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Thread: TDP20AC Mission Rose Garden (11/30/2018)

  1. #201
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Quote Originally Posted by Melan View Post
    2. Erasing the crosses reroutes the thieves to (mostly) safe spots where they can't butcher Bernalt. They can, and will still butcher you!
    Thank you for the clarification. I counted 8 X's that I crossed out, but I could only find 6 thieves having spawned after ringing the bell, so some of them must not have spawned.

    Here are the comments I wrote down for myself during my initial playthrough:
    - When the random number generator showed ‘15’ and that meant Melan’s entry was the next contest mission on the list, I smiled and my heart literally jumped with joy. Ever since ‘Bad Debts’, I knew the talent of this author as something very special. I just couldn’t wait to sink my teeth into this one.
    - Aaaahhhh! The starting street simply oozes of verticality. It can’t get any better than this.
    - One tip seems to talk about an optional objective of breaking some guy out of prison. I guess it will trigger once finished, since true optional objectives aren’t possible in Thief 1.
    - The other tip just talks about alternate routes using chutes and ventilation shafts. I have a feeling this mission requires a lot of nifty street maneuvering. I’m all for that!
    - Forced into the wineseller’s if not wanting to push for the thieves’ highway. Quickly found a hidden passage to a machine room up above though. I imagine the ways to go open up a bit soon.
    - Played a few hours now, and I’m realizing getting to the rooftops is more difficult than first anticipated. The mission seems very well tested in order to keep you on the streets for as long as possible.
    - This mission is now opening up and is truly awesome. There is so much detail in the way buildings are connected. I just visited a sewer section below the alehouse in the north. Through there I accessed a generator room that finally got me up a chute to the roof. I’ll try to explore the entire street level first however, then explore vertically later.
    - I found a seemingly intended way to ascend now. A wooden bridge above the barber shop on Gurnald’s street. I’m like a kid in a candy shop here, that’s how good this is.
    - Covered Humprey, Haskell, Brascombe and Weir’s now, although I couldn’t get into the latter. What I really like about this mission so far is that each location is worthwhile getting to, but no one place gives you a whole lot of loot. I don’t even have 1,000 yet, and I feel like I’ve explored for a long time. Yet looking at the map, there are tons of places I have still to visit. 
    - Just found two ghosts in the alleys south of the bazaar area. I must admit this kind of broke immersion for me. It just seemed too random to fit any plot device. Did I trigger them when I took the cursed gemstone perhaps? That is the only thing that would make sense to me, and would be cool in a way.
    - I know I just made this point, but this mission is massive beyond belief!
    - Just found a big hedge maze in the northwest. I thought this was Halfsequin Court, but it seems more logical for this to be the very Rose Garden I’m supposed to find.
    - The manor by the garden seems very difficult to ghost. I’m blackjacking everything I can see to get a feel for the place, but this one could be tricky, especially for Supreme.
    - Wow! I just got massively updated objectives at the top floor. I assume with this city access key I’ll be able to get to various parts of the city that wasn’t accessible before.
    - I’m supposed to ring the bell in the firewatch station, but I’m gonna hold off on that for now. I’d like to loot the rest of the map before this “event” takes place.
    - Just found a skull key I got on Morwyn street unlocked a strange door close to the starting plaza. It accessed the courts east of there that I hadn’t gotten to yet. This mission is something else, all right. I love it! Finally reached the loot goal also.
    - Realized I could frob all the X marks around the map and prevent thieves from spawning when releasing Bernalt. The first time I went ahead of him and knocked out/gassed all the enemies. I wonder if you can manipulate his route too, as some of the arrows are covered by Xs.
    - Found my way to Grandmauden now. Have a few places that are unfinished in the city, but I’ll get there later. There is a door on a small balcony close to Cistern Court I couldn’t open, plus the jail key on the hammer priest by the Master Forger doesn’t have a use. I thought those two might be connected somehow. The readable at the beginning also talked about breaking someone out of prison. I’ll return for that later.
    - Finished at Grandmauden’s, but the ending left more to be desired. The only drawback in an otherwise mesmerizing city mission.
    - Figured out how to release Pud from jail, but could not make sense of his tip. Had to look up a few hints and in the end almost an outright spoiler on where this key was found. It unlocked the aforementioned door by Cistern Ct.
    - Only 275 loot short. Gonna hit the streets again to look for missing stuff. Don’t want to succumb to any more hints yet.
    - Found all the remaining loot!! Missed some in the Rose Garden manor, plus a goblet at Mortesaigues. The last ones I got was two gold plates at the nobleman couple’s place above Cistern Court. I remember thinking it was weird there was nothing at all to pick up there.
    - This was top notch stuff, I gotta say. A few negatives on the difficult gameplay, though that is more of a challenge and even a plus for me. All the weird symbols around town that didn’t mean anything was a bit disappointing. Bernalt’s death seemed a bit rushed, but I’m only nitpicking.
    Score: 28/30.
    Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
    Let's Supreme Ghost Thief - YouTube Channel with Thief Let's Plays

  2. #202
    Classical Master 2008
    Registered: Jun 2002
    Location: Civitas Quinque Ecclesiae HU
    Thanks, Klatremus! Very kind of you.

  3. #203
    Apologies if this has already been asked, but is this mission fully ghostable? Is it possible to prevent all assassins from spawning during the Bernalt escort? Also, is it possible for Bernalt to be butchered by haunts in the streets if you complete the Haskell objective before escorting him, or do they spawn out of the way?

  4. #204
    Member
    Registered: May 2003
    Location: West Seattle
    *applause*
    this mission is a doozy! I couldn't tell which side of the map I was on for the longest time, until I printed out the high resolution version and started noting my routes - I'd be interested to see Melan's design documents for layout!
    thanks to the fine folks here I think I've done just about everything; I did run across several padlocked items (crates, bookshelves, hatches) that remain a mystery. There were areas that seem to just be eye candy, and references to lives and plots separate from the one I'm involved in (cannibalism?!), that I'm still curious about.
    one thing that tripped me up: Pud's clue does not refer to the skull key; I thought it did, since I found it in a garden, and since I missed the panel near the eye door and the rhyme I spent a long time going back and forth fruitlessly.

  5. #205
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Cat View Post
    Apologies if this has already been asked, but is this mission fully ghostable? Is it possible to prevent all assassins from spawning during the Bernalt escort? Also, is it possible for Bernalt to be butchered by haunts in the streets if you complete the Haskell objective before escorting him, or do they spawn out of the way?
    This mission is not just ghostable, but even supreme ghostable. As in my comment further up, some of the Xs prevent assassins from spawning, but others just relocate them. I could identify 6 thieves after having removed the 8 Xs I could find. One haunt definitely spawns along Bernalt's route, but I don't remember/know if they are set to be hostile.

  6. #206
    New Member
    Registered: Sep 2015
    Just got around to playing this one, and I had to give it some well-earned praise. This is among the most atmospheric visions of Thief 1's shadowy and mysterious city ever made- the world-building is really impressive, especially the evocative sense of ancient conspiracies and urban decay developed through the readables and ambient sound design.

    But the Rose Garden manor is what I really want to talk about- man, I was expecting a note left in some dark courtyard, not Constantine's mansion meets the Shalebridge Cradle. I played through the whole building without reloading, and it was easily among the most immersive Thief environments in any OM or FM. I love how it starts as just a seedy afterhours tavern and then slowly turns into a dilapidated nightmare. By the time I found my client's note, I was ready to jump out one of the upper floor windows rather than work my way back downstairs. Congratulations Melan, I don't think Thief 1's graphics have been used to convey such realistic desolation since maybe the Old Quarter in The Haunted Cathedral.

  7. #207
    Classical Master 2008
    Registered: Jun 2002
    Location: Civitas Quinque Ecclesiae HU
    Thank you very much! High praise indeed.

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