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Thread: T2 FM: Merchant's Manor 06-Sep-19

  1. #1
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019

    T2 FM: Merchant's Manor 06-Sep-19

    Download Links
    Darkfate: https://darkfate.org/view/details/fi...rchants_manor/


    Overview: Merchant's Manor is a large-mansion style map. Improvise and choose various routes throughout the level.
    Explore the wast Manor, gardens and maze. Use your gear to your advantage.


    Story:
    An associate of mine informed me that local merchant just had his hands on new invention. Prototype of lenses that enhance Watcher's abilities somehow and detailed schematics that can be used to produce such an invention.

    The Manor is heavily secured with various Mechanist's machines and dozens of guards. Luckily my bribe let me know of one easy entrance inside the manor - the well on the left side of garden.

    To my luck Merchant is having a celebration at this night. Showing off his fortunate invention I believe.
    Rumors say that his guard are heavy drinkers. Maybe some of them may be not so vigilant that night?


    Author Note:
    - Only Normal difficulty for now, I will fix issue with other difficulties soon
    - Map is made with intention to make player use his tools, especially rope arrows, more often.
    - I've experimented and made some areas a bit more wide and open than usual Thief 1/2 maps.
    - This is my first map made in DROMED for Thief 2, so all feedback would be very helpful! Don't be shy to point out all the things you didn't like!


    Screenshots: https://darkfate.org/view/details/fi...or/screenshots
    Last edited by Nick_UI; 7th Sep 2019 at 04:48.

  2. #2
    Congrats on the release. I noticed your mission does not have a readme file though, you might want to add one.

    Edit: Also, there are no objectives on Expert, which I think is the difficulty most players use.

  3. #3
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Dragonsreach
    According to Unna's post in the closed thread, there are even more issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unna Oertdottir View Post
    Monolog tells me that this mission was saved after game_mode_backup 0
    ?
    I would advise everyone not to download this mission until the author has addressed these issues. Also I must point out that proper beta testing would have prevented these issues from being in the initial release.

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    Also I would ask that when dates are entered in the title of a thread that a more universal format is used. 05/09/19 can be May 9 or September 5 depending on what format people use.

  5. #5
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Well I've just played the mission with no problem, starts ok, plays as expected and I experienced no issues worth reporting.

    As for the authors request for feedback, I played on hard difficulty and was impressed with the overall design, the manor is aesthetically pleasing, the author having avoided the usual newbie style of square boxes everywhere, but the lack of furniture in most of the rooms was a bit of a let down, the only key in the mission was not very well hidden, and all of the guards were far to easy to avoid or KO, making the mission all too easy to complete in only 27 mins.

    I also thought is was a bit strange that with so much security in the grounds, Mech bots and security camera, all the doors were unlocked making getting into the manor a breeze. I also came across a number of sound propagation issues, but overall I was impressed with the overall look of the manor and felt that with a bit more polish and making the mission harder it would be a much better mission than it is at the moment.

  6. #6
    Dóttirin klæðist oft móður möttli
    Registered: Apr 2015
    Quote Originally Posted by fortuni View Post
    I played on hard difficulty
    No you didn't. Only "Normal" difficulty is available due to the saving mistake (the difficulty will be saved after game_mode_backup 0).

  7. #7
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by Yandros View Post
    According to Unna's post in the closed thread, there are even more issues.



    I would advise everyone not to download this mission until the author has addressed these issues. Also I must point out that proper beta testing would have prevented these issues from being in the initial release.
    Yes, I believe you are right about testing part. Will be more careful next time

  8. #8
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by fortuni View Post
    Well I've just played the mission with no problem, starts ok, plays as expected and I experienced no issues worth reporting.

    As for the authors request for feedback, I played on hard difficulty and was impressed with the overall design, the manor is aesthetically pleasing, the author having avoided the usual newbie style of square boxes everywhere, but the lack of furniture in most of the rooms was a bit of a let down, the only key in the mission was not very well hidden, and all of the guards were far to easy to avoid or KO, making the mission all too easy to complete in only 27 mins.

    I also thought is was a bit strange that with so much security in the grounds, Mech bots and security camera, all the doors were unlocked making getting into the manor a breeze. I also came across a number of sound propagation issues, but overall I was impressed with the overall look of the manor and felt that with a bit more polish and making the mission harder it would be a much better mission than it is at the moment.
    Thank you for such a detailed review!

    I will try to fix these problems soon. Though my friend had a rough time playing - that's why I made the map easier than it was.

  9. #9
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by john9818a View Post
    Also I would ask that when dates are entered in the title of a thread that a more universal format is used. 05/09/19 can be May 9 or September 5 depending on what format people use.
    Done

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2017
    Has the objectives issue been fixed yet?

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by Unna Oertdottir View Post
    No you didn't. Only "Normal" difficulty is available due to the saving mistake (the difficulty will be saved after game_mode_backup 0).

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Touché?

    For me, normal and hard objectives are identical, and expert is empty.

  13. #13
    @fortuni - I don't completely understand how it works, but the command game_mode_backup saves the game state, which I think in this case the mission was saved while on Normal difficulty. If you check the goals.str, you can see the loot reqs for Normal is 1700, and for Hard it should be 2000 (but your screen above shows the former).

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    AFAIK when saving a .mis file in dromed and no difficulty is selected, either all objectives visible while playing through dromed are shown, or the normal difficulty is used. Changing the difficulty after a mission has started isn't possible, and in the case of game_mode_backup where the game is technically started already, changing the difficulty isn't possible either even though any of the three can be selected.

    I don't want my post to be too much like a dromed forum post, but if you see the following picture while saving then you shouldn't save.


  15. #15
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by john9818a View Post
    AFAIK when saving a .mis file in dromed and no difficulty is selected, either all objectives visible while playing through dromed are shown, or the normal difficulty is used. Changing the difficulty after a mission has started isn't possible, and in the case of game_mode_backup where the game is technically started already, changing the difficulty isn't possible either even though any of the three can be selected.

    I don't want my post to be too much like a dromed forum post, but if you see the following picture while saving then you shouldn't save.

    I don't really recall doing this before shipping level.
    But I suspect I might have done such a thing when I was only starting to make a map and didn't know much about Dromed.

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    @ Brethren

    You are probably right (as is Unna, as usual)

    Checking the Mission Quest data in Dromed there is only 1 loot objective, Goal_Loot_2 1700 (goal 2 is for normal), hard is Fiction_4 and Expert is Fiction_5, neither of which have a Goal_loot in the Mission Quest data.

  17. #17
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2018
    Location: Ukraine
    Probably a bug: the door to the "tower" (where the schematics are) can be opened with a sword.
    The area behind the flag in the main hall is totally deserving to be marked as a secret.

  18. #18
    Master Builder 2018
    Registered: Jul 2008
    Congratulations on your first release! Always great to see new authors.

    Also, if you want to test your missions in the future, you can register at Southquarter and we can provide you with a private testing forum where you and your testers can communicate, post screenshots, links, etc.

  19. #19
    New Member
    Registered: Aug 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by Tannar View Post
    Congratulations on your first release! Always great to see new authors.

    Also, if you want to test your missions in the future, you can register at Southquarter and we can provide you with a private testing forum where you and your testers can communicate, post screenshots, links, etc.
    Thanks, didn't know about that - will do.

  20. #20
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2012
    Location: Taffing in a pub
    I was playing this last night and I really enjoyed it!

    Just a few constructive criticisms though...

    I felt like what fortuni said was true, it was all over too quickly, I't was a bit too easy and lacking an Expert mode with more gold to collect, plus I had guard's who couldn't get up the stairs The Westen wing especially

    But I liked it for a first mission from you, with a little bit more work and beta testing this could be a great FM!

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: May 2001
    Location: Boston MA
    Nick:

    Congrats on completing your first mission, it is quite an accomplishment. We are always happy to have a new author join the ranks.

    When I built my first mission, I was shocked at how many things my testers found. They will discover objectives not working, parts are too difficult/too easy, textures thstbdon’t Line up, illogical sections, loot that is not accessible, areas where the player can access but is not supposed to (it always amazes me how players can get to areas you never intended them to get to), etc. You must keep an open mind and listen to their observations and your mission will be much better to play and everything will work. When you build a mission. It seems very logical but testers give an independent view which is very valuable.

    I would suggest pulling the mission temporarily and having it tested. The testers are usually pretty quick and quite observant. They will make a good mission much. Much better and more playable.

    Congrats again and keep on building. Warning - it gets addictive.

    bbb

  22. #22
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2011
    where can i find the schematics? from which tower are you talking?

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by radogoal View Post
    where can i find the schematics? from which tower are you talking?
    I believe you need to go back to Dining room and rope up to the balcony.

  24. #24
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2003
    Location: Frederikssund, Denmark
    Nick_UI,

    Thanks for this mission. Needs some fixing here and there, but fun to play.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Lille, France
    It looks like a pleasant FM.

    In the maze, there's a place when there's no sound, you cannot hear your own footsteps for instance.

    But when you play with the french version of Thief 2, the scrolls, books are empty. There's no title in the menu or a short title when saving.

    It's because you made a folder named "English".

    I guess it would be the same for the german version.

    Do you intend to do a multi-language mission?

    If yes, you can make a "French" folder. I can translate it, if you wish.

    If not, it's useless to do an "English" folder, IMO.

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