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Thread: Pretty weak A.I. Is it a glitch?

  1. #1
    New Member
    Registered: Sep 2019

    Pretty weak A.I. Is it a glitch?

    Playing this series for thr first time and its pretty good so far. I appreciate a game that does not give you all the directions and instructions to proceed.
    Ive heard about you having to be careful of your steps because even little noise from afar can alert gaurds. And they can still see you easily, even if you are in the shadows.
    But this not the case with the thief 2 im playing. They dont react to sound. I can walk loudly right behind them and they dont react. They have poor field of vision. Sometimes gaurds dont see you at all beyond 20 feet or so, in full light. Other times they comment that they maybe saw something. A foot closer and they start to search for you, but still haven't fully spotted you. All in full light.
    They do not react to noise. It is easy to run up behind two gaurds side by side and knock out one after the other, as they dont hear the noise right next to them. They only know you are there when you are right up close in front of them in the dark, or less than 20 feet away in the light.
    I thought that thief 2 will be harder than this. Not that i s
    am not challenged anyway. I am playing with tf2fix and the enhancement moid, and im playng on expert difficulty.

  2. #2
    It's a long time since I've played, but this sounds odd to me. When you say "in full light" I trust you're referring to the light gem's indication, rather than the apparent illumination? (Note that silhouettes are not a thing -- no one will see you if the gem is dark, even if you should be clearly back-lit).

    "They do not react to noise" might depend on the surface -- on some you are very quiet even though you can hear your own footsteps (e.g. carpet) -- but if you're really making lots of noise in general (including on loud surfaces) and the guards are ignoring you, that doesn't sound like the game I remember.

  3. #3
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    remember, weird things are bound to happen if loading a game from an old save (created before you patched with T2Fix). restarting the level by hitting the restart button in the menu should clear those up.

  4. #4
    As Shadowcat mentioned, the surfaces are important. Remember that only gravel, metal and tile are loud enough for guards to react to you running on them. Guards will react to you jumping on stone/wood, but grass, carpet and moss are all basically silent.

    Light is important but the light gem tells you if its a real issue or not. Also, having the small indicator be yellow often isn't enough if you're not moving for guards to see you except when very close. Red is absolutely visible, and black invisible. The shades between are somewhat important but that's the general idea.

  5. #5
    New Member
    Registered: Sep 2019
    No, no and no. I know carpet and grass is supposed to be quiter and be harder to alert gaurds. But it doesnt matter. Cobblestone, marble, wood, my loud footsteps do not do anything to them.
    And yes, the jewel will be full green, and they would only get suspicious for a moment even right in their face.
    I did not start playing the game unitl t2fix and the enhancement mod were installed.
    In mission 4 where im at right now, some of the A.I. is beefed up, where gaurds will instantly turn and charge at you from croach walking 15 feet behind them, and a few of them fully spotting you from 30 feet away.
    So i can tell there is something wrong with my game. Anyway to fix?

  6. #6
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    a few youtube clips might be helpful. or maybe go the other way around and watch a T2 LP and see whether the AI behavior is different.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigman88 View Post
    the enhancement mod
    is this the hdmod?

  7. #7
    Member
    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Texas
    Is the alarm sounding? Did the guards that are attacking you go to Alert 3 after seeing you earlier? If so then they are going to see you easier.

    If not then... Does this happen only with OMs? If you play a FM and the problem goes away, then I would suspect a corrupted dark.gam file.

  8. #8
    New Member
    Registered: Sep 2019
    Quote Originally Posted by voodoo47 View Post
    a few youtube clips might be helpful. or maybe go the other way around and watch a T2 LP and see whether the AI behavior is different.


    is this the hdmod?
    No. Thief Enhancement Pack 2.0

    https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthre...hancement+pack

  9. #9
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    that only enhances visuals, so it's fine. post videos perhaps, then?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigman88 View Post
    Cobblestone, marble, wood, my loud footsteps do not do anything to them.
    And yes, the jewel will be full green, and they would only get suspicious for a moment even right in their face.
    That really sounds broken to me. It's too long since I've played for me to have a firm recollection of potential A.I. quirks in particular circumstances; but in general I feel that what you describe shouldn't be happening, and there's quite likely a problem.

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    My experience is that you can run behind them on most surfaces and they'll hear it but only become alerted to level 1. On metal or other clangy surfaces they will beguin active searching. They will also go to level 2 on non-clangy floors if you jump up and down behind them.

    Maybe someday someone will make a mod that gives them realistic reactions. Any sound is an instant level 2. Guards do not calm down if they spot you, for the rest of the mission. They will react to you being in their outer periphery, , etc.

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2013
    I have wondered in the past whether NewDark has toned down the AI. I can remember the days of getting very frustrated when trying to sneak up behind patrolling guards amd they spin around at the last moment, causing you to have to run away, wait for them to calm down, then try again. Doesn't seem to happen nowadays.

  13. #13
    Desperately Dodgy Moderator
    Registered: Nov 2001
    Location: Dragonsreach
    I assume you mean TFix or similar patchers, and not NewDark itself, since it is an engine update and can't modify AI behavior in individual missions like that on its own. But in any case I don't think there has been any such global modification made to AI behavior or difficulty.

  14. #14
    Surely it's the game engine which is ultimately responsible for what the A.I. does (irrespective of what the missions believe they are instructing it to do)?

  15. #15
    New Member
    Registered: Oct 2019
    Location: Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigman88 View Post
    Cobblestone, marble, wood, my loud footsteps do not do anything to them.
    And yes, the jewel will be full green, and they would only get suspicious for a moment even right in their face.
    This is certainly broken as hell, especially when marble is considered, which in my case is always guaranteed to catch guards' immediate attention when run across at full speed. Wood has less chance of raising their awareness, from my experience though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cigam View Post
    I have wondered in the past whether NewDark has toned down the AI. I can remember the days of getting very frustrated when trying to sneak up behind patrolling guards amd they spin around at the last moment, causing you to have to run away, wait for them to calm down, then try again. Doesn't seem to happen nowadays.
    I can refute this, having played the game using the original engine and NewDark on two computers alternatingly and passing the savegames between them, which I did over the last 2 months, replaying Thief 2. I haven't noticed any differences in the AI.

  16. #16
    Yeah, if you've actually been running on marble the guards should be alerting instantly. It's the loudest surface in the game (except maybe metal?), you can't even walk on it near them, you basically have to avoid it. Or cheese it with very small, periodic movements to ensure Garrett never actually puts his foot down.

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