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Thread: New Dark 10 Year Anniversary Contest?

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2011
    Location: Planet Crazy Pants

    New Dark 10 Year Anniversary Contest?

    I don't know if it's ever been confirmed who (pl?) developed 1.19 before The Crow posted it 10 years ago this Sept, but I thought it'd be only right that this community aim for an Anniversary Contest to mark the occasion given that there would be 8 months for development.

    Thoughts?
    Plans/announcements already that I've missed?
    Last edited by ValmontPhl; 13th Jan 2022 at 18:45.

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    i heard a couple idea's for contest but dont think anything is nailed down

    also wanted to know if its possible to make a hd version of dewdrop? or what ever the newest best graphics are since he is over all small i feel it shouldent be to laggy in game?

    do any of those graphics things for thief change dewdrop looks? like necroage? /etc

    fixed typo and added a extra question

    not that i want dewdrop to change at all i was just curious what he would look like in modern graphics one of the last items never really updated
    Last edited by downwinder; 12th Jan 2022 at 18:58.

  3. #3
    There are a few of us talking about a possible contest, should be some details soon.

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2017
    Quote Originally Posted by Brethren View Post
    There are a few of us talking about a possible contest, should be some details soon.
    I hope that this is Old Dark contest, so that we can encourage Sperry to finish Shadow of Doubt . I'm just kidding, looking forward to whatever contest theme you envision.

  5. #5
    New Member
    Registered: May 2020
    A new dark contest is exactly what is still missing. We already had a contest that did not allow to use custom stuff (only things form the base game where allowed).
    So this time it could be the exact opposite like no use of textures from the base game or something.

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: May 2017
    Location: USA
    Probably not a prohibition. NewDark gave us more freedom to create, we shouldn’t celebrate it by tying our hands. But definitely, custom content encouraged seems reasonable.

  7. #7
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2004
    Location: Germany
    Maybe some more general "use NewDark" rule would be better, such as "At least one major improvement that came with NewDark must be used", or still more general: "Something that was not possible before NewDark must be present in the mission". This would not force the authors too much into one direction, like "all original textureas are banned, not even a standard apple texture is allowed".

  8. #8
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Bohn Museum
    Even that is too much IMO, it would force the authors to think of something that wasn't possible in NewDark and find a way to force it into their vision. Just let any custom resources be used and no themes or limitations.

    And if Sperry enters, he can't use OldDark.

  9. #9
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    i got a idea ,how does a newdark for thief 2 rooftop parkour/distance instead of height, also using only thief 3 textures and sounds only

    since newdark is known for its amazing mantling ability

    also mission must run on low end systems,otherwise customized object/etc would and could lag most all systems

    also skybox should be amazing=should be one of the voting categories as newdark can have some amazing skyboxes

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2012
    Location: Sweden.
    If one is in the plans..

    ...NewDark gave more creative freedom and a contest to celebrate that should reflect accordingly!

  11. #11
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    Even that is too much IMO, it would force the authors to think of something that wasn't possible in NewDark and find a way to force it into their vision.
    Don't ALL themed contests force the author's vision in one way or another?

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2004
    Location: Ireland/Poland
    NewDark contest should be simply 'do whatever you like (and can)' kind of contest.

    Just like in the old days, when we've seen entries like 'The Haunting' - not a classic Thief experience, yet interesting in their own way. Generally, things, that could not necessarily belong to the Thief universe (but no harm if they do).

    Though if we were to go for any themes, I would suggest "Future". It could be interpreted in many ways and has a ND vibe in it.

    And if Sperry enters, he can't use OldDark.
    And yes - use of NewDark would be a must.

  13. #13
    DromEd Archmage
    Registered: Nov 2010
    Location: Between a bed and a machine
    Quote Originally Posted by PinkDot View Post
    NewDark contest should be simply 'do whatever you like (and can)' kind of contest.
    Personaly, such a theme would be boring. The interesting part of a contest is the theme and the restrictions that comes with it.
    If there's none, I would like to say : it's just waiting for people to make new FMs of their own and just publishing these at the same date...

    And if someone tells me "yes but the rating?" well, thiefguild.com is the place for this.


    I think it's strange to see how people are relunctant with forced-Theme and limits.
    I would like to remember everyone that Themes and Restrictions of contest doesn't exist to annoy contestants, it's just to make it easier to make the mission in time : you don't have to spend time thinking about your own theme since the contest does it for you.

    So if someone decide to launch a contest about a type of mission because this kind of mission is rare or underused, I would think it's an excellent idea and liar would be the one who would tell it limits too much authors as it was done before and the submissions were always unique and fun.

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2005
    Location: Ireland
    As NewDark has been around for 10 years, almost all missions released (and contests) in that time have already been utilising it’s features. So a NewDark anniversary contest really should include some kind of theme or ruleset, otherwise it doesn’t really celebrate anything in particular. How to define this is a much more difficult task but perhaps missions must at least break the limits of “OldDark” in some easy to measure way.

  15. #15
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    I agree that contests shouldn't be too limiting, but some restriction is necessary to make it interesting, both for authors and players. The difficult but important aspect is finding the right balance. Since we've had several contests honoring the original stock material, why not encourage NewDark unique features and custom content? If it's a NewDark contest, to me it seems logical to embrace that. Perhaps one of the voting categories can be 'NewDark features', while the others can be the regular gameplay, design, story etc.

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Could someone with knowledge of Newdark post a list of the most important features of Newdark in comparison with Olddark. We all know authors can make bigger and more complex missions which includes the ability to use file bulging sized custom objects, what sort of map size difference and file size difference is now available between Olddark and the latest Newdark, and what other important features does Newdark incorporate that have revolutionized mission building but are generally hidden from view from players?

    Maybe by posting the 10 or 12 most important improvements (whilst not being too technical) players who are not authors could make a more informed contribution to this discussion over and above suggesting this contest should include custom objects.

  17. #17
    DromEd Archmage
    Registered: Nov 2010
    Location: Between a bed and a machine
    Hmmm... Custom res is imo irrevelent with NewDark. Allowing it is just enough as we have many custom resource pack around. In addition, what custom would mean in the context of such a contest? Should it be HD?
    It's a good way to give the host of the contest some headache.

    Custom allowed with no limit is enough and if someone want to stick to stock resources, up to them!

    About NewDark feature as theme, it's again a rule kinda blurry. What NewDark did is :

    - Adding Mtl files to give materials to textures
    - EnvMap ie custom skybox-like textures
    - Pyramids and Cylinders with more than 12 sides on bases
    (tho we authors found out is cost so much cells it's better to stick to many wedges instead ; cells are in short just terrain surface split in triangle to render it)
    - Increased the limit of brushes, objIds and cells so we can build larger maps/more detailed maps
    - New Mantling ie climbing even thin surfaces
    - Squirrel Script so we can make scripts more easily without the need to compile osm and deal with C++
    - Adding custom HUD elements with scripts
    - Having different kind of fog in one mission
    - Having different light ambiant in one mission
    - Using HD textures with more color than 256 (with also Alpha Channel for transparent ones)
    - Better particles system
    - Better Corona system
    - Bloom effect on lights
    - Multiplayer

    There are certainly things I forgot to mention but I think I just quoted the essential ones... and I have to say even if it's a lot of features I quoted... that's indeed very technical and I'm not sure every author can afford joining a contest like this...

  18. #18
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    thanks for that list Firemage, seriously informative.

    I didn’t realise Squirrel script was a Newdark feature, but I wouldn’t dare suggest we include ‘best use of squirrel’ as a criteria for this contest.

    But maybe Fog, Ambient, Particles, Corona and Bloom could somehow be included in the restrictions.

    Authors could make any type of mission they wanted, regardless of size, using or not using custom objects, but a primary voting criteria would be based on looks, lighting and ambient mood. Such a open style contest would allow complete freedom of choice for authors with the winner chosen on the overall good looks of the mission and the mood it invokes in players. This would celebrate Newdark abilities without restricting authors in their preferred mission style.

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    what if instead of a vague newdark theme, we do a multiplayer mission contest? would celebrate a huge feature of the most recent newdark release, and provides a fresh new angle on missions for builders to sink their teeth into.

  20. #20
    Member
    Registered: May 2017
    Location: USA
    Quote Originally Posted by vfig View Post
    what if instead of a vague newdark theme, we do a multiplayer mission contest? would celebrate a huge feature of the most recent newdark release, and provides a fresh new angle on missions for builders to sink their teeth into.
    I dig this idea, but is the latest multiplayer release stable enough for this? I thought it was still pretty buggy (maybe I’m working from old intel?)

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2001
    Location: 0x0x0
    Sperry using new dark?? Has he even heard of Thief 2?

  22. #22
    DromEd Archmage
    Registered: Nov 2010
    Location: Between a bed and a machine
    Quote Originally Posted by trefoilknot View Post
    I dig this idea, but is the latest multiplayer release stable enough for this? I thought it was still pretty buggy (maybe I’m working from old intel?)
    For having tried it, I would say it's kinda playable. The only mission which had issues was (it won't help us to like it better) Trace the Courrier which fails the mission if you steal more pickpocket than the goal is asking.
    The only two general issues we had was actually :
    - mantling doing the falling sound of the material underneath the other player like if they failed their jump,
    - and the size of second player models not matching the size their first person controler has in their game.

    For example : if there's a 2x2 path made of wood surrounded by tiles, when you'll walk on it and hear your steps making wooden noise, the other player will see your model having his feet exceeding the wooden path's width and thus playing a tile footstep noise instead, alerting then the surrounding AIs.

    Imo, multiplayer would just need a few scripts/animation edits to fix these problems and it shall be fine.

    But it's not that buggy and I admit having fun while playing it! It's just a pity they didn't implemented the custom skin feature the OldDark Multiplayer Mod was offering and chat. Even if it's overall way more stable!

    Tho, the multiplayer mod provided by ND is made to work only for T2 vanilla. I have no idea how it would react to FMs with more or less scripted events, and for sure, it's definitely not compatible with TG.

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    has anyone ever made a camvator scene in newdark yet?

  24. #24
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2016
    Location: Not France
    Quote Originally Posted by downwinder View Post
    has anyone ever made a camvator scene in newdark yet?
    New restriction: all missions must have a 10 minute minimum unskippable camvator.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: May 2008
    Location: Southern,California
    Quote Originally Posted by McTaffer View Post
    New restriction: all missions must have a 10 minute minimum unskippable camvator.
    also somewhere along camvator must be dewdrop hidden in it,requested by firemage :P

    also the skybox for mission must be amazing,no boring black with minimal white dots for stars

    and new mantle should be used in mission as it feels good to grab a ledge

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