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Thread: Please ask your basic (newbie) questions in here.

  1. #1076
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    to Ziemanskye

    Thank you for your answer! Great idea, I`m trying to make it work at the moment. It`s my first teleport but "the hope dies after the wold"

    Trully I did not think that the book will open before the player will teleport. But NOW I think that the active mesh "Closed book" can be replaced with active mesh "Opened book" by hammer`s touch and only after that that book can teleport by player`s touch. I`m studing The Shalebrige Cradle for this effect.

    I`ll gladly open a new topic if I`ll find out how to do it... I`m first time at a forum, sorry...

  2. #1077
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2005
    Location: Scotland
    We're a friendly group, on the whole, and we will help if we can - this thread just got a bit full of higher-level questions like this one that can be searched quicker if they're seperated. (There's a New Thread button, top right, or somewhere failry obvious if you look around for it and need it)

    I am fully confident this hasn't come up before though: I only ended up messing with Teleporters when playing with the Matinee stuff (since Garrett's head comes off his body, but the body stays where it was when the camera moves, I was using scripts to teleport G from one of the camera path to the other)

    You are going to end up with a lot of scripts on this effect, but it sounds like it's going to be unusual and cool, so it'll be worth it.

  3. #1078
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    again about a teleport book

    To Ziemanskye:
    Thanks! Now I see this "Tread" button - I was wrong translating its name.

    As for teleport book: everything works by itself but not together!
    I made a teleport (it works), than I locked it, than I gave to opened book script "Push button" and to teleport volume scripts "Togle Locked", "Open Door", "Close Door" - everything as for a button and a secret door. It does not works even when I`m trying to change "Frob" to book and volume. Does it need anything else?

    Please help!

  4. #1079
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2005
    Location: Scotland
    This could be hard to do across the language differences, since I use English natively and you don't - meaning in this case I'm not sure what you have working and have tried.

    So, as I understand it:

    Components - Teleport Volume and Target, Closed Book (as a door) and Item to use on it

    Desired Actions - Use the Item on the Books > opens the books, activates the teleport (possibly consumes the Item)

    Rough Scripts I'd Use (there will be other ways to do this) -

    Code:
    If (player uses the Item on the Book)
      Set a Flag (TeleportBook01) = True
      Trigger Door at end of Link (*To open the book, though in truth I'd likely have the ClosedBook and OpenBook as seperate StaticMeshes, one bOutOfWorld either way and just swap them)
      ChangeProperty (IsActive) on Volume (Link) to TRUE
      (*Do NOT reset script, we only want this to work once, I think)
    Code:
    (When Volume (Myself) is Breached by Player) && Flag (TeleportBook01)
      Teleport player to (TeleportDestination)
      Set Flag (TeleportBook01) = False
      ChangeProperty (IsActive) on Volume (Myself) to False
    Now it's been a while since I've played with the scripting, but I think that should do it, once you work out how to translate the fragments into whatever we actually have as Conditions and Actions.

    The volume is a volume, not a door, so the locked, Open Door and Closed Door scripts won't work with it. Depending on how the book is set up they might with that, but I'm not sure if you can lock doors open. The Volume just needs it's own VolumeActive property or whatever it is called turned to True when you want it to work: if the player is inside it when it activates it *should* just teleport the player instantly.

    If you only want the player to teleport when they frob the book a second time (first time opens it) then the book sets the VolumeActive, waits a second or two then turns it off again: the volume itself doesn't really do anything in that case apart from set the TeleportDestination and flicker into life. I think - as I say it's been a while: you may still need the "When Breached By Player > Teleport To ____" script on the volume.

  5. #1080
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    To Ziemanskye

    IT WORKS!!! Yes! Thank You! Thank You! If it was not TOO personal, I would say "I love you" ...

    I'll tell a litle about it if you do not mind.

    First of all I could not find how to "Set a Flag (TeleportBook01) = True", sorry. Could you explain what is it and why it is necessary?

    Second, I decided to "Lock" the volume like a door because under Actor Links the Editor showed "Attach IsLocked script". Well, I belived to a lie

    Now about scripts:
    Player takes a hammer from his inventory, uses it on a book and - mama mia! - he is in new room.

    Script "InvHammer_OnBook":
    Conditions:
    1) Recieved trigger message [Hammer1];
    2) Query if linked objects [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from linked objects [MYSELF]
    Actions:
    1) Send trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    2) Set the 'Enabled' flag to [TRUE] for a volume poited by trigger link [TeleportBook01]

    Script "InvHammer_OnVolume":
    Conditions:
    1) Recieved trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    (By the way! Everything works withought "When linked volume [MYSELF] is breached by the player"!!! I do not know why... Could this condition be "automatic" or "bild in"??? )
    Actions:
    1) Teleport the object at end of [PLAYER] to Destination Teleport = [HHYard1]

    And then I created a Triger Link from Book to Volume with name "TeleportBook01".
    That's all.

    In any case there is a bug:
    player has to come into the volum AFTER using the book. If (when he is using the book) he is ALREADY inside the volume, he has to come OUT of it and then again come INTO volume.
    Any suggestions are welcome!

    Best regards!

  6. #1081
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2005
    Location: Scotland
    You need to create flags yourself, rather than setting pre-existing properties, and to be honest I've never worked out how to do it, I just know that it is possible.

    As for going in an out of the volume...

    I don't know - you could try putting the conditions for "When Volume breached..." on and see if that makes it work: I don't still have the scripts I was using in my version, so I'm not sure how it worked in specifics, but the actions were (roughly)

    When Object frobbed:
    Start the Matinee
    Wait 2 seconds
    Activate Volume

    I don't think I used the Teleport script action, just the properties you can give to the volume. You might be able to just add that teleport Action to the _OnBook script and have it move the player directly without needing the volume at all.

    Sorry I can't remember more accurately.

  7. #1082
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Bucharest,Romania
    Q1: Can I resize the static meshes?
    Q2: Rendering problems. I have some surfaces, especially floors which turn black, G can fall through them etc... What are they caused by?

    ps: I apologize if the questions seem stupid or repeated.

  8. #1083
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Dortmund, Germany
    Don't worry. There are no stupid questions and besides that you are in the basic newbie question thread, so just feel free to ask whatever you want.

    Q1: I don't have the editor running at the moment, because a recently reinstalled my system, but there should be an option like drawscale in the static meshes properties. But Take care with scaling staticmeshes, because the collision hull isn't scaled by this process. So you have to disable physics on that object and create your own collision hull out ot bsp covered with the BF texture (don't use the tag in the staticmeshes browser to disable physics for that static mesh, because then you'll disable physics on all instances of this object in the whole map, use the property among physics). It might also be good to create it as a semisolid to reduce cuts and especially if you want to make the collision hull more complicated than just a cube you will want to use this function, because it will very much likely happen to create some serious bsp errors otherwise.

    Q2: Hmn sounds like a BSP error. Now the pain begins... A screen would be usefull though. Hard to tell what it really is. When you look through those black floors do you see other things totall disturbed in there? If so, it definitely is a BSP error and I shall go search for fixing tutorials, someone else gave me when I was the first time at that point. (And you will come there eventually)

  9. #1084
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Bucharest,Romania
    Hers's a pic:


    Sometimes you see pitch black, sometimes you see the rest of the mission through the floor.

  10. #1085
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2005
    Location: Europe
    Note: Alignment

    You must make sure that adjacent brushes are always lined up correctly. Don't overlap them, as it is likely to cause trouble later on and it is also bad practice in any case. There is absolutely no reason to do this, ever.

    According to documentation at UDN, you should intersect a brush before subtracting it, and deintersect before adding. This ensures that there is no overlapping.

    http://ttlg.com/wiki/index.php?title...g_with_Brushes



  11. #1086
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Dortmund, Germany
    Don't use that (de-)intersect-method. It causes a lot of errors as well if BSP becomes too complex. The best way is to build the brushes by hand with a bit of logic thinking. If you get an error later, you can examine the cuts in the zoneportal-view or just check the brushes. But yes, that looks like an alignment mistake. Try the function "report off-grid brushes" and align all of them. Use this very often to make sure all brushes are aligned properly. If you haven't used it 'till now, you'll probably see a whole bunch of brushes out of order.

  12. #1087
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2005
    Location: Europe
    Yes. "It causes a lot of errors" when used icorrectly.

  13. #1088
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Dortmund, Germany
    Uhm the algorithm doing that operation doesn't seem to be 100% perfect and because of that it comes to errors sometimes. Besides, ask every professional mapper. None of them would let a machine do, what oneself can do a lot better... Of course on simple intersect-operations it works very well, but you can also just cut the brush as you want and mostly get a cleaner result that way.

  14. #1089
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2001
    Location: Central Europe
    STiFU - I believe it's not really about intersecting method, more about how Flesh engine handles the BSP surfaces. For instance, you created a brush, and you want to do some vertex editing on it, let's say you're going to make a substractive cuboid, and it's bottom face will serve as the street going down. You have to remember to place both lower vertices at the same height, otherwise you'll probably get a bsp hole.

    Some other time it's about the angle. Looks like planes can be manipulated to some extent. In some cases you can get obtuse angles in your brushes with absolutely no problem, and some other time the acute angle is something virtually impossible, while it shouldn't be.

    My best bet is to keep brush surfaces straight, do not bend them along any axes or diagonals, and everything should be fine. That usually means careful, accurate VE and placing at least two vertices at the same height, length, etc.
    Last edited by Judith; 3rd Feb 2007 at 16:59. Reason: Traced terribly troublesome typos ;)

  15. #1090
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2005
    Location: Dortmund, Germany
    Of course you always have to remember that flesh can't create two polys out of one, like every rendering tool would do if you vertice edit an object, which really sucks because it would be so easy to implement this "feature". But intersecting gets weird when it comes to complicated objects. Add a tube with 64 sides, then a cube, intersect it along the tube and I bet in 50% of the tries it will cause some serious errors, even if you use semisolids... So on complicated objects, either create a static mesh or cut it by yourself. You're always on the save side with static meshes. Some disadvantages are coming along with that too though, like you can't really edit the texture layout from within the editor. You can only apply others, but not the scale and stuff like that. (But you know that)

    But of course I believe in what you say, because by now you got way more experience with T3ED than me, since I am not working with it anymore since about a year... Still like trying to help people though!

  16. #1091
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    To Ziemanskye

    Thanks again for your answers!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemanskye View Post
    You need to create flags yourself, rather than setting pre-existing properties...
    I shall, I promise!!! But only after you tell me what do you mean under the word "FLAG"? Please, forgive my stupidity, but... is it a flag on the map near the book? Or is it any property that should be changed? And what shall I get after I "create flag myself"?


    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemanskye View Post
    As for going in an out of the volume...

    I don't know - you could try putting the conditions for "When Volume breached..." on and see if that makes it work...
    I did but nothing changes. I've got two volumes in one location. Volume 1 has condition "When Volume breached..." and volume 2 does not have it. Both telepot are OK. Both has the same bug. It looks like condition "When Volume breached..." has no effect.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemanskye View Post
    You might be able to just add that teleport Action to the _OnBook script and have it move the player directly without needing the volume at all.
    No, it does not work. It was the reason I came to this forum! I tried to create a script like Cond. 'When I'm frobbed by player..." Act. "Teleport player to destination..."
    I checked it today again - nothing good.

    Best regards!

  17. #1092
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Exiled in sassenachland
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiens View Post
    But only after you tell me what do you mean under the word "FLAG"? Please, forgive my stupidity, but... is it a flag on the map near the book?
    A flag is simply a boolean (true/false) global variable. You can manipulate them using the various script commands available. There are a bunch pre-defined for use in the original missions, but you're better off defining your own so a) you can give them your own descriptive names, and b) any pre-defined scripts won't mess with your flags by accident. You can define your own flags in the View menu --> Global Variables --> Flags. Once you've added your flag into the list it'll be available for use with the script conditions and actions linked above.

    Regarding the other stuff, well like Z I see no reason why one script wouldn't work. One thing worth trying - I often use test actions to make sure my scripts are firing when they should be. I have a couple of text files called test1.sch and test2.sch containing simple "I'm working! 1" messages in my Books\English folder, and test scripts by adding an extra action:
    Flash non-blocking, formatted text from file [test1] and fade out after [2.00]
    If the text appears when you frob the book then you at least know the script is running ok. This is particularly useful when messing around with volumes, as they have a tendency to simply not trigger on the "When I am breached by player..." type conditions. I seem to remember a frob condition not working for me once but I can't remember why - it was probably something stupid I was doing.

  18. #1093
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    to GlasWolf

    Quote Originally Posted by GlasWolf View Post
    A flag is simply a boolean (true/false) global variable...
    Oh! THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!! I fogot about WIKI...

    Quote Originally Posted by GlasWolf View Post
    One thing worth trying - I often use test actions to make sure my scripts are firing when they should be... ...
    Thanks! I'll try to do it now.

  19. #1094
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2005
    Location: Scotland
    I think with the volumes you need it to be a deliberate AND type of Condition.

    Er..

    Logic: AND
    --> If this message has been recieved...
    --> When this volume is breached...

    I think: this could be like the "Query if..." conditions that don't check right on their own accord, so need to be forced into co-operation with something else.

    I know this is possible because I've done it, I just can't remeber how.

  20. #1095
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Bucharest,Romania
    thanks for the help folks. It works fine now. I would say that it was caused by some 'illegal' brush operations. i'm clean as a saint now . And i'll remember these things...

  21. #1096
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2001
    Location: Central Europe
    Quote Originally Posted by STiFU View Post
    Of course you always have to remember that flesh can't create two polys out of one, like every rendering tool would do if you vertice edit an object, which really sucks because it would be so easy to implement this "feature". But intersecting gets weird when it comes to complicated objects. Add a tube with 64 sides, then a cube, intersect it along the tube and I bet in 50% of the tries it will cause some serious errors, even if you use semisolids... So on complicated objects, either create a static mesh or cut it by yourself. You're always on the save side with static meshes. Some disadvantages are coming along with that too though, like you can't really edit the texture layout from within the editor. You can only apply others, but not the scale and stuff like that. (But you know that)

    Ahh, you're right, I actually didn't think about something that complicated I got used to making bsp brushes up to, let's say, 16 sides. Everything more complicated goes through 3dsmax. Automatic thinking - bad

  22. #1097
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    to Ziemanskye

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemanskye View Post
    I think with the volumes you need it to be a deliberate AND type of Condition...
    I'm so sorry, I did not mention it but I knew about Logical Conditions before. And I used
    " Logic: AND
    --> If this message has been recieved...
    --> When this volume is breached..."
    into script for Volume 2. But Volume 2 did the same things than Volume 1 did.

    Please, forgive me for my questions!!!
    (And do not kill me! )
    Your advises were a real help.
    Both Volumes are GOOD. Both teleports are OK.
    But NOW I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND - why there is no difference?
    I decided somebody could know this bug...

  23. #1098
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Exiled in sassenachland
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiens View Post
    I'm so sorry, I did not mention it but I knew about Logical Conditions before. And I used
    " Logic: AND
    --> If this message has been recieved...
    --> When this volume is breached..."
    into script for Volume 2. But Volume 2 did the same things than Volume 1 did.
    I've sort of lost track on where you've got to - maybe you could post the exact scripts you're using now so we can check them over. However, what I think Z is talking about are conditions that are only true at a specific instant, for example when the player breaches a volume. If you have an AND construct that involves two of these "instantaneous" conditions - for example a trigger message being received AND a volume being breached - then it will never fire because these two things will not be set true at exactly the same time. For example, if you have script conditions:
    Code:
    Logic [AND] operator
     - When linked volume(s) [TriggerScript] are breached by [Category_Player]
     - Received trigger message [SomeMessage]
    Then it won't work. But if you use:
    Code:
    Logic [AND] operator
     - When linked volume(s) [TriggerScript] are breached by [Category_Player]
     - Query if flag [SomeFlag] is set to [TRUE]
    Then that will be fine. Is that something like what you're doing? Is that even what everybody's talking about?

    If your scripts are firing at the correct times then you can ignore all of this, as the problem must be with the actions rather than the conditions. Worth bearing in mind anyway. Note that Krypt explained this some time ago, and far more eloquently than I...

  24. #1099
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2005
    Location: Scotland
    That's kind of what I was on about, and it did remind me of something else too: the order things are put into the the AND is important, cause if the first one fails it doesn't check the second (and if the first is a Query... it never checks the first )

    So putting the "If Volume..." first might actually solve it. It's kind of weird like that.

  25. #1100
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2007
    Location: Moscow, Russia

    to GlasWolf and Ziemanskye

    THANK YOU, people! REALLY THANK YOU! YOU HELPED ME A LOT!!! Now I get it. Let me explane.

    I did not say that my book is INSIDE the volume. This volume is in the center of the room. Volume is unactive. When I touch the book I'm already inside the volume. For teleporting I have to come into the volume for TWO times: one to touch the book (then I must go OUT of the volume) and second to come again into the volume. It is not enough. The best is to come to the book, touch it and at the same moment teleport to a new room.

    Here is my "homework".

    First about your advises. Here are scripts I tryed:

    1)

    InvHammer_OnBook:
    Cond.:
    - Received trigger message [Hammer2]
    - Query if oject [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from [MYSELF]
    Act.:
    - Send trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    - Set 'Enabled' to [TRUE] for a volume pointed to by a trigger link named [TeleportBook01]

    InvHammer_OnVolume:
    Cond.:
    Logic [AND] operator:
    - Received trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    - When linked volumes [MYSELF] are breached by [PLAYER]
    Act.:
    Teleport the object at end of [PLAYER] to Destination Teleport = [HHYard1]


    2) for this script I created a flag "TeleportBookFlag" as GlasWolf told

    InvHammer_OnBook_2:
    Cond.:
    - Received trigger message [Hammer2]
    - Query if oject [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from [MYSELF]
    Act.:
    - Set flag [TeleportBookFlag] to [TRUE] expires on map change to [FALSE] expires on mission [20]
    - Send trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    - Set 'Enabled' to [TRUE] for a volume pointed to by a trigger link named [TeleportBook01]

    InvHammer_OnVolume_2:
    Cond.:
    Logic [AND] operator:
    - When linked volumes [MYSELF] are breached by [PLAYER]
    - Query if flag [TeleportBookFlag] is set to [TRUE]
    Act.:
    Teleport the object at end of [PLAYER] to Destination Teleport = [HHYard1]


    3)

    InvHammer_OnBook_2:
    Cond.:
    - Received trigger message [Hammer2]
    - Query if oject [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from [MYSELF]
    Act.:
    - Set flag [TeleportBookFlag] to [TRUE] expires on map change to [FALSE] expires on mission [20]
    - Send trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    - Set 'Enabled' to [TRUE] for a volume pointed to by a trigger link named [TeleportBook01]

    InvHammer_OnVolume_3:
    Cond.:
    Logic [AND] operator:
    - Query if flag [TeleportBookFlag] is set to [TRUE]
    - Received trigger message [TeleportBook01]
    Act.:
    Teleport the object at end of [PLAYER] to Destination Teleport = [HHYard1]


    4) here is my old try to teleport withough any volume:

    InvHammer_OnBook_4:
    Cond.:
    - Received trigger message [Hammer2]
    - Query if oject [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from [MYSELF]
    Act.:
    Teleport the object at the end of [PLAYER] to Destination Teleporter [HHYard1]


    Scripts (1), (2) and (3) makes teleport volume enabled but I have to come into the volume twice.
    Script (4) does not work at all . Later I shall test it by GlasWolf's method...

    AT THE END I HAVE SUCCEEDED!!! I got the way of teleporting I needed.

    (5)

    InvHammer_OnBook_5:
    Cond.:
    - Received trigger message [Hammer2]
    - Query if oject [PLAYER] are within [128] unreal units from [MYSELF]
    Act.:
    Teleport player to Destination Map [HauntedHouse1] Destination Teleporter [HHYard1]. Clear save maps? [FALSE]

    This script lets Player touch Book with Hammer and... the next moment find himself into a new location!!!

    THANK YOU AGAIN!!!

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