T3 FM: The Secret Room (25.12.2013) Update: v3.0

[Savar]

Username
Thanks for remembering the world of TDS

Nice choice of music for the starting location and the hidden wine cellar. I wonder where the music is from.

S.Sneaker, or J.Navarrete.

[<Username>]

Thanks for the music list. I will play the earlier versions of this mission in the next few weeks and post in this thread about my thoughts on them as well.

[<Username>]

I had more fun playing v2.0, mainly because I remembered where most of the secrets are and therefore did not spend so much time running around blind-frobbing everything. I did not notice too many differences to v3.0.

Stats:

• Expert difficulty
• 123 minutes
• 93% loot
• 1 hint needed

Elements I liked:

• Solid architecture throughout.
• Similar to the Blue Rose, the main hall is spectacular. Really nicely designed.
• I like the concept of revisiting parts of an area from another mission. Here, Garrett can enter a Scribe Room, which previously served as the Enforcer hideout in South Quarter in the earlier mission The Keeper. He can also climb into Heartless Perry's shop in South Quarter, which I thought was amusing.

Elements that could be improved:

• Why didn't the Enforcers just go into the courtyard, pull up a ladder to the balcony of Krellek's room, and enter via the glass door? That room ain't as secret or inaccessible as the mission makes it out to be.
• Gameplay with many mandatory secrets without hints and even secrets within secrets is not my cup of tea.
• Too many endless corridors with doors leading to sleeping quarters on both sides. Exploring these corridors feels repetitive and tedious. Same problem as in The Blue Rose and The Hotel.
• The fireplaces in the Librarian's Study and in the room opposite of it do not have a chimney.
• If you pick up the first cup from Perry's shelf, the entire shelf shakes. Something wrong with the physics.
• It is not possible to pick up the fire arrow in the fireplace in the room opposite the Council Room without taking damage.
• The teleporting door in one of the two rooms accessible from the Scribe Room vents feels awkward. It appears as if a real door did not work for some reason and the teleporter is a bandaid to connect to areas.
• The Architect's Hammer is an unnecessary "gotcha trap". There is no indication touching it will kill the player instantly.
• Similarly, the poison in the secret weapons cache is also an unnecessary "gotcha trap".

Notable differences to v3.0:

• No loot glint is a bad idea. It forces players to pick up everything just to check if it counts as loot. Thankfully, v3.0 reintroduces loot glint.
• The victrola in the secret wings plays a song. I don't remember this from v3.0, although I must admit I did not double-check.
• Only one Enforcer is sitting with Greidus at the round table near the starting location. In v3.0, it is two.
• A single Enforcer guards the Eye's Sanctuary. He isn't there in v3.0.
• The trap in the Eye Sanctuary is different. I prefer the version in v2.0. It feels more dangerous to get chased by stone statues.

Hint needed:

• Did not find the tiny Keeper lock hidden in a dark corner somewhere in the Council Hall. I had forgotten that it is there since my playthrough of v3.0.

Bugs:

• The goals screen is empty when you start the mission but the goals show up once you are ingame.
• After I picked up the special vintage in the basement, I got the "Kill the Priest Greidus" objective.

[<Username>]

I am stuck in v1.0. There are 5 metal grates and one door I can't open. I have 2 keys in my inventory, but they don't work. I took out all AI in areas I can access and searched the floors near them for any additional keys that might have dropped from their belts. So far I have not found more keys.

Does anyone have any ideas where the missing keys might be?

Locked grates:
1x bottom of elevator shaft in Council Hall
2x in vents accessible via Scribe Room
1x behind crate in secret weapons cache
1x behind crate in attic accessible after stacking crates below a hole in the ceiling of a sleeping chamber

Locked doors:
1x in corridor a few steps south of entrance to Council Hall

[fortuni]

I should be able to find any missing keys using the Loothunter program.

Edit: I found 4 keys, but long time since I played this missions so hopefully you can work things out from below

1. On the librarian in his office, there's a candlestick 75g on a side table and a fireplace.
2. Enforcer o/s room with the Eye.
3. Enforcer patrolling corridor with 12 statues
4. Keeper sitting at table in library with one other Keeper, there's a big statue at one end of the room with 2 big candlesticks on either side of the statue. IIRC this key was neither easy to see or frob

Hopefully that helps, and hopefully none of the above are false readings.

[<Username>]

I think I got 2 and 3. 2 opens the door to the Eye Sanctuary, 3 the door to the Scribe Room.

I can't find 1 and 4. I scoured the whole map, carefully checked all rooms with fireplaces (1) and all rooms where people had been sitting at tables (4), even if it was not at the same table.

If all else fails, I will attempt to replay the whole mission from scratch, this time making absolutely sure I will check out the belts of all AI.

[fortuni]

Can you post a save, I’ll check that out with Loothunter, but you need to zip up your current save otherwise I’ll have to d/l 9+ files

[<Username>]

It is very kind of you to take a look at my save. I will send you the link via personal message.

[fortuni]

Save worked

Found the first key, you had fallen for the oldest trick in T3 you had KO'd the librarian in the room with the fireplace so he has dropped the key, it's on the floor by the fireplace.

And the second key is there as well, you hadn't been into the room with the two Keepers sitting at the table, it's accessed via a vent in the elevator shaft off the council room.

[<Username>]

Thank you, fortuni. I don't know how I missed that. I would have had to restart the mission from the beginning without you.

The number of elements in The Secret Room v1.0 that appear designed to mess with the player is remarkable: tiny switches in dark corners, secrets within secrets, invisible hatches in the walls that only highlight when you jump to get close, secrets blocked off by furniture which you must awkwardly move with the dagger...

Stats:

• Expert difficulty
• 181 minutes
• 99% loot
• 5 hints needed

Notable differences to subsequent versions:

• v1.0 has loot glint only on some objects, v2.0 has no loot glint, v3.0 reintroduces loot glint.
• From v2.0 onwards, the starting location has walls with yellowish wallpaper, is more brightly lit and has a higher ceiling. Aesthetically, I prefer the gloomier design from v1.0.
• From v2.0 onwards, a corridor was added next to the starting location, with a door on each of its sides.
• The room where Greidus is sitting at a round table surrounded by bookshelves is directly connected to the starting room. It has more moody lighting in v1.0.
• From the room where Greidus is sitting, two doors lead to rooms. These doors do not exist from v2.0 onwards. The rooms can instead be accessed via the doors in the corridor built for v2.0.
• I think the hidden entrance in the room where Greidus is sitting is handled better in v1.0: You can hear running water behind a bookshelf, hinting at the existence of a secret entrance.
• The lever which moves the bookshelf in front of the passage to the Council Hall is hidden in a different bookshelf not far from the one in v2.0 and v3.0.
• Climbing gloves can be found in the hidden weapons cache. They are only there in v1.0. They serve no purpose, which is probably why they were removed from v2.0 onwards.
• The hidden weapons cache does not have the poison flask the causes instant damage in v1.0. I did not like this trap in v2.0 and v3.0.
• This version has an additional room on the South balcony of the Council Hall that was moved to a different location from v2.0 onwards.
• This version has Master Odin's room on the South balcony of the Council Hall. It was moved to a different location from v2.0 onwards.
• The secret room is accessed via a vent in an attic, not via a teleporter like in v2.0 and v3.0.
• This version has three secret areas accessible via hatches in the ceiling.
• This version does not have the outside area with the exit. The exit is instead hidden behind a wall in the secret area accessible from the room northeast of the circular hall near the starting location.

Other observations:

• The amount of frobbable books in this mission is insane. When switches move bookshelves, they get scattered everywhere. There is a room with a huge pile of books and only one at the bottom counts as loot.
• No way down from the east balcony in the Council Hall without taking damage.
• v1.0 was the first version in which I used water and gas arrows. This was not needed in v2.0 and v3.0.

Bugs:

• You can soft lock the game if you jump down into the pit in the vents leading from the Scribe Room and save without the correct key in your inventory.
• You can soft lock the game if you save without the right key in your inventory after the secret door closes automatically behind you in the secret weapons cache.
• The goals screen is empty when you start the mission, but the goals show up once you are ingame.

Hints needed:

1. Missed an invisible trapdoor in the ceiling of a bedroom.
2. Missed another invisible trapdoor in the ceiling a bedroom.
3. Missed yet another invisible trapdoor in the ceiling of Martin's secret room, northwest of the Council Hall.
4. Missed the key on the belt of the man in the room northeast of the circular hall near the starting location.
5. Missed the wall tile that opens to the exit because it was blocked by a chair.

Locations of all the locked grates:

• 1x top of elevator shaft near Observatory, connects via vents to grate in secret weapons cache
• 1x behind crate in secret weapons cache, connects via vents to top of elevator shaft near Observatory
• 1x bottom of elevator shaft in Council Hall
• 2x in vents of Scribe Room
• 1x in an attic accessible via a ceiling hatch in one of the bedrooms where an Enforcer with a torch is patrolling

Locations of all keys:

• On the belt of the man in the room northeast of the circular room near the starting location. Opens all metal grates.
• On the belt of the Enforcer guarding the Eye Sanctuary. Opens the Eye Sanctuary.
• On the belt of the Enforcer with a torch patrolling a corridor with several doors to bedrooms. Opens the door to the Scribe Room near his patrol route.
• On the belt of an Enforcer sitting at a table with another Enforcer in a room behind a locked metal grate on the bottom of the elevator shaft in the Council Hall. Opens the door to the room a few steps southeast of the entrance to the Council Hall.

[onetruekeeper]

try the room next to the scribes door.
bigger hint:
pull the lever behind the bed and run to the wall across the scribes door.

The climbing gloves are not in the weapons room. I looked all over but none were seen.
People are also mistaking the weapons room for the secret room of Krellek.

[onetruekeeper]

Finished all objectives except killing Priest Greidus. During the beginning of the mission I had to sneak past him and some keeper enforcers to get to the main keeper areas but during the attemp I was spotted and it caused a commotion among them where Greidus attacked the other keeper enforcers and they returned the attack. Near the end of the mission I returned to that area where I first saw Greidus to finish him off but found he was already dead so I could not finish the objective of killing him so I could not complete the mission. This is likely a game bug.

[Marbrien]

I am playing version 3.0 of this FM, so many of the tips in this thread may not work. I am playing on Normal (I think, not sure where TDS confirms this). Here's how I'm stuck:

1. I can't find Martin's Chronicles.
2. I can't find the secret room, the one required by an objective.
3. I haven't killed the Priest Greidus. (I think I may have the same problem encountered by onetruekeeper - if he's the man in red in the circular room near the start, he's already dead.)
4. I don't have a key for a locked door close to the Treasurer's Office.
5. In a wine cellar with a death trap in the floor, I see a vertical ladder above a roof beam but cannot get up there.

Occasionally Garret starts skating across the floor and won't jump, for no apparent reason. I have to reload a saved game to cure this.

UPDATE: in the end I made progress by following the walkthrough at Thief Guild: https://www.thiefguild.com/media/Sec...by_fortuni.pdf

I can't get up into Heartless Perry's quarters, because there is no "large crate, by the east door" of the wine cellar.

And something or someone else has already killed Priest Greidus, so I can't finish the mission anyway.