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Thread: System Shock Remake Demo Available Tomorrow

  1. #76
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by heywood View Post
    I'm not sure what you're saying either Pyrian.
    Sorry.

    Quote Originally Posted by heywood View Post
    ...or is it the use/shoot modality of the HUD that you find inexcusable?
    I... Think so? Lol. The fact that in "normal" mode you've got mouselook and then once you start interacting with menus you don't. You can still move, turn and do most things, but you have to use keyboard commands like original Doom controls, if you can even remember the bindings while a rumbler is chasing you around.

  2. #77
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: Netherlands
    Yeah but one press of the tab key instantly puts you back in shoot mode. Didn't cause me any problems to be honest.

  3. #78
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Harvester View Post
    Yeah but one press of the tab key instantly puts you back in shoot mode.
    Which you nearly have to do because the game makes it too difficult not to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harvester View Post
    Didn't cause me any problems to be honest.
    It's a terrible bit of UI design, not a game killer.

  4. #79
    SShock2.com
    Moderator

    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: 100 Rads Bar
    One press of the middle mouse key puts you back in shoot mode. If you still had mouselook while having the menus open that wouldn't make much sense and would make using the menus and moving around simultaneously practically impossible. I guess it's a throwback to the original Shock, where you didn't have mouselook and could move around while interacting with stuff and using the menus - I still play it like that and am yet to experience System Shock using mouselook.

    And anyway, why would you want to keep interacting with the menus while being chased by a rumbler?

  5. #80
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by D'Arcy View Post
    If you still had mouselook while having the menus open that wouldn't make much sense and would make using the menus and moving around simultaneously practically impossible.
    Right now it's "practically impossible" (ironically at the time of release I was able to do it, albeit still poorly, due to having played a lot of Doom before mouselook - most recent time I played I couldn't do it at all). It doesn't "make sense" because the menus are mouse driven.

    Quote Originally Posted by D'Arcy View Post
    And anyway, why would you want to keep interacting with the menus while being chased by a rumbler?
    Getting the right weapon or other equipment ready/fixed/maintained/loaded with the proper ammo/recharged/used. On later playthroughs it's relatively easy to always be ready, the game is actually very predictable, tending to spawn the exact same enemies in the exact same places. Also, coulda really used a proper toolbelt instead of random hotkeys for various consumables. (I remember my first time getting all the way to the big pools of radioactive water in the body of the many before figuring out there was a key for rad hypos, lol.)

    Anyway, I never saw many games falling over themselves to imitate SS2's UI. ...Because it's not very good.

  6. #81
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    what? SS2 UI is pretty much perfect for this type of game, it does exactly what needs to be done the way it's supposed to be done. the top recommendation I've given to NDS when they were asking about SSEESP enhancements was "the closer you can get the UI to what SS2 has, the better".

  7. #82
    SShock2.com
    Moderator

    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: 100 Rads Bar
    I usually don't stop while interacting with the menus in SS2. I open them on the go, do what I have to do, and close them while still moving towards my destination. And I enjoy being able to do so.

  8. #83
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: Land of the crazy
    How else could they have handled it without pausing the game? SS2 just wouldn't be the same if you could stop the action while you leisurely organize your inventory, repair weapons, play logs, etc. A lot of the tension would be lost.

  9. #84
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrian View Post
    The fact that in "normal" mode you've got mouselook and then once you start interacting with menus you don't. You can still move, turn and do most things, but you have to use keyboard commands like original Doom controls, if you can even remember the bindings while a rumbler is chasing you around.
    I still can't figure out what the hell you're talking about. It sounds like you're saying that in Use mode the mouse should move the menu cursor AND control the player view, which would be nausea-inducing stupidity, so clearly you must mean something else.

  10. #85
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by voodoo47 View Post
    what? SS2 UI is pretty much perfect for this type of game, it does exactly what needs to be done the way it's supposed to be done.
    The proof is in the absence of pudding:

    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrian View Post
    Anyway, I never saw many games falling over themselves to imitate SS2's UI. ...Because it's not very good.
    Quote Originally Posted by D'Arcy View Post
    I usually don't stop while interacting with the menus in SS2. I open them on the go, do what I have to do, and close them while still moving towards my destination. And I enjoy being able to do so.
    Thank you. The premise is good, just poorly implemented, and the solution I keep being given is "don't do that" (click out of the menu), which IMO really misses the point.

    Quote Originally Posted by heywood View Post
    How else could they have handled it without pausing the game?
    Non-mouse centric UI.

  11. #86
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrian View Post
    Non-mouse centric UI.
    Are you suggesting we should have been forced to navigate a UI as complex as SS2's using console-style gamepad controls? You think that would have actually made it easier to use the menus while also running around?

    You keep gormlessly insisting that no other game uses a UI like SS2, but near every action RPG uses a mouse-driven UI like SS2 (most notably SS2's immediate successor, Deus Ex). The only distinction is that SS2 doesn't pause the game when you're using the menus.

  12. #87
    Member
    Registered: May 2010
    Don't get the issues with SS2's interface. I think it's very nice. Especially considering how old the game is.

  13. #88
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: Land of the crazy
    If you're using keyboard controls to navigate the UI, your hand won't be free to use the movement controls and vice versa. You could eliminate the modality of the UI that way, but you'd still be switching modes with your hand. And it would make the UI tedious to navigate.

  14. #89
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Ireland
    Yes, I really don't get that.

    The inventory doesn't pause because realistically it shouldn't, and because inventory pause would take away some of the tension in the game. You're still not really expected to be running around while looking in your inventory. If you need to look around, you'd just close it.

    There's only one mouse; if you have it controlling the cursor, you can't have it controlling the view as well.
    Using keys to navigate the inventory would make it much harder to use.

    I don't see what the alternative would be. Switching the mouse to a cursor while in inventory/meu mode is pretty much standard for any game with an inventory, other than strange edge cases like Thief or Hexen which generally only have very few items.

  15. #90
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland
    An updated demo is now available on Steam, GOG, and Epic. Also, new teaser trailer!



    https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/you...make-right-now

    edit: I played a bit of the demo. Cyberspace is really... something. I suspect the reception of its visuals of it will be even more divisive than those of the main game. I, for one, absolutely LOVE how it looks.

    The actual gameplay of it tho is just kinda a slightly subpar Descent clone.
    Last edited by henke; 25th Feb 2021 at 16:13.

  16. #91
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by henke View Post
    I played a bit of the demo. Cyberspace is really... something. I suspect the reception of its visuals of it will be even more divisive than those of the main game. I, for one, absolutely LOVE how it looks.
    Christ, even here at TTLG we have people with the aesthetic sense of a Trump.

  17. #92
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland
    I mean... just slathering everything in gold does look pretty cool.

  18. #93
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    runs on windows7 again, performance seems a bit better, save/load is available, logs work, mutants drool.

    pixels still ugly as sin.

  19. #94
    SShock2.com
    Moderator

    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: 100 Rads Bar
    Cyberspace is currently almost unplayable for me due to the fact that, when I enter it, the game ignores my mouse Y-axis inverted setting.

  20. #95
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland
    Yeah I also had my share of problems with Cyberspace. First time I got kicked out because time ran out and once I got out some soundeffect kept looping over and over. Had to quit to get away from it. Second time I made it through but once I got out the geometry for the next room would load. I was just walking around in pitch blackness out there. Had to save, restart the game, and load to get the next room to show up again.

  21. #96
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: Land of the crazy
    Had a go last night. I don't care for the look of cyberspace, but it makes the geometry easier to follow and it's more fun to play than the original.

    I'm looking forward to the release.

  22. #97
    Level 10,000 achieved
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Finland
    I've also had bugs with enemies not seeing me and being invincible after a reload and the game not shutting down properly so now Steam thinks I've been playing this demo for 17.3 hours.

    I'm posting all my bugs in this thread: https://steamcommunity.com/app/48240...3950421898145/ If anyone else wants to register their bugs it's probably a good idea to put them in the Steam forums, more likely to be seen by Nightdive there.

    edit: I ended up playing through this whole demo again. Despite the bugs this is really engrossing and I very much look forward to the full release.
    Last edited by henke; 27th Feb 2021 at 11:08.

  23. #98
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Ireland
    Any point in also going to the Steam forums to shout about the horrible pixelation?

    Edit: Probably not, considering there's already 15 pages of that, including a disturbing number of people who think "we made it look really bad on purpose" is a good thing.

  24. #99
    Zombified
    Registered: Sep 2004
    no, apart from letting some steam out, there is absolutely no point in trying to discuss the pixelation at this point. apart of maybe asking the devs what kind of tools will be required to mod it out.

    10 bucks SHTUP-SSR is going to be reaally popular.

  25. #100
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    If someone makes that, it'll be someone other than me.

    Best hope is that someone can convince Night Dive to release the source art files so modders can plug in all these otherwise nice looking textures as they were meant to be seen.

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