one is deactivated, the one in Undercover (killing Bugbeasts) is activated. Neither one is optional, which would be an active objective that the player can decide if they want to complete or not without affecting the success of the mission.

  2. #52
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2017
    Location: Germany
    Quote Originally Posted by Twist View Post
    I played several old, classic Thief 1 FMs over the weekend, and while trying to pinpoint how and why they feel so different to Thief 2, Thief 2 FMs and most modern FMs in general, I kept coming back to one tangible constant across all the different FMs: the lack of colored lighting. But NewDark makes colored lighting available in Thief 1 missions.

    In keeping strictly with the theme... maybe colored lighting shouldn't be allowed in contest entries? It's just an idea... feel free to tell me to buzz off.
    I agree with that. And I also noticed that even all standard lights in Thief 2 (like the electric wall light) are slightly colored. They appear to be darker and go into purple compared to the Thief 1 ones which are bright white light. I guess that's also responsible, why T1/G have much more contrast between light and dark areas than Thief 2.

    About the optional goals:
    I never read a rule that prevents optional goals. I only read a notice at the end, that optional goals are simply not possible and we should keep that in mind while planning the map.
    In my resent T1/TG FM 'Project Hammer - Secret connections' I used a fake optional goal to allow only a certain number of knock outs. I ticked it off as successful right at the start of the Map. So you can beat the mission with all objectives successful or the knock out optional goal gets grayed out when you knock out more.
    That's at least one work around to create a fake optional goal and that's certainly possible with the ruleset of this contest.


    One last note on the collaboration rule:
    Is it the first contest to allow it? (I'm usually not so into FM contests)
    I find it slightly off that one can team up with several others to get an advantage over only one creator. But even if collaboration isn’t allowed, no one could prove if everything was made by himself in that timespan. Either way, the fact that we create awesome maps should matter, not who win the first/second/third place.

  3. #53
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Montpellier, France
    To be specific: "optional" goals are certainly not forbidden, it's just that T2-like optional goals are not feasible in TG, or at least not easily.
    Colored lighting is allowed mostly because the NewDark .gam has LightColor attributes from the get go.

    Re: collaborations: this isn't the first contest to allow them. However since this contest is all stock this will prevent scenarios where you have a team or two that produce incredibly good looking missions that get more attention than a regular mission. This limitation is also a good way to put an emphasis on actually well-designed missions.

    EDIT: You can find a thread with allowed custom resources here: http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post2378245
    Last edited by skacky; 4th Dec 2017 at 19:46.

  4. #54
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2017
    Location: Germany
    Quote Originally Posted by skacky View Post
    Re: collaborations: this isn't the first contest to allow them. However since this contest is all stock this will prevent scenarios where you have a team or two that produce incredibly good looking missions that get more attention than a regular mission. This limitation is also a good way to put an emphasis on actually well-designed missions.
    Fair enough I guess. The limitation on stock resources and emphasis on actually well-designed missions is also the main reason why I like this contest so much. I hope many FMs authors contribute to this and can actually finish their work in time (live can be shitty sometimes, 1 year isn't enough sometimes)

    The idea to share all made resources is also a great way to help those creators not so good in editing textures/models etc.

    About the colored light issue:
    Maybe everyone should know, that if they want to build a true original Thief 1/Gold FM, they shouldn't used colored lights. (or very very few)

  5. #55
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Montpellier, France
    I've updated the resource archive to include more reskinnable meshes I forgot to include. They are:
    - Male Actor
    - Constantine guards (Swordsman and Bowman)
    - Hermit
    - Keeper
    - Mage
    - Ramirez
    - Thief guards (Swordsman and Bowman)

  6. #56
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Ok guys...thanks to some very convincing people, I'm officially in. And I'm scared already, knowing very well what I am getting myself into. Last night I opened DromEd for the first time in nearly six years, and I felt clumsier than a baby on Doc Martens.
    The journey begins. So much old stuff to re-learn, and so much new stuff to get my head around.

  7. #57
    Member
    Registered: May 2017
    Location: USA
    HUZZAHHHH!!!

  8. #58
    Classical Master 2008
    Registered: Jun 2002
    Location: Civitas Quinque Ecclesiae HU
    Excellent!

    Before this contest, the last time I seriously opened Dromed was in 2009, so six years is pretty good.
    Oh well. It's quiet enough now.

  9. #59
    Member
    Registered: May 2001
    Location: Boston MA
    I said this in another thread but I’m in. All these new TDP missions to play in 2018. Wooooo!

    I have a few questions though. I downloaded TG from Steam a while back and loaded TFIX. I don’t think I loaded anything else but here are my questions:
    - is is OK to do a TG mission
    - how can I check that I did not load anything else that will disqualify me?

    Thanks
    BBB

  10. #60
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    1. Yes, TG or T1 either one.
    2. If you didn't check anything extra in TFix you should be fine.

  11. #61
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    So...T1 doesn't have a floor lamp/torch object?
    Or fence?

  12. #62
    Classical Master 2008
    Registered: Jun 2002
    Location: Civitas Quinque Ecclesiae HU
    The best substitutes for fences are the various portcullis objects (locked, frob and AI use disabled). What are you referring to by floor lamps? For electric versions, there is Lights>Alarmlights>GroundEmergencyLight, and for open flames, Furniture>LC_BrazierUsed. This does not include clever customisation.

  13. #63
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Thanks. I wanted a fence with sharp ends. And I had tried the BrazierUsed but didn't like how it looked. I guess it would have to do.

  14. #64
    Dóttirin klęšist oft móšur möttli
    Registered: Apr 2015
    Quote Originally Posted by Haplo View Post
    Or fence?
    In Sword of Drakul
    http://thiefmissions.com/m/sworddrkl
    I can see some evil trickery
    A ladder as a fence (mladder12)

  15. #65
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    Haplo, I've been using the horizontal portcullis as a fence railing object with solid terrain posts and it works well. Along the lines of what you're wanting, I have seen a screenshot of a pointy-topped iron fence made entirely of solid brushes by skacky, so it is possible. With NewDark you can kind of go crazy with solid brushes without much impact to your cell count (which is the only real limit which will cause you grief in NewDark with larger missions, you'll run out of cells long before you run out of brushes).

  16. #66
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2015
    Location: Germany
    There are many ways to create some special things with many Objects or brush or other techniques. Like breakable
    Windows or new creatures or special puzzles. This contest is a good challenge to be creative.

  17. #67
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Thanks guys. The last time I tried creating something similar with brushes totally killed my scene complexity. Good old days.

    I am making a very simple mission. I won't be doing any special stuff; I want it to look like T1 original missions or early FMs as much possible. I will use the custom scripts, but for convenience only (e.g. relay delay). No highly complex technical feats like A Sorrowful Farewell. As another example, I just discovered that NewDark can have many more sides in the cylinder base. You can do some very neat arches with it, but they didn't look like T1...
    The only feature of NewDark I might use is subtle usage of coloured lighting, mostly to warn the player of danger.

    In other words, my aim is: I won't do it if it wasn't possible in vanilla Thief!

  18. #68
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    I don't think anyone will have a problem with that!

  19. #69
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    I don't think anyone will have a problem with that!
    Making a simple mission is actually quite fun and relaxing! I think what burned me out years ago was the increasingly complexity of my last few missions.

  20. #70
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2006
    Location: Troyes, France
    Well. I decided to participate. This will be my first ever time as Thief FM author.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brethren View Post
    3. Install the Dromed Toolkit.
    1.13 or 1.14? Does the GOG version of TG/T2 already include DromEd Toolkit?
    Last edited by EnYB0La; 1st Jan 2018 at 22:33.
    Enhanced Thief Fan Missions Archive (ETFMA): [TTLG thread]
    DromEd Level Editor Developer Textures Kit (DLETDK): [TTLG thread]

  21. #71
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: X:0.0000; Y:0.0000; Z:0.0000
    Hmmm... I think I may put some of my projects on hold and go for this...

  22. #72
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: X:0.0000; Y:0.0000; Z:0.0000
    I have one more question here before I keep working on this. It's about using materials. Can we use materials on the stock textures? (The effects will use duplicated stock textures.)

  23. #73
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2015
    Location: Germany
    Also a question: is it possible to make a preview Thread for the thief 1 FMs? Or can we send the pictures to your and you post it anonym?

  24. #74
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: The Inverted Manse
    Quote Originally Posted by -Terra- View Post
    Also a question: is it possible to make a preview Thread for the thief 1 FMs? Or can we send the pictures to your and you post it anonym?
    Actually I was thinking about starting this thread tomorrow with a screenshot. But I'll wait for the organisers to decide how to do this.

  25. #75
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Fields of bluegrass
    I have asked skacky and will create a thread if he OK's it. I already posted a screen from my mission in The Editor's Guild a few minutes ago but it would be better to have them all in one thread here.

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