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Thread: The Box by ghost_in_the_shell Nov 25 2007

  1. #51
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2002
    Location: thief.wikia.com
    I made a video walkthrough, on normal, with full loot, and extra rooftop action at the end.

    Hope it's not too dark.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_hEDYTDtRE

  2. #52
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: Great. Now I can't get back in
    Thanx, ghost_in_the_shell & Sxerks - truly completed now
    The romantic guard's key:-
    spoiler:
    Normal; hole in the wall at the end of the street he patrols,
    Hard; top of doorframe of power station,
    Expert; covered in an earlier post by Shaz.

    Sxerks : very thiefy way of taking on the uninvited guests...

  3. #53
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales
    Sxerks - Wonderful and I'm now inspired to have a go at Midday Escape.

    Re: Ledge - I've tried so many times now with all methods but no go so would like to know exact position of rope arrow, if its possible to describe. I tried loads of different places! I'd really like to do this on expert.

  4. #54
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: Great. Now I can't get back in
    nickie : Since I can't remember exactly (it was just 1 of several experiments) I doubt if this will help -
    spoiler:
    about 1/2 way along visible part of top step & very close to the top - shooting, obviously, from ground level! And look slighly up as you jump, I think while holding the run key down.

    Sorry you're having more than the usual trouble with this *#!@ thing, so I really hope this (or something else) works.
    Hang in there, taffer

  5. #55
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales
    Thanks Sticky Fingers. Just find it weird I could only do it once. Will try the rope a few times now.

    Cracked it! Can do it every time. Thanks again.
    Last edited by nickie; 27th Nov 2007 at 12:29.

  6. #56
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)

    Nice Mission

    Thanks for this one Ghost, i really loved the new skybox, the new ambient music, i love when authors add new ambient musics, its like exploring a new atmosphere,music is essencial , also enjoyed the gameplay, and beautifull houses. Canīt wait for your next one

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by cardia1 View Post
    Thanks for this one Ghost, i really loved the new skybox, the new ambient music, i love when authors add new ambient musics, its like exploring a new atmosphere,music is essencial , also enjoyed the gameplay, and beautifull houses. Canīt wait for your next one
    Custom sky resources are great work of Vigil, downloadable from his site. I agree it's very nice, that's why I used it. Of course it's covered in the credits.
    Music is nice, but I have strong resolution to create some ambients for the next mission myself with free samples or use some other free music instead of using tracks of proffesional musicians. I covered their names in the credits, but obviously I don't have their permission to use it. This illegality is a pain for me, I'm rather lawful person But could'n resist to explore the potential of this music, and I think it's also good for the authors for promotional purposes, but it doesn't justify me at all. Try to not follow my example
    "Reliance upon others is weakness for the strong, but strength for the weak. Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time"
    The Box, WL

  8. #58
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Sheffield, UK
    excellent little mission, quite a lot to do in a relatively small space, nice touches like guards dropping lanterns which then go out when you KO them, nice positioning on guards, well hidden but not impossible secrets, very enjoyable

    and a nice use of spawning to get extra characters in to the game, too many games I've played spawn npc's into rooms with no other reasonable entrance after I've verified the room is empty, this one was quite believable, you can imagine the npc's entered the map while you were busy doing thiefy stuff

    the only thing I didn't like much were the non frobbable doors that won't open and look exactly like the frobbable doors that do open, it's a minor detail though

    nice mission

  9. #59
    New Member
    Registered: Nov 2007
    Location: Paris, France
    Nice mission! A bit small but really well done!
    I had no problem with the tiny ledge...
    I had some difficulty to enter the basement of the property via the small window, it should be slightly bigger.

  10. #60
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_in_the_shell View Post
    Custom sky resources are great work of Vigil, downloadable from his site. I agree it's very nice, that's why I used it. Of course it's covered in the credits.
    Music is nice, but I have strong resolution to create some ambients for the next mission myself with free samples or use some other free music instead of using tracks of proffesional musicians. I covered their names in the credits, but obviously I don't have their permission to use it. This illegality is a pain for me, I'm rather lawful person But could'n resist to explore the potential of this music, and I think it's also good for the authors for promotional purposes, but it doesn't justify me at all. Try to not follow my example
    Iīm sorry but if there is someone here wo will not follow your example its me, i canīt release a mission without adding a music from someone, its the musics that inspired me to create the missions, thatīs right in my missions i express what iīve imagined from a music, I donīt take this as a illegal thing, after all i name in the credits the authorīs name and iīm making his name and his/her productions get better well know by more people, kinda of propaganda.

    No Ghost, i will never release a mission without a music from a professional musician

    Music is everything in a mission

  11. #61
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Location: netherlands
    funny how perspective on music can be so different...

    I'm a musician and I love music ( my daily shot of vitamine M ) but I think I would never release a mission with music as an ambient.
    to be honest I dislike music playing throughout a mission, it distracts me from the gameplay. ( probably my fault, can't help it but I allways are analysing music when I hear it...)
    I do think missions need good ambients but those should be to create tension, give certain moods in specific areas.

    but I think it is a good thing that fm-authors can choose theirselfs if they add music to their missions.
    about the copyright isiue...
    for myself I don't think it is that a big deal...
    there is no intention that fm authors will make profit out of it.
    I do think it can be seen as a free promotion. furthermore if you use music you will have to downsample it to get it in the right format for thief. and I don't think anybody who likes the music and want a copy of it would rip it from your mission and use it.( because of the low fi )
    and ofcourse the fm author will have the credits in the readme...
    so the interested fm-player can get the info and go out and buy the song...

    but back to topic...
    let's talk about the box...

  12. #62
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2007
    Come on people... the ledge wasn't really that hard....
    I mean, 500 missions later, and you still can't do this?
    I managed to walk it after like, 2 tries and I'm not even that good.

    Consider this: the more perpendicular (to the wall) you push, the skinnier the ledge can be without a fall.

    There are so few difficult puzzles/missions around, thank God for this one!
    Last edited by denizen23; 28th Nov 2007 at 21:07.

  13. #63
    Ghost
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Did anybody find the other secret (besides the key)?

    That's all I'm missing, then I'm good to go...

    Edit: Oh, that's weird... I got the other secret -- but I don't know what it was!

    Dafydd
    Last edited by Dafydd; 30th Nov 2007 at 04:51.

  14. #64
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Sheffield, UK
    Dafydd: as I remember the secrets are the key and the hidden loot in the usurers office

  15. #65
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Not Kansas
    Great FM ghost! Good architecture & graphics, & the thieves were super-alert; always a welcome challenge! I'm definitely looking forward to your next FM.

    Now for a bit of constructive criticism. You've gotten enough complaints about that damned ledge, so I won't continue to beat that dead horse. But the lockpicking was way too tedious; after all these years the novelty has pretty much worn off and a lot of us have a tendency to grind our teeth if it takes more than one try to pick open a lock. The exceptions would be when you have to do some lockpicking while dodging guards, of course. Please don't take any criticism personally, ghost; and don't let it prevent you from continuing to create FMs. You've really got potential!

    Overall it really was a great little mission, especially for a first attempt. Thanks for your hard work and to all who contributed. Keep up the good work!

  16. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by cardia1 View Post
    No Ghost, i will never release a mission without a music from a professional musician

    Music is everything in a mission
    I agree that the music is important. Everything which can create mood in the mission is worth working on it.
    It's our choice to use some music or not, this time I used professional musicians' works, next time I want to try find some other way, that's all

    Quote Originally Posted by nightshifter View Post
    I'm a musician and I love music ( my daily shot of vitamine M ) but I think I would never release a mission with music as an ambient.
    to be honest I dislike music playing throughout a mission, it distracts me from the gameplay. ( probably my fault, can't help it but I allways are analysing music when I hear it...)
    I think I can imagine what you mean. I have difficulties reading books or learning something while music plays around. It often wins and focuses my concentration on itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by nightshifter View Post
    about the copyright isiue...
    for myself I don't think it is that a big deal...
    there is no intention that fm authors will make profit out of it.
    I do think it can be seen as a free promotion. furthermore if you use music you will have to downsample it to get it in the right format for thief. and I don't think anybody who likes the music and want a copy of it would rip it from your mission and use it.( because of the low fi )
    All this arguments were considered by me before releasing The Box. Finally I did what I did. I agree that it's probably not a big deal. I don't know how many FM's contains music of professionals, I know some that do, but I also know that some people prepares music for the mission just like any other part of work on FM (correct me if I'm wrong). I'm not a musician so it will be difficult for me to do that, but at least I want to find some other way than using somebody's else work without permission. My thought is that for example I won't be happy if somebody will use some part of The Box to create his own mission without asking me. Even if he don't get any profits from it...

    I think this is quite complicated topic.
    But you are right nightshifter: let's talk about The Box


    Quote Originally Posted by phil237 View Post
    I had some difficulty to enter the basement of the property via the small window, it should be slightly bigger.
    I confirm that issue. Next time I will try to be more cautious in after-betatest fixing stage. I wanted to modify it, but I forgot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dia View Post
    But the lockpicking was way too tedious; after all these years the novelty has pretty much worn off and a lot of us have a tendency to grind our teeth if it takes more than one try to pick open a lock. The exceptions would be when you have to do some lockpicking while dodging guards, of course. Please don't take any criticism personally, ghost; and don't let it prevent you from continuing to create FMs. You've really got potential!
    Lockpicking: it was reported by some testers that lockpicking in some places takes too long. I shortened the time on some locks, but of course it might still be annoing for some players.
    Don't be affraid Dia - I do not take it personally, in fact I'm happy of any comments about the mission. Constructive criticism is always welcome All opinions about the mission helps me a lot, and the positive ones increases my will to work more on second part. It will take much time anyway.
    "Reliance upon others is weakness for the strong, but strength for the weak. Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time"
    The Box, WL

  17. #67
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales
    Well, I think those people should be honoured to have their music in your fm ( ) and there's at least one person who's heard of them now who hadn't before so you're doing a service there I reckon. So I did a google. Reading Yoko Kanno's bio, I assume that's where you got your name ghost_in_the_shell?

    Back to The Box. The 'famous ledge' is a doddle once you have the right spot which I can now get every time and no need for inching along - running along works fine too.

  18. #68
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Not Kansas
    Yeah, once I got the hang of it, it wasn't as hard. What worked for me was to run at the ledge from an angle and continue looking up til I reached the wooden loft doors. Worked every time after that. Still, I wouldn't want to have to overcome an obstacle like that in every FM; it was getting a tad frustrating for awhile there.

  19. #69
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: swirling in the night wind
    Thanks ghost! I just finished this sweet little mission. Found the optional bonus almost right away, but had 1/2 hour's worth of saving and reloading to conquer the ledge My only complaint (other than the ledge you made for skinny butts only): It should be bigger!

  20. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by nickie View Post
    Reading Yoko Kanno's bio, I assume that's where you got your name ghost_in_the_shell?
    To be precise: Yoko Kano made music for the anime serie "Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex" which's origins are in the earlier film "Ghost in the Shell" by Mamoru Oshii (adaptation of Masamune Shirow's manga). I like this film very much and I took the name directly from this film's title. But, of course you are right in general, because my interest in the film led me to listen Yoko Kano's music for TV series later, so it's all connected

    Quote Originally Posted by redleaf View Post
    My only complaint (other than the ledge you made for skinny butts only): It should be bigger!
    I promise that the second part will be much bigger. At least that's my plan. I hope to include many objectives and large area to explore this time
    "Reliance upon others is weakness for the strong, but strength for the weak. Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time"
    The Box, WL

  21. #71
    I wish to say that I've tremendously enjoyed playing this little FM. Good job! It's nice and atmosphering. I like the ambient music, textures...

  22. #72
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2006
    Location: France (Saint-Gobain)
    Quote Originally Posted by nightshifter View Post
    funny how perspective on music can be so different...

    I'm a musician and I love music ( my daily shot of vitamine M ) but I think I would never release a mission with music as an ambient.
    to be honest I dislike music playing throughout a mission, it distracts me from the gameplay. ( probably my fault, can't help it but I allways are analysing music when I hear it...)
    I do think missions need good ambients but those should be to create tension, give certain moods in specific areas.

    but I think it is a good thing that fm-authors can choose theirselfs if they add music to their missions.
    about the copyright isiue...
    for myself I don't think it is that a big deal...
    there is no intention that fm authors will make profit out of it.
    I do think it can be seen as a free promotion. furthermore if you use music you will have to downsample it to get it in the right format for thief. and I don't think anybody who likes the music and want a copy of it would rip it from your mission and use it.( because of the low fi )
    and ofcourse the fm author will have the credits in the readme...
    so the interested fm-player can get the info and go out and buy the song...

    but back to topic...
    let's talk about the box...
    Oh can a music distract you from the gameplay , let me tell you how essential can be a music in a mission, the music will help the player to know in wich situation is facing, (suspance, danger, quiet, safety...etc,) music create different moods in a mission, music , architecture , atmosphere and gameplay are the most important things for me in a game and they all need each other to complete a game... donīt tell me when you hear a music in a movied you get distrated from the story or virse-versa

  23. #73
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Location: well hidden From Truart!!!!!!!
    Thanks Ghost for a wonderful time. It was a great cure for my insomnia.

    PS: The ledge was not a big deal for me.

  24. #74
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Location: netherlands
    Quote Originally Posted by Slayer56 View Post
    Thanks Ghost for a wonderful time. It was a great cure for my insomnia.
    I really don't hope you mean to say that it was so boring that you fell asleep playing this one

  25. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by nightshifter View Post
    I really don't hope you mean to say that it was so boring that you fell asleep playing this one
    Yeah, that's what came to my mind too at first, but I think that's not what Slayer56 wanted to say
    "Reliance upon others is weakness for the strong, but strength for the weak. Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time"
    The Box, WL

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