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Thread: T1 FM - Calendra's Cistern - Newdark Re-release - 2015-08-08

  1. #76
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Hitchin, Hertfordshire, UK
    I have already added thief.exe to Norton's firewall list of exceptions. It hasn't helped.

    I just turned off the Norton 360 AV. I tried to install from the TG discs using the Run command with the -igntforce parameter, set up started but ended a few seconds later with the Windows NT message. Tried again, same result.

    So with the AV still off, I installed manually from the TG discs and ran TFixv1.22. Lock pick problem still there.

    I then renamed thief.exe to TG.exe. FMSel then crashes. I can run the renamed thief.exe directly, but that only gives me access to the first OM which has no lock picks anyway, and presumably I can't play FMs any more.

    Newdark is not among the list of programs in the Control Panel. I have no idea where it is in the system and therefore have no way of checking if it is running in a compatibility mode.

    I have renamed TG.exe back to THIEF.EXE and now the game crashes and will not run at all.
    Last edited by Marbrien; 13th Aug 2015 at 15:26.

  2. #77
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2010
    Location: A Former Forest
    EDIT: Sorry Marbrien, I was typing away before you posted and got side tracked, then posted, but did not see your response above. Sorry to hear you are having these problems and that my method below will probably not fix your issue. Damn. For others, the method below may help. Give it a try.

    ____________________ old post _______________________
    This may help if you are having troubles with TG/T1 and playing FMs. This is what I did and it worked perfectly. Windows 7. Also running Cox Cable's version of McAfee Anti Virus.

    1. Download v1.22 of tfix
    2. create 2 directories like c:\games\tg and c:\games\tg_fms
    3. Do not attempt to use the TG installer. Just open up the install disk and copy the entire on cents of the "thief" directory into you c:\games\tg folder
    4. Now copy the second disk's "their" directory into the c:\games\tg folder and select the overwrite option when prompted. Let the 2nd disk overwrite any matching files from the first disk. (This is explained in the tfix thread).
    5. Now run the tfix application and let it do its work.
    6. Download an FM into your tg_fms directory in a new sub-directory "calendar_FM" or whatever you want to call it.
    7. Run the built in fm selector and set the path to the fm directory.

    I used this method that is very similar to the optional tfix method in the link. They state that if the installer fails to start, do something similar to the above steps. I've just added the FM part.

    It is interesting to me that I did not have to do the manual copy with my old XP box. I figure it has to do with authorization or something different in Win7. Whatever the reason, the above steps resulted in a perfect install and zero glitches so far. I am still roaming the streets, so I am in the early part of the mission. If something does break, I'll post it, but I think it will be fine. And no issues at all with anti-virus running. Sometimes I suspend it though while playing just to free up some resources, but I have not done that yet with this installation.
    Last edited by bjack; 13th Aug 2015 at 15:31.

  3. #78
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Hitchin, Hertfordshire, UK
    Thanks bjack, but that is pretty much what I have done too on some of my numerous attempts to fix this.

    I'm beginning to wonder if its something in Windows 8.1. The laptop I'm trying to run T1 FMs on is Windows 8.1. In the same room is a Windows 7 desktop. They are both linked wirelessly to a printer in another room. The laptop frequently loses connection with the printer, which requires a reset of the printer and the router. The Windows 7 machine does not have these problems. Unfortunately, the applications I am most likely to print from, e.g. MS Office, are on the laptop and it wouldn't be feasible to swap them round. Which suggests to me that W8.1 is not as stable an OS as W7.

  4. #79
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Marbrien View Post
    I then renamed thief.exe to TG.exe. FMSel then crashes.
    you need to change thief.exe into tg.exe in the shortcut as well. or just edit cam_mod.ini and change ;fm into fm, save and exit, that will enable FMsel permanently.


    anyway, pretty sure win8 all by itself is not the culprit - whatever is blocking Thief is.

  5. #80
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Hitchin, Hertfordshire, UK
    I have now discovered the cause of the "issue".

    It is such a long time since I played a fresh install of T1/TG that I had forgotten that the default "use" key is not Enter, but (of all things counterintuitive) Mouse 2. THAT was why nothing in my inventory appeared to work; I wasn't pressing the correct key.

    The error, as they say, was located between the keyboard and the seat.

    I apologise to anyone who has spent any time on this. At least you'll have one extra thing to suggest the next time someone reports an issue with their T1/TG inventory.

    BTW, one small thing. I eventually got the igntforce parameter to work by omitting the space between the hyphen and the parameter, so the image shown in post #73 is probably misleading in that respect.

    Sorry once again.

  6. #81
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    well, there is a reason why I never say that I'm 100% sure about anything.

  7. #82
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales
    Every now and then I go to use something like a rope arrow, and it doesn't work - in a similar way to your lockpicks not working. Eventually I find that there's no key bind enabled for a rope arrow. And I've no idea why it would change for no reason. I was kind of mulling about key binds to myself so I wasn't far off. Maybe I'm not as daft as I'm cabbage-looking. (Old English expression meaning ?)

  8. #83
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Hitchin, Hertfordshire, UK
    I wonder if there's an idea here for a future version of TFix: to give the user the option on installing New Dark to have the key binds of T1/TG automatically changed so that they are consistent (or at least more consistent) with those in T2. Don't know how technically difficult that would be.

  9. #84
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    a couple of control sets are available, you just need to load them in the controls menu. try Thief classic.

  10. #85
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2010
    Location: A Former Forest
    "Classic" is nearly there, almost T2 binds, but "8" does not bring up a rope arrow. I had to bind that manually. No big deal. At least the classic uses x for crouch and alt w for lean forward. It also defaults slow walk, so shift arrow up means run. On my other system I had to use 2 different playing styles for TG and T2. On the new one, I can use similar keys. Again, not a big deal, but more comfortable.

  11. #86
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Malmö, Sweden
    Thanks for releasing this. Now I don't need a separate install in order to play my second-favourite mission of all time.


    I noticed that the 'Treacherous note' is now on the chair by the well, and not beneath it. At first I thought it was weird that it was just laying there out in the open, but then I figured that Lady Calendra (who we know have read it) found it under the chair, read it and then put it in plain sight to freak Brimstone out.

    Speaking of Brimstone, has anyone figured out who his accomplice is? (the one the note is aimed for) I sure haven't. The witch's diary mentions thieves, but I can't figure out anyone at the party that fits as a thief.

    Mercedes is now standing in a new spot in the endgame. That made things easier for me. From high above, I dropped the explosive charge on the ground next to Wormwood. Then I used a noisemaker to drag out Tommyrot from his hiding place. When they were both searching the little square...BOOM! Hehe.

  12. #87
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2012
    Location: Portugal
    Already updated, but does not appear the objectives, only boxes. What can I do?

  13. #88
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: College Place, WA
    @Empyrium
    Are you using a non-English install of Thief? I moved English language content into English sub folders, facilitating a translation patch if one were ever released. That may be the reason your objectives don't show. You could try examining the FM's directory structure and moving content in .\English folders up a directory.
    Also, are you using Darkloader? Or FMSel? Try using the other to see if your problem persists.

    @jiansonz
    I just checked the Treacherous Note's placement in the original version, and it's sitting on the chair (at least in Newdark). Assuming your memory isn't mistaken, it's possible a difference between Newdark and olddark exists that results in the note being on the floor.

    I believe Brimstone's Accomplice is Tommyrot.

    Mercedes is actually standing where she was originally scripted to teleport to after the winecellar conversation. After HOURS of testing, I finally discovered that upon RELOADING, Mercedes repeats her winecellar conversation, including moving to a marker in the party area (which teleports her out). This resulted in Mercedes trying to walk from her intended teleport location, back to the party basement and then teleporte back out. This explains why SO MANY PEOPLE had problems with her never showing up. She was wandering someplace off in the city, walking back to the party. Either intentionally, or unintentionally, there is a marker that Mercedes pauses at and waits for Garrett, which (usually) prevented Mercedes from walking all the way back to the party.

  14. #89
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Location: Detox clinic
    FYI....I have found that this NewDark / OldDark issue of items dropping to the floor from their originally placed position occurs in a couple of other missions.

    it happens in Projekt Hammer to name one.

  15. #90
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2002
    Location: Malmö, Sweden
    Quote Originally Posted by AntiMatter_16 View Post
    I believe Brimstone's Accomplice is Tommyrot.
    Ah, that makes sense. I only thought about the people you can find at the party. But from what we learn in Mercedes' second conversation, it makes sense that he was also there.



    I've never had any problem with Mercedes not showing up. The difference I noticed now is that earlier, she was always waiting by the pit/stairs opposite the Whitman mansion. This made it difficult to prevent her from going down to dangerous territory before I was ready - I always wanted to take my newfound sword and slash the banner in Alharzad's house, take the key and loot his chests first (btw, I noticed that the banner is now indestructible but it has been moved so you can see the key anyway).

    This time, Mercedes was waiting to the left just as I hopped down from the wall by Feegrim's(sp?) Court. I did not get close to her and she ignored me. I liked that, as it meant I could take my time to clear the way.
    Last edited by jiansonz; 20th Aug 2015 at 12:50.

  16. #91
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: College Place, WA
    Tommyrot was never at the party. In terms of story or otherwise. After reviewing the note again, it isn't written to Tommyrot, but another party that's supposed to contact him for Brimstone. That must be the accomplice. Now, I don't think that it's ever said who the accomplice is exactly.

    The Banner is actually one of two sensors that detects when you bring Ragnor the Gold to the art collector's house. slashing the banner meant destroying the sensor, so I made it non-physical.

  17. #92
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Location: Detox clinic
    Hi Antimatter

    writing out a corrected lootlist for Autumn, i noticed on the loot available is
    Normal........3906
    Hard............4006
    Expert..........4206

    but Dromed report does not state which loot is N/H/E as it usually does, can you remember which loot is unavailable on the lower difficulties, thus saving me a bit of time having to playing on all 3 settings

    Thanks jim

  18. #93
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Location: netherlands
    thank you anti-matter for all your work on this wonderfull mission.

    did a new install of thief gold, t-fixed it... working like a charm.

    i'm off on a trip to memory lane

  19. #94
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2002
    Location: College Place, WA
    @Fortuni

    That question would be best asked in the Lampfire re-release thread.
    But there are a number of guards that don't exist on lower difficulty levels. Some have purses on their belt, which is removed with them on Normal/Hard.

    BaffSergeant 675 -Has a purse worth 100. Doesn't exist on Normal or Hard.
    Ham Guard 1156 - Has a purse worth 100. Doesn't exist on Normal or Hard.
    Ham Priest 1501 - Has a purse worth 100. Doesn't exist on Normal.

  20. #95
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Location: Detox clinic
    Thank you AM

    ps. sorry thought this was the re-release thread :
    Last edited by fortuni; 21st Aug 2015 at 08:22.

  21. #96
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales
    This is the re-release thread for Calendra's Cistern. You said you were doing the lootlist for Autumn (in Lampfire Hills).

    Quote Originally Posted by fortuni View Post
    . . . writing out a corrected lootlist for Autumn . . .

  22. #97
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Location: Detox clinic
    Lootlist overload my dear

    and a bit stressed at the moment.....see my PM

  23. #98
    Moderator
    Registered: Apr 2003
    Location: Wales

  24. #99
    Member
    Registered: May 2005
    Replayed Calendra's Cistern about 15 years since I last completed the mission. Finished on Footpad in 2 hours and 9 minutes with 1691 of 4897 total loot. Probably got around 3000, but buying several items from Farkus' lowered the loot count. I found the observatory, but did not try to solve the puzzle with the body parts. I also did not attempt to solve the safe puzzle near the starting point. Neither did I find out how to open the very obvious secret door near where you meet Mercedes for the second time.

    What I remembered about Calendra's Cistern:
    1. The plot revolving around an artifact called the Cylix.
    2. Infiltrating a party of noblemen and signing their guestbook.
    3. A conversation with Mercedes, who was carrying a lantern, through locked portcullis.
    4. The wall textures featuring lots of green elements.

    What I thought after replaying it:
    Not quite the masterpiece I remembered it as, but still a very good mission. I especially like how it gradually opens up new areas. There were no obtuse puzzles and I was able to finish it without hints. The plot is decent, even though I think Garrett having a love interest does not really fit his character. Great level design, except for some less interesting sewer areas. I appreciate the effort that went into this Newdark re-release. There was one area where I could go out of bounds in Newdark. It is not far from the starting location, where a golden bottle is hidden on a rim surrounding a tower.

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