I loved the desperate by-the-skin-of-your-teeth feeling to the hostile encounters in TLOU, and yeah, it's still here.
Yeah, the ability to go prone is a great addition to the game. I like the other stealthy stuff they've added too, like the tall grass and the option to craft silencers. But I'm hating on the devs atm for forcing me to kill dogs. I do like what they add to the gameplay though, it's just brutal to have to put 'em down.
I really hate that in nowadays games, your protagonist always has to moan, pant, groan and what not. That's not something which gives me more immersion. It leaves me with the feeling that I'm actually just steering through a movie. There's lots more, those kill animations, automatic movements when you approach a cover, or an obstacle... all stuff which I wished I could do myself. It's more immersive for me than games which do all the work for me, and even show me how I have to feel, when the protagonist moans, groans, and pants.Originally Posted by henke
Did I say that I don't like modern games much?
You ever consider getting into VR? Not a lot of animations they can force your character into since they can't move your hands for you.
I like VR. Didn't get a headset yet, because I think they're still too expensive, at least when you're going for a decent one, and, I also want to see VR become more popular first, and to become more market proof.
I have no doubt though that they also develop VR games to "modern standards" like the ones I described. Obviously, nowadays' target audience wants a groaning, moaning, babbling protagonist, to know what to feel and what to think in certain moments of the games.
You did, but I don't think I've seen many people expressing that point of view in such a silly way. Congrats! (For the record I think there's a discussion to be had about context-dependent animations and the like, but that thing about "when the protagonist moans, groans, and pants"? Sorry, you lost me there, and not just because Tomb Raider came out in 1996.)
Why thank you.
Actually, Tomb Raider is a great example for proving my point. Check out this video, and notice how subtle the moans and groans are, and how Lara Croft only does them when she climbs or jumps:
Now compare this to the Lara Croft in Rise of the Tomb Raider, who moans, groans and breathes on literally every foot step the play does, and even inbetween:
You know, I don't need this kind of "immersion" which is none, but rather makes me think how fkn emotional and dramatic the nowadays breed of players (kids) needs these games.
All I'm hearing is someone who likes their moaning and groaning on the down low instead of headboard-banging animal grunting. I like both. (Others do, too.) Sue me.
Also this line of argument about what dem kids like compared to how it was in my day does your need for preferential validation no favours and I'm this close to posting a Simpsons meme here.
Well, as you seem to be short of own arguments, I don't see much reason to continue this discussion. Get back to me when you actually have something meaningful to say. Apart from "you so stupid, I post a Simpson meme!".
This is a really bizarre complaint. So, are you saying you want a button for "pant?" Or are you doing this yourself, out loud, at your desk or on your couch? How about another button for "put hand on crate and look around corner" or Press X to "place hand over mouth and slash throat?"
There was a lot of complaining about contextual movement about the time that Thief 2014 was about to be released, but that was more about core gameplay features, like jumping and leaning. This seems silly, as if you prefer a less detailed game. I'm sure Tomb Raider 1, back in 1996, would be doing these things if the technology would have been there at the time.
I did! Pay attention! Also, if you want the meme that badly...
I don't want none of that. What makes you think I do? And, what makes the game developers think I want to play a protagonist who constantly moans and groans and pants?
But, I don't think that you really understood the essence of my rant. It's not really solely about this, there's a lot of stuff in the presentation, and immersive feel in modern games which I could criticize. At the moment, I focus on this, because it's something which I noticed. I also noticed that there's so much freakin' babble in GTA 5 that I somehow had to drive around the block 4 or 5 times, just to hear the NPC's babble to the end. Weird, I know. Just stop the babble by driving straight to the end location. Yes.Again, it's just something I noticed, because, in GTA 4, there hasn't been remotely such a amount of babble.
All those things really fit into the picture of the world today. That's all I want to say.
This is pretty disingenuous. He wants no/less player character sound, not a button for it. He also wants less of the animations to be little cutscenes you're just watching while not doing anything. Which is actually pretty bizarre because original Tomb Raider had a whole lot of those, from pulling up ledges and pulling switches to picking up items. Hm.
No, you didn't at all. All you did was rant about a rant, and post a Simpsons meme.
Do you actually see what I see? I see little quick events (not to confuse with quick time events) in The Last of Us. Not animations. Maybe I'm hallucinating, or living in a different reality. You never know.
It's actually less immersive than just a animation, because it rather resembles watching a movie than actually showing how YOU do stuff.
Get back to me when you're able to not present subjective preferences for the volume of contextual action and information games provide as a qualitative appraisal of them.
Okay I'm just confused then. You're arguing against the game making any assumptions about what the player wants to do and filling in little details? You don't want a player character to put a hand on a nearby surface when it's close? You want looking around a corner and leaping over things to be manual and non-contextual? I can't even begin to comprehend what your problem with the stabbing is if it's not animations locking character for a bit or the QTE aspect.
Eh... I think you're smart enough to know that there's a little difference between a little grab to hold on to a surface, and a little movie which plays when you actually kill or stun a NPC. Look at what's going on there, and take a guess what would happen in terms of gameplay, if you would force the player to press a button for every single thing he does. Totally different to those little movies which play every time you do something in modern games.
He threw me a bit when he said "all stuff which I wished I could do myself." But I get it now.
@chk772 - Have you played either of the Last of Us games? Just wondered, because sometimes it's hard to tell from watching a youtube clip how interactive a game is or not.
Bro that's literally what I fucking said:
He also wants less of the animations to be little cutscenes you're just watching while not doing anything.
Hi, I came in for the Denny's Early Bird Special for crotchety seniors.
Well, no, "bro". That's not what you said.
No, I don't mean that. Not at all. Try to read and understand what I wrote.
And try to be less offended.
Just to clarify about the animations in the above gameplay clip, the only time the game takes control away is:
When you stealth kill enemies, for ~5 seconds it takes away movement control, but you still have camera control.
When you charge the guy at the end and attack the camera pulls in closer as Ellie slashes her machette into his shoulder and control is removed for maybe a second.
Personally, I'm fine with both of these and find they add to the gameplay experience rather than detract from it. You can still be spotted while steath killing someone(as happens in the video with the last guy), so you need to keep in mind the time it takes to kill someone while you're making your plans. Do you even try to kill them while someone might see? Or do you grab them and pull them around the corner before executing?
btw, I got to the dogs last night! There's actually a cool mechanic here I haven't seen in other stealth games before. Your scent leaves a trail which the dogs can pick up. Once they do you'll have to constantly stay on the move(while remaining undetected), which makes these sections quite tense!
RE: too much moaning! I rewatched the clip and I'm not sure what you're talking about. Ellie is quiet for like 97% of that clip. The only part she's moaning and panting a lot is the very beginning when she's been sprinting and climbing and getting shot at and is ON THE VERGE OF DEATH(seriously, do you see how low the health bar is?). Would it be more immersive if she wasn't panting and moaning in that situation?
Last edited by henke; 23rd Jun 2020 at 02:45.
'Tis but a scratch, henke. No need to pant and moan. Kids these days...tsk.
<3
Man, some people are pretty good at the guitar minigame. :O
More here.
To be clear, the game only asks you to strum a few pre-defined chords in these sections, but the underlying system is robust enough that you can play this thing like an ACTUAL GUITAR. Now I kinda want someone who's really good at this to team up with one of those HL:Alyx piano-players and form a band where they just play songs through these games.
Last edited by henke; 24th Jun 2020 at 11:44.
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