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Thread: T2 FM: Quelle Galere Nov. 8/05

  1. #101
    Moderator
    Registered: May 2000
    Location: Thunder Bay, On., Canada
    Peter You should have gotten the gear from Agnes much earlier on in the mission. You don't actually get into the room at that point, you get the gear from a shelf, the objective to find Agnes checks off and I think you may get another new objective, though I'm not sure about that. You get there from the area where you go to meet Zyk and his minions. Instead of turning into that area, after you go through the hole behind the bookcase, you continue on and climb down a ladder.

    You can get to the turret off switch before descending into that area.

    I don't believe there is any way to avoid trigger the alarm when you send the urn up.

    5. The gear key doesn't get you a secret.

    Secrets:
    Switch the opens the door behind the painting.
    Putting statue in the empty wall nook.
    Switch on pipe in Zyk's bathroom.


    I know you don't like walkthroughs but I have one that does the mission in the proper order that I can send to you if you should want it.

  2. #102
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2000
    Location: Land of enchantment
    Thanks, Nightwalker.

    I have been puzzling over this today, and I independently found answers to some of my questions. Here is what I figured out.

    The key play to achieve semi-correct order is to open the bookcase before finding the hand of glory and going into the jail via the transporter. It is not required by keys, etc., to play in that order. I didn't find the bookcase button in my first play through, so I went into the jail area via the transporter and got trapped there. Allowing for that, I guess, the author allowed for the mission to end prematurely when you were stuck there. Two Agnes objectives checked off, but the final objective to rescue Agnes did not check off. This is a small bug with the objectives.

    If you open the bookcase before getting the hand of glory, then you canfind the gear and discover Agnes without the mission ending.

    The gear provides the intended route to get onto the beam in the security corridor. Clearly, the intended order of doing things is to find the gear, enter the statue combination, go up and stop the turret, go down, drop onto the beam, walk to the end and flip the switch for the ramp. I broke the mission by jumping from the turret ledge to the beam and activating the ramp while the turret was still running.

    There is a way to avoid the alarm. simply don't send the urn up. I got to the end without doing that. The script leading to the fire elemental and the transporter does not require it. I don't understand that that thing is for. Maybe I broke the mission again.

    By doing things in the intended order, I was able to achieve the "rescue" objective. But again, that was just a little objective bug. I actually got more loot in my first run. I am still missing one secret and 200 loot, but now I think I know where it is, thanks to your list.

    I had a lot more fun piecing this together than I would have using a walkthrough. Thanks for the offer anyway. I guess I ought to run through it again cleanly and try to do Perfect Thief. This was a really fun mission for me owing to the complexity of it and the fact that there were many interesting ghosting opportunities.
    Last edited by smithpd; 4th Dec 2009 at 21:48.

  3. #103
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2000
    Location: Land of enchantment
    OK. I played it again in the "proper" sequence and completed it in ghost mode. Perfect Thief is questionable. The issue has to do with the drill bit area. The AI you encounter in there comes out in alert mode even if there is no evidence that he sees or hears you, so it could be called either way.

    With the proper sequence, I found that I did not have to do the following:
    Mantle over the electric fence to get into the secure hallway.
    Creep up the hallway. There are elevators I had missed.
    Dodge the turret.
    Raise the urn.


    An interesting thing about the loot. My stats after taking the drill bit were 1300 / 1200. Is that normal, a bug, or what? I cheated a bit in the area with the lady thief and the loot stash, where she takes all the loot. I got into the loot room by skirting to the right, counterclockwise around the trap door trip spot. I found I could take two purses that rang like loot but did not add to the loot total. The other stuff had 0 value and did not ring. Since the total didn't increase at the time, I just went on, thinking that it didn't make any difference.

  4. #104
    Moderator
    Registered: May 2000
    Location: Thunder Bay, On., Canada
    I had 1300 at the end too. I don't know why the loot total doesn't register properly. Glad you got it all sorted out! I should have known you wouldn't be happy until you'd done it on your own.

  5. #105
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2000
    Location: Land of enchantment
    SPOILER ALERT

    Here is a ghost report and mini-review of the mission. Be forewarned - it has lots of spoilers. We don't normally use spoiler cover for ghost reports because we think that anyone reading the report wants to read about the details.

    @Nightwalker,
    Your assistance is greatly appreciated in spite of the fact that sometimes I leapfrog your answers. Knowing something is possible can spur on a better effort.

  6. #106
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2009
    Location: Bay Area, California

    Stuck... again!

    I've been playing missions again on different difficulty settings. I played through this one (on Hard?) a while ago. Now, am going through on Expert. I'm stuck!

    I made it to the room with the switch which raises the urn. But if I flip this switch I appear trapped. I can't do anything with the lock in the other room. Have no clue about where any elemental or wisp is. What have I done wrong?

    Anyone have any advice?

    Thanks!

  7. #107
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Small fix to prevent players accidentally finishing the mission early. If you fail to read the scroll beside Agnes when you collect the metal gear the mission will automatically finish when you collect the Hand of Glory. dml courtesy Unna

    Code:
    DML1//What a Drag //miss20.mis.dml
    
    +ObjProp 1557 "Scripts"
    {
    "Script 0" NVMetaTrap
    }
    +Link 2109 1557 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +Link 1421 2109 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +ObjProp 1557 "DesignNote"
    {
        "" NVMetaTrapMeta="Frobinert";NVMetaTrapTarget=1319
        
    }
    +ObjProp 2109 "Scripts"
    {
    "Script 0" TrapRelay
    }
    
    +ObjProp 2109 "TrapFlags"          
    {
     "" Once, Invert
    }
    
    +Metaprop 1319 -1629
    
    //
    
    +ObjProp 1322 "AI_Efficiency"    
    {
     "Enabled" false
    }
    +ObjProp 816 "AI_Efficiency"    
    {
     "Enabled" false
    }
    +ObjProp 1391 "AI_Efficiency"    
    {
     "Enabled" false
    }
    +ObjProp 1395 "AI_Efficiency"    
    {
     "Enabled" false
    }
    +ObjProp 680 "AI_Efficiency"    
    {
     "Enabled" false
    }
    //Conversations
    +Link 784 825 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +ObjProp 141 "ScriptTiming"       
    {
     "" 3000
    }
    +ObjProp 141 "Scripts"
    {
        "Script 0" TrapTimedRelay
    }
    +ObjProp 2302 "ScriptTiming"       
    {
     "" 7000
    }
    +ObjProp 2302 "Scripts"
    {
        "Script 0" TrapTimedRelay
    }
    +Link 784 141 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +Link 784 2302 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +Link 141 1436 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    +Link 2302 1409 "ControlDevice"
    {
    }
    Last edited by fortuni; 8th Jul 2019 at 06:27.

  8. #108
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    played this last night,could not remember the code in statue room but got the rest complete,so i was never able to get hand of glory,but did save the girl,the scripting was a bit wonky on this mission ,but i found it funny,glad it still worked on new dark,but the easy mantling,was a bit nice

  9. #109
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by downwinder View Post
    played this last night,could not remember the code in statue room but got the rest complete,so i was never able to get hand of glory,but did save the girl,the scripting was a bit wonky on this mission ,but i found it funny,glad it still worked on new dark,but the easy mantling,was a bit nice


    It’s impossible to save Agnes without having first collected the Hand of Glory, with or without the dml. You may have seen her through her cell window and thus found her, but to save her you need to complete the mission.

    What scripting are you saying was wonky? In what way? Recently test it and all was good with me.

  10. #110
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    after knocking out the 3 people in area with girl i saved and reloaded,the 3 people were standing then all started to wobble then all fell,and i was able to save her without hand of glory ,how i did mission was weird also as i did it a completely different way then i ever did before,even was in area's i never saw before,so it is possible as i did it,but since i did not have hand of glory when i was in cell with girl the mission did not end

    and i did not use any dml and version was from cheap thief missions site

    only objective not checked off was hand of glory the rest where all complete

    a lot of the npc scripting was delayed/etc when they should trigger,they ended up working but took a while for some to react

    also i never even needed to use the gear key to get around so those 2 gates stayed locked whole time for that one passage,found another way around

    hardest part was shooting button with arrow through lava mist

    if you don't believe me i can redo the mission how i did it and send you the save file? so you can load it,let me know if you interested,cause if you think its impossible then you got no idea how this mission is wonky and running back and forth from certain places when hitting what seems like a useless button,does let you get to other place in different area's with things that become active that seemed useless before

    also when was in room with urn ,since the warp thing did not work i had to open door where i can in then hit switch of course i unlocked the lock on wall before then i ran out before the gate could shut then i got to top part with a ghost chick who made a fireball appear to fight the 3 people not sure why, water arrow'd 2 lights then knocked 3 people out to save girl,and there was a lot more i did also i seems to skip stuff i had no idea i could

    when i was playing it it felt so much different then how i remembered it playing it,not sure if my saving and reloading when i made a mistake changed how mission ran?


    i can also play it for you live if you got the time to see how i did mission
    Last edited by downwinder; 6th Jul 2019 at 16:39.

  11. #111
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    The only thing that I thought could be of interest in fixing from what you said is that fact that you managed to hit the button through the lava pit mist, so I loaded a save and found it's next to impossible. It's also so completely obviously your not intended to shoot the button from the far side of the lava pit I will leave as is. Players will quite naturally release they need to find the Hand of Glory because there is a pedestal beside the lava pit with an outline of HoG on it.

    Are you still playing using Darkloader? Your scripting errors suggest some of your files are mess up, that and the fact that you managed to get to the end room in a convoluted way could be the cause of your wonky scripts. I only played this mission 2 days ago and came across no such issues, playing via clean T2 install patched with T2Fix only, using FMsel. Anything else and we can't accept reports of bugs/errors.

  12. #112
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    all thief 2 fan missions i use "fmsel" and for thief 1/g fan missions i use "dark loader" for some reason that is only way i can guarantee the missions work correct,if i don't it is possible to have errors while in a mission,weather texture issues/etc

    and i had no idea i wasent suppose to not use arrows on that button,i figured it was just a hard mission :P,but now that you mention that ,i think years ago when i played i did it correct way and did not have to see a lot of the mission?

    at least 2 area's i don't ever remember seeing

    but my question is ,how is one suppose to get that gear by girl and leave area,when there is no way out?as i warped in to that area,,i am guessing urn part is just to get to girls area? and nothing more,why does the warp by hammer not use able? i was able to get in there easy

    also my thief 2 and thief gold are from copy's so not sure what i got as far as files,but you right i probably have something wrong with something in files,my thief 1 is only game i got that is real original copy and my thief 3 i don't even play anymore


    also i think there is a way to win mission faster i just cant remember how it was done,something to do with gear lock some way to access it early,i just cant remember

  13. #113
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    The 6 statue puzzle is revealed by the placement of the bottles on the shelf in the guards room at the very beginning of the mission.

    The solution is to frob the statues in the following order:-
    Starting on your left and going in a circular direction 1,2,4,3

    I just replayed this mission playing via Newdark 1.27 and yes there appears to be some broken scripting in the end room. There Hammerite guards are in alert status but do not see Garrett or his female accomplice, so it's all too easy to get to Agnes and enter her cell. This is very different from when I played via 1.26 in which I had to reload 5/6 times to get to Agnes' cell as all hell had broken out and getting killed in the process.

    And I still don't understand what you mean by the Urn

    But thanks for the heads up about the end room, we'll see if we can fix it asap.

  14. #114
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    no problem on end room info,glad it helped

    now back to urn there is one way i figured out how to trigger urn and leave that room,took me a bit of time to figure out how to do it,but here is how,before you enter urn room get black jack ready run into room,and get behind hammer and knock him out once he opens door to back area=i am guessing i am not suppose to be able to get in there but i was easily able to ,then i unlocked that lock box on wall,then i opened the door i entered from and quickly hit urn switch then ran out room before door/gate could close then i was able to go to that one machine and hit ceiling switch to have that level machine move out the way to get to part with ghost girl/the warped to end room with girl in cell

    i never knew that was how the combo was gotten ,nice touch there,from what i remember on old dark that was way to get hand of glory to do mission correct way


    also i enjoy the mission a lot but seems like a bit much tile for non hostile area's
    Last edited by downwinder; 7th Jul 2019 at 17:42.

  15. #115
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    The AI's not attacking Garrett in the end room is caused due to modern faster CPU's making the Hammerite and Mage sometimes not reacting to Garrett being teleported into the cell area. Sometime it works, sometimes it doesn't. The dml in the post above has been updated with a fix that should make the AI's behave as expected.

    Ps. It's a decorative vase not an urn.
    Last edited by fortuni; 8th Jul 2019 at 13:23.

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