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View Poll Results: How long will Trump be President?

Voters
132. You may not vote on this poll
  • 1 Term (4 Years)

    26 19.70%
  • 2 Terms (8 Years)

    41 31.06%
  • 1st Term Impeachment/Assassination

    48 36.36%
  • 2nd Term Impeachment/Assassination

    4 3.03%
  • I don't know what's going on!

    13 9.85%
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Thread: ✮✮✮ !Trump Dump! ✮✮✮

  1. #11876
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue View Post
    Yeah, value and identity politics. If I were in grad school analysis mode, I'd go a step further and say rhetoric that squeezes people's existential fears so much their amygdala and HPA axis spike and pump out so much cortisol and adrenaline they literally can't sit still until they "do something about it".
    +1

  2. #11877
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    That's on the cultists' side. I didn't even get to the narcissist cult leader's side. There our go-to hormones are oxytocin and dopamine (and cortisol by the constant paranoia of betrayal by the people close to them.) Oxytocin invokes that warm, calm feeling one feels from being "loved and accepted" we all know, which can be closely associated with cortisol (fear and paranoia) when one fears the acceptance will be rescinded (which for people with Cluster B disorders like Narcissist Personality Disorder is what mommy and daddy did to them growing up).

    The defense mechanism a child with NPD develops (in combination with a rewiring of their amygdala/hippocampus, disrupting the HPA Axis) in the face of that early trauma and rejection is to create a false self (there is no real self underneath it) with a grandeous narrative to incessantly reassure themselves that they are worth not only of love but extreme adulation as the best human ever, protecting an incredibly fragile ego from the horror of the smallest hint of not only imperfection, but an inch less than perfection.

    Of course oxytocin, that warm feeling (often combined with endorphins, that give a quick euphoria), is the wall they desperately need to fend off the constant horror under the surface, that their hippocampus keeps buzzing about, and the flood of cortisol and fear it invokes. But what anyone who's lived with a person with NPD (pwNPD) knows very intimately (whether they understand the endocrinology or not), is that the person also gets a dopamine hit in anticipation of an oxytocin and endorphin injection. And as we all know, anything that's associated with an anticipatory dopamine hit can be a source of hand-shaking, irresistible addiction (drugs, incessant masturbation, self-cutting, I mean the really affectively-charged addictions).

    There's a term for the structure of an interpersonal relationship with a pwNPD as they manipulate and coax their poor partner/constituency into providing them that constant dopamine hit: supply. And if a pwNPD doesn't maintain an incessant flow of supply, they also suffer extreme withdrawal symptoms that will make them fly into rage and psychic collapse, particularly focused against their dealer that has started cutting off their supply.

    And like any dope addict that is ready to prostitute themselves in the most humiliating ways, eagerly debasing themselves, their pulse surging, to get that next hit of dope, Trump will say literally anything to get adulatory feedback, the more affectively charged, the bigger the cultist howls, the bigger the hit (hence the value and identity politics part). His rallies are supply orgies: Lock her up! Build that wall! Weakness is sickness!* Strength is power! Hail Trump!

    To summarize from a nice article on this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychology Today - This Is What Really Makes Narcissists Tick
    The narcissist’s symptomatic need for admiration is all about propping up an extraordinarily fragile ego. So when they’re unable to get outward adulation, they can collapse from within.

    The PDM summarizes their dilemma this way:

    “The characteristic subjective experience of narcissistic individuals is a sense of inner emptiness and meaninglessness that requires recurrent infusions of external confirmation of their importance and value. . . . When the environment fails to provide such evidence, narcissistic individuals feel depressed, ashamed, and envious of those who succeed in attaining the supplies that they lack.”

    This vulnerability is also suggested by just how defensive narcissists can be when others negatively evaluate them. At the same time that they’re super-critical of others (to regularly “remind” themselves of their superiority), their egos are so frail that when someone attacks their words or actions they can fly into what I’ve alluded to as “narcissistic rage.” As I explain it in “The Narcissist’s Dilemma: They Can Dish It Out, But . . . ”:

    "Although narcissists don’t (or won’t) show it, all perceived criticism feels gravely threatening to them. . . . Deep down, clinging desperately not simply to a positive but grandiose sense of self, they’re compelled at all costs to block out any negative feedback about themselves.”
    Edit: I'm still learning this stuff myself. I think I got it right, or parts of it, but you know, grain of salt, feel free to correct anything if you know better, speaking especially to people who have lived with someone with NPD. I was the victim of a partner with another Cluster B disorder; they're interrelated, but there's always things you would never even imagine until you've experienced it yourself.

    * Edit2: Oh and I left out one of the big punchlines. The biggest affective supply kick comes from humiliation and shame play, especially the kind rooted in powerlessness, and that's how race and this business with a war criminal get involved. The biggest supply kicks come when there's an open reference to standing over the humiliation of absolute powerlessness. Emotionally, a pwNPD is back at 6 years old, completely powerless against the onslaught of their parents' rejection (the theory goes), humiliated and raging, and standing over the humiliating powerlessness of another person is pure projection of that rage into a kind of vicarious strike back at the heart of that inner turmoil.

    The two examples that come to mind would be the humiliating feebleness and powerlessness of a person of color against the presumed "blatant incompetence" of their "shithole countries" and people that can't help themselves ("a spade is a spade"), and the feebleness and powerlessness of a torture victim to stop the most humiliating offenses against their body and soul. You don't even have to be literally standing over the humiliation to get that supply kick; just a vague reference to a "victim's powerlessness against their humiliating weakness & they can't stop it" will do. Maybe the most common type of reference you see all the time is a wording that on-the-side devalues the trauma of the other. To list a few: "not even Hitler used chemical weapons", the 14/88 reference on the DoHLS site, "see you on the TRAIL, Pocahontas", forcing Native Americans to stand under the portrait of Jackson, pardoning a soldier convicted of war crimes, throwing toilet paper in Puerto Rico, separating children & confiscating US passports at the border, the denigrations of McCain and the Gold Star family, "I don't even wait... [when you're a star] You can do anything. Grab 'em by the pussy"... I mean go down the list. There's an example almost every day. They all make sense in terms of the supply kick of devaluing or referencing standing in a position of power over the feebleness of the weak towards something "shameful" they can't stop. That's clearly his drug of choice.
    Last edited by demagogue; 2nd Dec 2019 at 06:02.

  3. #11878
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    And more whitewashing of atrocities coming right up:


  4. #11879
    Manufacturing PMI misses again. It appears we are in the middle of a recession. Add to the coming increases in tech censorship, the overt message from the GOP that the working class can go to hell, the complete lack of willingness to discuss entire regions going from red to blue, you have to wonder if the GOP is trying to lose. No longer running out the clock, but the clock has now expired and they want to lose going forward.

  5. #11880
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    I've been wanting to call someone a spoony hooker for awhile now. I'm still waiting for that perfect moment.

  6. #11881
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue View Post
    That's on the cultists' side. I didn't even get to the narcissist cult leader's side. There our go-to hormones are oxytocin and dopamine (and cortisol by the constant paranoia of betrayal by the people close to them.) Oxytocin invokes that warm, calm feeling one feels from being "loved and accepted" we all know, which can be closely associated with cortisol (fear and paranoia) when one fears the acceptance will be rescinded (which for people with Cluster B disorders like Narcissist Personality Disorder is what mommy and daddy did to them growing up).

    The defense mechanism a child with NPD develops (in combination with a rewiring of their amygdala/hippocampus, disrupting the HPA Axis) in the face of that early trauma and rejection is to create a false self (there is no real self underneath it) with a grandeous narrative to incessantly reassure themselves that they are worth not only of love but extreme adulation as the best human ever, protecting an incredibly fragile ego from the horror of the smallest hint of not only imperfection, but an inch less than perfection.
    So what happens if someone like that is, say, booed by a stadium full of people? Pretend that they said, "Boo-urns" or extra long sessions with Hannity?

  7. #11882
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    They'll make themselves out to be the victims in that situation. That they're hated only because of *insert conspiratorial explanation here*, and that the real, not-brainwashed think-for-themselves type actually love him.

  8. #11883
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    That's what I do.

  9. #11884
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    It does help with the shame, doesn't it?

  10. #11885
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    Shame? Buahahahahahahahahah! That's so nineteenth century.

  11. #11886
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Comeon, you know what I'm talking about. That weird pressure you get in your belly when people make you feel bad? You're supposed to make them feel bad back for making you feel the bad belly feel.

  12. #11887
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    Yes that happens (he claims to be the victim) but practically speaking it's even simpler, he just won't remember it happening. He'll say he got a standing ovation, and sure there might have been a few deadbeat dumbocrats booing, but they were overshadowed by all the cheers. And he (acts like he) really believes it.

    The part about memory being rewired (the hippocampus part) is one thing that makes it so mindbending. Edit. It's not only memory issues from what I've read, though. You can't separate it from instictive gaslighting, just outright lying and saying no you're crazy if you think people were booing, and memory of any actual event isn't even part of the equation.

    It's not for nothing that the main support forum for family members of people with Cluster B disorders is Welcome to Oz, because in the bizarro reality they live in, things just happen completely differently in their mind from what neurotypical people see. I was on the fence for a while if Trump was really in this camp, but so many of his delusional comments and sharpie moments keep making a pretty strong case for it, and the fact it keeps happening day after day after day.
    Last edited by demagogue; 3rd Dec 2019 at 06:37.

  13. #11888
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    Well at least he forgot that he thinks NATO is a useless joke. Of course his solution ham-fisted, get France to leave because Macron mirrored Trump's own attitude of a few months ago. Trump is correct that NATO members need to step up their financial contributions, largely due to an increasing threat from Russia, thanks in large part to Trump's meddling and empowerment of the Russian oligarchy...

    But I digress because we all know the real threat, the JOOOOOOZ!



    Jew Coup. Has a nice ring. I bet most Neo-Nazis could chant this, carry a tiki-torch and walk all at the same time.
    Last edited by Nicker; 3rd Dec 2019 at 09:38.

  14. #11889
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    OK - it's official, Republicans have gone fuck-nut crazy or are from a separate universe.

    Search "Lincoln". Click on the link, Trump VS Lincoln (who was the better Republican president). 53% of Republicans prefer Trump.

    Apparently there are no moderate Republicans for Democratic candidates to appeal to. Might as well go full socialist in your stump speeches.

  15. #11890
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Moderate Republicans are called Democrats. Seriously, though, you have to look pretty far to the right to find what goes for a moderate Republican these days. And as far as the Republican base is concerned, they'd vote for someone going to prison rather than for a Democrat. Not to mention for child molesters and white supremacists.

    Meanwhile, the US Navy puts out a memo:

    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/03/p...day/index.html

    US Navy leadership is emphasizing "responsibility for ethical and professional behavior" in the wake of a controversy over President Donald Trump's intervention in a war crimes case involving a Navy SEAL and the subsequent ousting of Navy Secretary Richard Spencer.

    Adm. Michael Gilday, the chief of naval operations who remains the top admiral following Spencer's exit, told all personnel in a memo obtained by CNN on Monday that he expects "Commanders at every level to epitomize integrity and exemplify our core values at all times." All sailors, he said, must "display the character and honor that has always defined our Navy."
    War crimes are bad. You shouldn't do war crimes. If you do them, you're bad. Because war crimes are bad, mkay. It's a bad thing to do war crimes. So don't be bad, by doing war crimes, mkay. That would be bad. Cause war crimes are bad, mkay.
    Last edited by Starker; 3rd Dec 2019 at 13:10.

  16. #11891
    Quote Originally Posted by demagogue View Post
    Yeah, value and identity politics. If I were in grad school analysis mode, I'd go a step further and say rhetoric that squeezes people's existential fears so much their amygdala and HPA axis spike and pump out so much cortisol and adrenaline they literally can't sit still until they "do something about it".
    Thankfully we have education today.

    https://fairplaygame.org/



    This game cured me of my internal bias. I love B.B.

    10/10, will make sure to replay every month as penance for my sins.



    But I digress because we all know the real threat, the JOOOOOOZ!



    Jew Coup. Has a nice ring. I bet most Neo-Nazis could chant this, carry a tiki-torch and walk all at the same time.

    Saw that.

    That's the dumbest shit I've ever heard.




    That guy expects me to seriously believe that a guy who loudly signals his loyalty to Israel, has a well known Jewish son in law, is closely aligned with the Likud party, has his inner sanctum heavily decorated with Jewish iconography, got his campaign backed by Sheldon Adelson and Peter Thiel, and had his real estate ventures financed by Jewish gangsters is the victim of a coup.......by jews?

    Give me a break.


    Edit: Incidentally we DID have some "Jewish" interference in such matters but it was against Obama after Netanyahu was pissed off at the Iran deal.
    Last edited by Tony_Tarantula; 3rd Dec 2019 at 21:10.

  17. #11892
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    I've been arguing a bunch of Facebook today, because I probably did something terrible in a past life deserving of severe punishment, and I came across an interesting little snipped of conversation involving some alt-right and far-right people.

    It starts off as a snipe against the Jews, and immediately veered into "NO! I LOVE ISRAEL! IT IS THE TOWELHEADS WHO ARE COMING TO KILL US ALL!" If it kept going on, I'm pretty sure they would've started calling each other normie cuck marxist RINOs or what the fuck ever.

    ...have we always been this stupid? I'm beginning to think we have, but it's become something of a trend recently just to let it all hang out.

  18. #11893
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    And I think Trump's loyalty to Judaism, Israel, and the rest only extends as far as his loyalty to everyone else, which mostly hinges upon how good they make him look in a photo op.

  19. #11894
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    So, it turns out that the top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee had some phone calls to Lev Parnas and Rudy Giuliani that he really should have disclosed:

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1Y72OE

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, often spoke to Representative Devin Nunes, the top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, as Giuliani peddled unproven allegations at the heart of the Trump impeachment inquiry, a congressional report said on Tuesday.

    Previously undisclosed telephone records appended to a 300-page report by the Democratic-led committee showed that Nunes also contacted Lev Parnas, a Ukrainian-American businessman who was helping Giuliani and has been indicted on charges of violating campaign finance law. Parnas has pleaded not guilty.

    Others with whom Giuliani had phone calls included current and former Nunes staffers, the White House budget office, and a journalist who promoted conspiracy theories involving Democratic former Vice President Joe Biden and the 2016 U.S. election.

    Giuliani’s numerous calls with Nunes and aides are significant because, as the top Republican on the committee, the California lawmaker cited those same theories as he led the fight against impeaching Trump.
    [...]

  20. #11895
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    I wonder if that gun will be smokin' enough to sway Base 45?

    Meanwhile, in a show of uncharacteristic brevity (but no less comprehensiveness) Rachel Maddow gives the Cliff's Notes version of the 300 page Intel Committee report.

    Last edited by Nicker; 4th Dec 2019 at 09:54.

  21. #11896
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    A literal smoking gun wouldn't convince any of them and they're proud of it.

  22. #11897
    Quote Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post

    It starts off as a snipe against the Jews, and immediately veered into "NO! I LOVE ISRAEL! IT IS THE TOWELHEADS WHO ARE COMING TO KILL US ALL!" If it kept going on, I'm pretty sure they would've started calling each other normie cuck marxist RINOs or what the fuck ever.
    Yes. Ziocons have always been that stupid. I spent part of my childhood growing up in the deep south surrounded by those people and then a good chunk of my adult career in regions where they're all over the place. One time in Colorado I was flipping through the FM channels and heard some preacher ranting about how "God will bless those who bless Israel" and positing that the reason the USA is having problems is because we don't bless Israel enough....as if it's even possible to do more than we do now.


    And I think Trump's loyalty to Judaism, Israel, and the rest only extends as far as his loyalty to everyone else, which mostly hinges upon how good they make him look in a photo op.
    Personally, probably. Politically he's dependent on them and without their backing the intelligence community (or "deep state" as Republicans call them) would have already thrown him out on his ass.



    Reason for posting:

    I've got a boomer parent in town who was playing a Tucker Carlson segment.

    I was pleasantly surprised: Tucker Carlson's whole segment attacks Republican congressmen for being on the take from a well known PE guy



    That segment is probably going to piss people off and it should, because what happened is an outrage. An entire town devastated to make a PE baron a few more bucks.


    I didn't know anyone on Fox could be this sensible and call out the current state of "capitalism" for the exploitive system it is. I agree that de-financialization is badly needed but I don't see anyone pushing for it except Curt Doolittle who has some significant issues of his own. Most of the right is busy shrieking about the stock market and most of the left is shrieking about "White people are terrible!".

  23. #11898
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2016
    Location: Trollinus Maximus
    Quote Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post
    I've been wanting to call someone a spoony hooker for awhile now. I'm still waiting for that perfect moment.
    how much do I need to charge you to be considered a hooker?

  24. #11899
    Even Guardian admits that, unfortunately, he's not going anywhere

    http://archive.ph/7jpAq


    All he's done at this point is give working class boomers the illusion that they actually have representation of their interests.

    Well he HAS so far kept us out of that Middle Eastern war the defense complex wants so badly, but domestically it's been just a slow continuation of the decline.

  25. #11900
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by jkcerda View Post
    how much do I need to charge you to be considered a hooker?
    I dunno. Three bucks?

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