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Thread: The Gun Thread About Guns And Gun Related Gunnery

  1. #1
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018

    The Gun Thread About Guns And Gun Related Gunnery

    Quote Originally Posted by N'Al View Post
    It's all a matter of perspective.

    Based on declining life expectancy, ridiculous income inequality, the highest rate of gun deaths in the developed world, and a raging opioid epidemic one might be tempted to call the US a shithole, if one were so inclined.
    I don’t know if I would say income inequality makes a country a shithole. America was built on equality of opportunity not equality of outcome. And as for the gun deaths, well America is the largest first world country that allows you to have a gun so naturally it would have the most gun deaths.
    Last edited by xStevieNx; 18th Jan 2018 at 14:29.

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2017
    According to Alex Jones, America was built on guns and whisky.

  3. #3
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    I don’t know if I would say income inequality makes a country a shithole. America was built on equality of opportunity not equality of outcome.
    That may be true, but excessive inequality is actually bad for the economy, so the US could be doing even better.

    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    And as for the guns deaths, well America is one of the only first world countries that allow you to have a gun so naturally America would have the most gun deaths.
    So what.

  4. #4
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018
    Saying the U.S. has the highest rate of gun deaths is like saying, for example, the only country that allows cars has the highest rate of car accidents. Of course they would because they're the only country that allows cars, it's a side effect of having them. ~13,000 people die a year from firearm related deaths. 1.3 MILLION people die a year in car accidents, but almost everyone drives a car daily, because it is their right to drive a car just as it is to own a gun.

  5. #5
    Chakat sex pillow
    Registered: Sep 2006
    Location: not here
    If you were to continue with that logic, that's like saying people dying from stab wounds is a side effect of allowing knives to be sold to people. I haven't tried chopping my veggies with a gun lately, but if that's how it works in the US, I guess it explains the number of gun-related deaths.

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    So what.

  7. #7
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    America isn't the only 1st world country that allows its citizens to have guns. Finland, Austria, Iceland, Germany, France, I believe they average roughly one gun per every three people. Hardly rare.

  8. #8
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulphur View Post
    If you were to continue with that logic, that's like saying people dying from stab wounds is a side effect of allowing knives to be sold to people. I haven't tried chopping my veggies with a gun lately, but if that's how it works in the US, I guess it explains the number of gun-related deaths.
    But people dying from stab wounds IS a side effect of allowing knives to be sold to people. If knives were banned there wouldn't be hardly any people dying from stab wounds. But knives, just like guns, when they are used right have a practical and useful purpose.

  9. #9
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post
    America isn't the only 1st world country that allows its citizens to have guns. Finland, Austria, Iceland, Germany, France, I believe they average roughly one gun per every three people. Hardly rare.
    Yes, but they are lot more strict.

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    That may all be true, yet the US still has the highest rate of gun deaths per capita in the developed world. So again: so what.

  11. #11
    Chakat sex pillow
    Registered: Sep 2006
    Location: not here
    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    But people dying from stab wounds IS a side effect of allowing knives to be sold to people. If knives were banned there wouldn't be hardly any people dying from stab wounds. But knives, just like guns, when they are used right have a practical and useful purpose.
    Just so we're clear, we're talking about guns -- that is, the things whose only purpose is for some people to point at other people/things in order to communicate intent to kill and/or execute said intent, and not something else that would actually be useful, like a metaphor for a penis?

  12. #12
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    What N'Al said. I believe the US accounts for 80% of all gun related deaths in the 1st World, despite the fact it's hardly the only 1st world country with a heavy gun presence.

    The most obvious conclusion you could draw from that is we don't have a gun problem exactly, so much as a culture problem. We tend to look at our guns as status symbols and toys, rather than the weapons they are. It makes us a lot more cavalier about them overall.

  13. #13
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulphur View Post
    Just so we're clear, we're talking about guns -- that is, the things whose only purpose is for some people to point at other people in order to communicate intent to kill and/or execute said intent, and not something else that would actually be useful, like a metaphor for a penis?
    I don't know how guns are viewed in your country, but millions of people use guns everyday in America, for hunting, for sport, or for self-defense, in a completely harmless and peaceful way. Unfortunately, the few people who decide to use guns for violence are the ones that everyone likes to focus on.

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    Those 'few people' you are talking about still make up a higher proportion of the general population in the US than in other developed nations, is the point.

    Some could see this - and the implied higher risk of getting shot/killed - as a reason for the US being a shithole, is all I'm saying.

  15. #15
    Chakat sex pillow
    Registered: Sep 2006
    Location: not here
    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    I don't know how guns are viewed in your country, but millions of people use guns everyday in America, for hunting, for sport, or for self-defense, in a completely harmless and peaceful way. Unfortunately, the few people who decide to use guns for violence are the ones that everyone likes to focus on.
    I don't see how guns used in self-defense are exactly harmless or peaceful, but nitpicking aside, you do understand the implicit difference between allowing civilian access to something that is meant to be utilitarian and thus hard to kill people with, and something that is intentionally engineered to end lives several orders of magnitude more quickly and efficiently, yes?

    And sure, we use guns in sport - air guns. Someone might lose an eye, but accidentally or even intentionally blowing someone's brains out the back of their head isn't exactly a problem here. I'll leave you to address the data and what everyone else is saying.
    Last edited by Sulphur; 18th Jan 2018 at 15:42.

  16. #16
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulphur View Post
    ...but accidentally or even intentionally blowing someone's brains out the back of their head isn't exactly a problem here. I'll leave you to address the data and what everyone else is saying.
    That's a part of the problem I mentioned above. There's a big believe that you need to outright KILL any intruders who are in your house. If they're lurking about on your property, it's your God given right to take their life.

    This was exemplified with this one pro-gun commercial I saw awhile back. This one lone woman hears someone trying to jimmy the lock to get into her house late at night. So you know what she does? She takes an AR15, and goes full bore through the sliding glass doors, killing the guy. I'm sitting there the whole time thinking all she needed to do was fire a handgun once, and the guy would've ran away.

    And this same belief does end up with the Castle Doctrine adherents going to person for a good dime or a quarter. I read an article about some guy who sees someone lurking around his shed in the backyard. He does what any Red Blooded American would do in that situation. He slides up his window, takes out his rifle, and snipes the guy from a hundred yards, killing him instantly. He proudly proclaims this fact to the police when they show up, and, hey, guess what? VOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER!

    For a society that's so gung-ho about our guns, we sure aren't big on advocating or practicing common sense with them.

  17. #17
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    To be clear, I didn't want to turn this into yet another 'discussion' on the US and guns, just to point out that there are ways to brand any country a shithole given the right set of hand-picked data.

  18. #18
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    It's too late, N'Al. The gun cat has been let out of the bag.

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck!!!

  20. #20
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    See, now that's just fucking awesome. Why would anyone NOT want to talk about that?

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    For 'few people' just read 'AK-toting feline'. Voilą.

  22. #22
    New Member
    Registered: Jan 2018
    I know that the general stereotype for anyone who is pro-gun is exactly the type in that commercial or in the article. A trigger happy redneck kinda person. But that stereotype takes away from everyone who treats firearms with reverence and respect. The idiots and murderers of the U.S. give a really bad reputation to the rest of us lawful gun owners, and it's understandable. When you hear about someone killing 50 people at a music concert, it is scary to think about. But their fucked up actions shouldn't impede our rights as American citizens to bear arms. In the UK, alcohol is legal, in fact it's legal 3 years earlier than in the U.S. But think about how many people are killed in drunk driving accidents, I don't know the exact number, but I bet it's a lot. Yet drinking is still legal, because the idiots who drink and kill people are pegged as the problem, not the alcohol. The fact that they were stupid and drove drunk and killed someone shouldn't stop everyone from being able to drink responsibly. And yes, the U.S. does make up most of the gun deaths in the world, but that is NOT a gun problem. A gun doesn't shoot on its own, it requires either an idiot who isn't using it responsibly, or a murderer to pull the trigger. Those people are the problem, not the guns.

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Landahn
    So what.

  24. #24
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    I know that the general stereotype for anyone who is pro-gun is exactly the type in that commercial or in the article. A trigger happy redneck kinda person. But that stereotype takes away from everyone who treats firearms with reverence and respect.
    This is somewhat true. Everyone is big on stereotyping everyone these days. It's part and parcel with our current political clime.

    I mean hell, in a rather vague, nonchalant sorta way, you could consider me pro-gun, simply for the fact that changing the Bill of Rights would open up a particularly nasty can of worms, and even if we did, it'd take a herculean effort to enforce a gun ban in a country where there are as many guns as people, and half the people who own them are pretty hardcore about it. It'd make more sense to address the root of the issue, and find out what we can do to prevent more gun violence.

    ...but unfortunately, the NRA has successfully lobbied a ban against any such studies, so I guess all we can do is endure, and hope for the best.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: uk
    Quote Originally Posted by xStevieNx View Post
    In the UK, alcohol is legal, in fact it's legal 3 years earlier than in the U.S. But think about how many people are killed in drunk driving accidents, I don't know the exact number, but I bet it's a lot. Yet drinking is still legal, because the idiots who drink and kill people are pegged as the problem, not the alcohol.
    You realise guns are legal here too right? We just use them for hunting and for pest control rather than suicide and murder.

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