OMs - Ghost/Perfect Thief Results [SPOILERS]

[klatremus]

This thread will be used to post the results of players' attempts at ghosting official missions (OMs) whether wholly successful or not. The Official Rules for Ghost and Perfect Thief modes of play can be found HERE.

Each post of ghost results should record the OM name, the game (T1/TG, T2 or T3), the user's play mode (Ghost or Perfect or Supreme), the end-mission statistics, and any comments regarding the ghosting of the fan mission. Well written comments are appreciated.

WARNING: Discussions regarding how the mission was ghosted (or not) probably contain spoilers. Please do NOT use spoiler alerts in this thread. Everyone reading should be aware of that fact. If you want to simply know if a mission was ghosted successfully or not, just read the statistics portion of a post.

Replying to a reported ghost result is appropriate, but hurrah messages should be kept to a minimum. Discussing how to ghost a mission not yet reported here should be done in a separate thread, or in the general ghost rules discussion thread HERE. The idea is to report ghost attempts and perhaps to discuss failures and possible solutions but not to produce a lot of fluff within this thread. Please note that nobody requires a mission to be ghostable. Ghostable missions are not necessarily a good thing. When made so deliberately, they tend to be too easy. Comments about whether or not a mission is ghostable do not reflect negatively on the mission. Ghosting is just a means of raising the level of difficulty in the play.

[lordhern]

Thief 2 - Official Mission 1 Running interference [New Dark]

playmode IRONMAN.
Perfect Thief - Success
Perfect Ghost - Success
Perfect Supreme - FAIL

time 28 min 44 seconds.
1286/1285 look.
3/3 Secrets.
due to the blackjack requirements 8 damage dealt. all other damage stats 0. no kills etc.

no consumables used, no lights out etc. it was a supreme attempt at first. no 2nd level alerts.

Some comments. with NewDark you can mantle the front gates BEFORE entering the side door - then you can strafe-crouch-creep on the far right side around and mantle onto the porch to KO the two guards there without worrying about the patrolling archer who will come outside to patrol AFTER you enter the side door.

I did this - entered the side door then headed back out to the front to get my two picks from the archer that showed up.

then back inside to KO the two guards at the first danger area for Basso. got all my pick-pockets and all the secrets. i picked up everything that wasn't nailed down. didn't use any consumable. all the potions and flares i picked up were left on the butlers table for him to clean up. Teaches him right for leaving his lights on.


Due to ironman I had to accept the first alert from front guard 2 when front guard 1 fell forward after KO generating first alert "what did i see there" from #2. no other first alerts detected. so if i had no alerts from them i would have supremed the rest of the mission by not leaving the mess on the butlers table.

[lordhern]

Thief 2 OM mission 2 shipping and receiving [New Dark]

playmode IRONMAN
Perfect thief - FAIL - see ghost on next line
Ghost - all ghost modes FAIL - i prioritize loot over ghost.
Time 49 minutes, 43 seconds.
17/18 picks

zero damage, yada yada.

I lost count of first alerts.

Consumables used - two arrows both in same warehouse - to lower the elevator and open the painting.

Ghost failures four total - three were the banners to get the loot (and three secrets) hiding behind them. the last bust was the spiders in the big crate on the boat - they went into level 2 alert grabing the final spice bag.

In retrospect I could have used one of the invisibility potions i picked up to avoid the spider busts but since it was ironman meh.


Mynells was tough but i didn't get more than 1st level alerts from any spiders.
I was able to creep-strafe-run against the left wall wall and open the large-spider cage with no alert from any spider. I dropped potions on the floor to silent jump over the metal. collected the gem and exited the same way closing the gate after i left the cage.

on closing the gate the three sewer spiders from the other side startet to patrol in a formation toward the large cage. they did chirp /level 1 alert to my crouch-strafe-run exit the man-door but nothing more while I hid outside - once the three sewers were close to the large spider gate door i dashed in via the open garage door to collect statue from behind the crate and ride the elevator up. Once upstairs i opened an orange door and made my way back down to the front via building B ground floor exits. waited out the sewer spiders to return to their original area of the warehouse then rode the elevator up on big spider side. Mantled onto the freezer to grab the safe key, exited via the orange-door re-entered the other side via the unlocked orange door to get the secret/recipe from the safe.

To be honest I was puzzled by the sewer spiders patrol. normally they start patrolling toward large spider on the gate OPENING, not closing. in old-dark i was forced to use invisibility to get that spider gem w/o hunt mode from all four dunno what happened there. I'll take it.

I think my missing pickpocket was the archer that patrols the walkway close to the starting position - i never did find him in building A and i didn't ever hear his walking on the metal. I'm sure he was stuck somewhere.

As for davidson's ship, after climbing aboard on the ladder I used a rope-arrow angled on the ship side to climb up and hide on the prow side of the large crate to wait out the pirate patrols and the stationary guard positioning - when the coast was clear, from the top of the crate i opened it, dropped an invisibility potion, dropped down onto the potion. grabbed the spice and jumped up/took the potion with me as i mantled back up. the spiders went from level1 to level2 as i mantled up. I dropped of the side of ship behind the crate and didn't stick around to see if the alerted spiders ran into the pirates or not.

so regardless, this mission cannot be perfect thief ghosted as three pieces of loot must be skipped because of banners, and it's damn near impossible to get the last spice bag from the spiders w/o dousing torches or using chemicals to avoid level 2 from them and the normally ensuing battle between spiders and pirates.

All in all it's still a fun mission with lots of places to use rope arrows to move vertically.

[klatremus]

Awesome work here! Ironman ghost is certainly no joke. Highly challenging indeed.

Could I ask you to organize the stats in your report a little bit better? The way it is now makes it quite difficult to read. I have a report listed below that you can take a look at for reference. Normally the stats come in a list at the top of the post, then the comments below (which don't have to be nearly as long as I make them).

[klatremus]

Game: Thief 2 Demo
FM: An Unwelcome Guest [NewDark]

Ghost - Success
Perfect Thief - Failed
Supreme Ghost - Failed
Perfect Supreme - Failed
Time - 1:40:46
Loot - Ghost: 2310/2735, Supreme: 2270/2735
Pockets Picked - 7/28
Locks Picked - 5
Secrets - 2/4
Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0
Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0
Healing taken - 0, Other Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 1

See the entire report with screenshots here!
Loot list here!
YouTube let's play here!

Comments:
The objectives were as follows: get the schematics from the mechanist tower, the diamonds from the local bank, and break into Carlysle armory, plus 1,700 in loot along the way. I was more than well-equipped and easily skipped any purchases. I started by the bell tower in the southeast.

During my blackjack run, I realized the objectives had to be completed in a specific order. The Carlysle armory required a key found in the mech tower, but it had to be replaced due to the rule that makes Supreme Ghost much tougher than plain Ghost. Rule #7 states: “Put Everything back that can be put back: doors closed and re-locked if they are re-lockable, chests and gates closed if closable; keys returned, books/scrolls/letters returned to their original place.[...]” If breaking into the armory is the last unchecked objective, the mission simply ends successfully, leaving you with no possibility of returning the key. I needed to ensure I had the opportunity to return to the tower after completing this objective, which meant that other objectives had to be unchecked as well. I could wait with stealing the bank diamonds, but then the mission would end before managing to close the safe. No, the only option was to hold off stealing the schematics in the tower. My route was therefore as follows: to the bank, to the tower to pick up the key, to the armory, back to the tower to drop off the key, snatch the schematics, then leave the tower.

The Thieves’ Highway
The first minor challenge came west of the bell tower. The building didn’t have a name on the map, but was located somewhat southeast of van Vernon’s. There was a sleeping archer upstairs and a patrolling swordsman walking unpredictable rounds below. An artifact stood on display above some stairs at the other end of the same building. The picture below is taken from the only spot in the staircase where I was safe. The patrolling guard and another archer (awake this time) were nearby, but with a small hop the loot was mine.



Moving west I approached the famous archer fight best known from ‘Life of the Party’. There was a route circumventing this whole scenario, but it involved property damage on a boarded up passage in a nearby building. There were two ways past the archers after the battle was over. One went along the southern wall, the other through a small apartment accessible from the northern guard tower. The van Vernon archers usually won the clash, and in my case both of them survived. Afterwards, while the archers had their backs turned hunting, I could rope up the west side of the tower without alerts (see image below). From there I could wait for them to settle.



East of this area and south of Fieldstone I found a cracked roof with a spider below. Had to gently lurk myself down the hole to get the ring in the corner (see image). The adjacent building had more loot and some equipment, but the only way in was by breaking an unbarred window. This was against ghosting rules, so I skipped it.



The housebreakers north of Fieldstone (see image above) posed a tricky challenge. The outside guard stared straight towards the entrance and alerted as soon as I appeared in the doorway, often directly to hunt mode. The patrolling guard charged them if detected, but this is not a legal way to obtain the loot inside. Rule #5 of the Official Ghost Rules states: “Garrett must not cause suicides of AI or melees that intentionally cause AI to attack each other […]” However, the thieves had a conversation upon entry and during this chat their alert level was heavily reduced. Avoiding alerts during enemy conversations is not considered an engine exploit. It is totally fine to take these pieces of loot while the thieves are talking for Supreme. It makes sense that they would be preoccupied and not detect you while conversing. However, I always got a first alert sneaking into the room before their conversation triggers. I tried triggering it outside, then running in before it ends, but I never made it in time. The only way to get the loot for Supreme is if the outside guard somehow wanders in there and gets killed. In that case, the outside thief normally positions himself further north, so that he doesn’t see you when you enter. I was been able to get the loot successfully like this for Supreme. Remember though, you can’t leave the door open to construct a fight between the thieves and the guard; only if he happens to open the door himself is this allowed, and that does happen from time to time.

North of Sir Cullen’s Keep I ran into more unobtainable loot. I emerged on a roof with visible coin stacks in the office below, but, alas, the glass had to be broken to reach it. Instead I headed east through an open apartment and snuck into Dayport Trader’s Bank. Not much to report here except for one strange thing. The patrolling swordsman alerted to the vault being open when wandering down the next door hallway, not when passing through the room with the vault itself. There has got to be a glitch in the design where he accidentally spots the vault through the wall and alerts that way. It was only a comment so plain Ghost was good, but it had to be avoided for Supreme. I simply flipped the switch in the office, rushed out to steal the vault contents and returned to close the vault door before the guard ever ventured down the hall.

The double doors led to the balcony with archers peering in both directions. Nothing of interest out here except for Lady Louisa’s house to the northeast. Unfortunately, it was impossible to enter from either side, since two of the three women were staring straight out the two windows. I would try later from the north end coming from the tower, but I was fairly sure another 200 gold had to be skipped.

I couldn’t rob Shemenov’s from this side, so I had to backtrack through Sir Cullen’s keep and approach it via the rooftops in the east. I had a hard time figuring out how to evade the gaze of the archer on the wooden balcony. In the end I needed four rope arrows in the building at the opposite side (see image below). The eave was dark enough to avoid any comments. I had to descend the last rope a bit in order to successfully cross the street and land in a mantle. There was not much shade and a patrolling swordsman on the other side. I had to inch along the walls to lurk my way into Shemenov’s chimney. Putting out the kitchen fireplace would bust Supreme, so I jumped off and quickly got out of the way to avoid damage. The servant was extremely alert and I had to creep-crouch the entire way to prevent comments. The hallway guard had a long route and I got the only piece of loot while he was away. A banner on the wall concealed a hidden chest with a necklace (see image). It could be reached through the banner, I simply slashed it for sake of the screenshot.



The Tower
Passing the buildings north of the greenhouse, the only way into the tower was via an open top floor window. I waited for the conversation to finish and then snuck inside. I could grab two of the four pieces of loot in here by hugging the walls. Some of the guests were extremely jumpy and I had to make use of my creeping abilities most of the time. I could not reach the three purses on the east side of the hall without triggering first alert comments, so that loot (40 gold) had to be skipped for Supreme. To round the corner by the door for plain Ghost I could either run and come to a quick halt or turn off the lamp on the wall. That took care of the purse on the single nobleman, but the woman directly to the east of the fountain was much tougher. Not only was she positioned directly under a chandelier, but she was talking to a man facing the opposite direction. Together they covered pretty much every entry point. Once I realized that the ceiling was rope attachable I soon figured out the solution. The image below is taken from the corner opposite the door, in the southeast end of the ballroom. Coincidentally, the fountain’s east side was the only place dark enough not the be seen at ground level. Everywhere else was too illuminated. I could traverse the rope arrows and descend into the water just to the left of the couple. I actually made a hop onto the fountain ledge before leaning in to grab her purse. The arrows were positioned close enough for me to turn around and grab them as I Tarzaned my way back.



The 8th floor was packed with enemies, but scattered with dark patches, making sneaking tough but doable. The main junction was just outside the double-doors to Karras’ office. The outside guard covered the western part of the lit hallway, forcing me to venture through the library. At least that’s what I saw it as; a carpeted area with bookshelves and a tome. No less than two stationary guests, one sentry and two patrollers covered that room. With good timing, and proper use of shaded spots, I found my way to the easternmost wall (see image). The rest of the floor was quite standard. Plenty of smaller rooms to clean, but nothing significant to report. The kitchen servants didn’t have first alerts, which made the job a bit easier for Supreme. I found the Carlysle key in one of the bedrooms to the west.

I saved Karras’ office for later, and instead made my way to the top floor and back through the city to the armory in the west. A bit tedious to backtrack to this extent, but I guess it was worth the trouble. Everything there was ghostable. The armory door was protected by a pivoting swordsman; no bother whatsoever. I didn’t have to steal anything to get credit for the break-in. Found the last piece of loot north of the compound inside an open bedroom window.



Back in the mechanist tower my last tasks were to return the armory key for Supreme and head for the main office. The only way to approach it was from the east, where I could creep-crouch unnoticed all the way up to the stationed guard. Then came the blow. Unlocking the door spawned a comment from the guard. This inescapable Supreme bust slapped me in the face like an iron gauntlet; so close, but yet so far. My sorrow was short lived, however. Instead I started worrying about how to at least keep plain Ghost intact. Blocking the eastern door as the other swung open was the only method of entry, but even then the guard somewhat blocked my progress. In the end, I had to nudge the guard forward enough to squeeze through (see image above), before the patrolling mechanist appeared from the library. Not more than a couple of inches was needed, but still another Supreme bust. This was a last resort option, so plain ghosting rules do allow it. The schematics could be taken through the painting, without triggering the alarm. Leaving the complex was just like before, except this time carrying the bitter taste of Supreme defeat.



One thing different in version 1.13 for NewDark, is the guard by the office door. I’m not sure if he is positioned closer to the door or whether he simply is more alert, but he is much more difficult to sneak up on. On either side of the door there is a narrower part of the hallway (right image above) that I had to round before being able to hug the wall just next to the guard. I couldn’t sneak to that wall without getting a third alert, let alone just a comment. I used to be able to do it completely undetected. The only way to get there was to rush around the corner, accepting a first alert. I could unlock the door from a few feet away, triggering another first alert like before. However, I could not get in behind him to push him forward in order to enter. I couldn’t even get close enough in order to block the closest door. It seemed like my proximity to him, as well as the angle, set him off. If Garrett’s mid-point is in front of a guard’s mid-point, even if it’s ever so slightly, bumping into them from the side will make them catch you. I knew that if I couldn’t get behind him, then this mission wouldn’t be ghostable. I tried climbing ropes attached to the wooden door frame, and then lower myself behind him, but to no avail. Next I tried tossing crates by him, hoping this would push him away. Again, no luck. There are no invisibility potions available in this mission either, thinking I would have to accept a chemical success. I was almost ready to give up hope when I figured out the solution. The key was unlocking the doors and letting the closest one block the guard’s view. If I pushed against the door and frobbed it twice in quick succession, I’d inch forward while still having the door block me. Once I did this a few times, I could close the door and rush in behind him immediately without getting caught. Perhaps his view doesn’t get unblocked until the door is fully closed, or something to that nature. Regardless, I was successfully in the position where I could push him west, enough for me to get into the office. Brilliant!

Notes
- Had to skip the loot (150 gold) in the building southeast of Fieldstone. Breaking the window to gain entry is not allowed for any mode.
- Had to skip three more coin stacks worth 75 gold in the office directly north of Sir Cullen’s Keep. Breaking the window (property damage) is again in violation of every ghost mode.
- Skipped 200 worth of loot at Lady Louisa’s for all modes. Both windows were covered by women staring straight at the openings. No way around it.
- Had to skip 40 more loot on the tower’s top floor for Supreme. The three guests carrying purses to the east were out of reach and commented.
- Got comments from the office guard in the tower when unlocking the double doors. Also had to nudge him forward a tad to enter the office. The latter is a last resort and therefore allowed in plain Ghost. Both of these are Supreme Ghost busts. Got one more comment when leaving the office also.

[lordhern]

Awesome work here! Ironman ghost is certainly no joke. Highly challenging indeed.

Could I ask you to organize the stats in your report a little bit better? The way it is now makes it quite difficult to read. I have a report listed below that you can take a look at for reference. Normally the stats come in a list at the top of the post, then the comments below (which don't have to be nearly as long as I make them).

Here you are;

Game Thief 2 Original Missions - NEW DARK

Framed and Ambush!

Framed:
Ironman mode
Ghost - Success
Perfect Thief - Sucess
Supreme Ghost - FAIL
Perfect Supreme - FAIL

All loot,
one pick
time: 34:17
no damage (none allowed anyway)

Comments on Framed

Corpses with purses don't count to your pick-pockets so the one pick that shows up in the stats is the key I lifted from a patrolling guard.

Re Supreme fail - I was so close. I returned the key to the guard patrol path with no issues. The only bust was a level 1 alert *just before ending the mission* - a guard heard the door closing and commented. I MISSED IT BY THAT MUCH.

Framed is a trivial mission to perfect thief and normal ghost - all patrols are static. lots of quiet places to return keys, lots of dark areas, quiet surfaces. All loot is either in a dark area or unpatrolled. it's also easy to mantle out of bounds and well out of sight of the watchers to enter and exit Shoalsgate with ease. you should have no issues perfect supreme ghosting it in new dark.



Ambush
Ironman mode
Ghost success
Perfect thief success
Supreme ghost - Success
Perfect Supreme - SUCCESS!!

Time 35:37
Loot: 1970/1970
Pockets picked one
Locks picked two

no damage dealt, none received yada yada.

Comments on Ambush

Near the exit gate there are three sets of patrolling guards that seem to be in something close to a 2:3:5 resonance between the groups - it's trivial to wait them out from the rafters above the stationary guard. In my most recent run i didn't hear any alerts picking the door close to that stationary guard so supreme was maintained.

getting the purse from the water under the W - I generally find going to snatch it is best AFTER getting your stash from the apartment - the patrols are nicely spread out by then to not hear you splashing around in the water.

After opening the exit gate i lock-blocked it and ghosted all the way back to the apartment to return the key. when I returned to the cemetery it was closed again! - NewDark mantle to the rescue as i was able to merely mantle/jump over it - had I realized that I would have left the key in the closet stash in the first place. I would probably have completed mission sooner too.


this mission is almost as easy to ironman as running interference. This is due to all the patrol routes being static with only a minor variance for pivot points.

[klatremus]

Game: Thief 2
FM: Running Interference [NewDark]

Ghost - Success
Perfect Thief - Success
Supreme Ghost - Success
Perfect Supreme - Success
Time - 31:30
Loot - 1285/1285
Pockets Picked - 4/9
Locks Picked - N/A
Secrets - 2/3
Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 8
Damage dealt - 8, Damage taken - 0
Healing taken - 0, Other Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0
Consumables - None

See the entire report with screenshots here!
Loot list here!
YouTube let's play here!

Comments:
The main game’s introductory mission for me leaves more to be desired. It’s a standard mansion map that serves more as training than anything else. The textures are beautiful and a huge step up from the original game, but the layout is a little boring and tension virtually non-existent. The storyline also has no connection with the following missions. I can’t see the replay value for anyone other than ghosters here.

My main objective was simple: leave with Basso and Jenivere after giving him the birdcall signal. I also needed to pick up at least 600 in loot, including 200 in gems. An additional goal, which made things very interesting for Supreme, was scoring at least 8 knockouts. Any violations explicitly stated in the objectives are allowed for all modes. This was a clear example of that.

No purchase screen, and my inventory was essentially empty; even the lockpicks were gone. Fifteen water arrows were all of interest, except for my blackjack this time. My only option was to enter via the side door. I was forced upstairs instantly, due to two stationary guards covering the basement hall. I would have to get a key to open the door to their chamber, or approach from the opposite side and put them to sleep. I would count my knockouts carefully and make them as strategic as possible. The first one came in the eastern end of the first floor. A swordsman had a very short patrol route right on top of the stairs coming from the butler’s (see image). The entire hall was lit except for a portion to the west. I got my blackjack ready and sprinted up the stairs as he pivoted away. I couldn’t reach him before he turned around again, and I had to slow down or else he commented. The only way to knock him out was to lean forward from a tiny portion along either wall, just past the door on the right (green area in the image below). Any other area would only be pitch black when crouching. Garrett automatically stands up when going for the blackjack strike, again spawning a comment, so I had to reach this “magic” area shown in the picture. If he bumped into me, he alerted, so I had to lean forward and strike as soon as possible. It was a tough set of moves, but highly doable.



For now, I cleaned what I could on this floor. Found a hidden pair of rings in the wall of the great hall fireplace (see image). It spawned a hidden objective. Some very tough lucky coins lay on top of a ledge leading down to the kitchen (see image below). The servant roaming around here was my next knockout victim for two reasons. His patrol path was randomized and the kitchen was part of Basso’s escape route. It also made traversing the basement a lot easier. The patrolling archer west of the kitchen tasted my blackjack as well.



I needed to get ahold of a yellow key. There were six of them spread about the compound, five of which were located behind doors needing that very key to open. The sixth was on a swordsman doing tiny loops back and forth in the dining hall. I could steal his key riding the dumbwaiter, but I couldn’t replace it for Supreme without alerting him. There was no way to blackjack him either. Instead I decided to climb the front yard gates. There were half a million boxes in the basement anyway. A patrolling archer with a key had spawned outside during my escapades in the manor. Three crates were enough to climb either pillar by the entrance. In NewDark, you don’t need any crates, as you can easily mantle the gate itself. The opposite side was dark enough for me to observe the archer passing. From behind the westernmost one I could safely inch forward and grab his belongings. This move seems a lot harder in NewDark. In general, I have found sneaking fast on marble or tile a lot more difficult to accomplish on the new engine. The two basement guards were now approachable via the locked door to the south (see image below). This circumvented dousing the outside torch and busting Supreme.



I returned the boxes and looted the remaining parts of the mansion. The only tricky bit was stealing the loot from the front yard lawn. The front guards were the last two on my knockout list. I had to take them one by one and hide them inside the main entrance. The patroller noticed the bodies and started searching. The middle lamppost actually helped me stay hidden from the orbiting archer. His route wasn’t entirely circular, and I exploited a few moments where he had his back turned. I dropped the key along his path for Supreme.

I could now safely return out front and give Basso the whistle. He fetched Jenivere and the mission ended as I went outside. Perfect Supremed this one!

Notes
- Knockouts: Swordsman patrolling small route outside the parlor on the first floor, kitchen servant, archer west of kitchen, three stationary guards to the east in the basement, and two stationary guards outside the mansion’s main entrance. No busts, due to the explicit instructions in the objectives.

[klatremus]

Ironman mode
Ghost success
Perfect thief success
Supreme ghost - Success
Perfect Supreme - SUCCESS!!

Awesome work on Ambush, lordhern! Ironman Perfect Supreme, WOW!!

Those stats look a lot better. Could you edit your first two posts to the same format?

[lordhern]

Thief 2 Original Missions - Eavesdropping [New Dark]

Ironman mode
Ghost Unsure
Perfect thief FAIL
Supreme ghost - Fail.
Perfect Supreme - Fail.

Total Time 36 min 58 Seconds
Loot 2119/2119
Pockets Picked 1/1, Locks Picked 2
all damage stats 0, yada yada
secrets found 1/1

Comments on eavesdropping - perfect supreme fail was a level 1 alert bust down in the catacombs - the safety deposit box key had to be returned to the dead body and I got an alert on dropping it from one of the haunts. The only time i have ever ironman supremed this level is if the key is in the 2nd floor office, the shed or the dormitories - all other locations are too well patrolled for silent return w/o supreme busts normally.

the pick-pocket was the corpse on the floor of the catacombs. strange. old dark never counted that as a pick.

I had no problems looting the entire place - I always loot the altar early on while the two AI's are talking about the sherif's meeting. if you don't loot it then you won't be able to ghost it later. I avoid the western side door- if you trigger them you end up with extra patrolling AI making your life miserable for ghosters.

I was able to return to the chapel and take the tiara from the pews with NO alerts at all from the front door guard. had to use crouch creep and couldn't lean in to grab it. had to move SLOWLY.


EDIT: I am certain the stationary servent near the ring in the pit alerts to the doors opening in that external alcove. if so perfect supreme might have to skip the 125 loot (purse and ring) in that area. I didn't hear an alert though - I think I will turn on the closed captions available with t-fix 1.27 so i can READ if there is an alert going forward

replayed the first part of the map - yes the servant alerts on the door pick. next time I ironman thief2 i'll not bother picking the lab door - i'll get the purse and ring after I find the right key.

[Galaer]

Comments on eavesdropping - perfect supreme fail was a level 1 alert bust down in the catacombs - the safety deposit box key had to be returned to the dead body and I got an alert on dropping it from one of the haunts.

Wait, if you scored 1st alert while returning safety deposit key, it counts as supreme ghost bust, not just perfect supreme bust.

[lordhern]

thanks - I was copy-pasting from notepad - corrected above.

[Galaer]

Thief 2 OM mission 2 shipping and receiving [New Dark]

playmode IRONMAN
Perfect thief - SUCCESS
Ghost - all ghost modes FAIL - i prioritize loot over ghost.
Time 49 minutes, 43 seconds.
17/18 picks

Um, how to tell you that? If you read ghost rules, you will find that you achieve Perfect Thief by completing regular Ghost and getting all loot. Since you failed all forms of ghost, you automatically failed Perfect Thief too.

[klatremus]

He is right. Perfect Thief=Ghost+Max Loot. If you fail all ghost modes, then perfect thief is also failed.

[lordhern]

Thief 2 Original Missions - Bank [New Dark]

Ironman mode
Ghost - FAIL
Perfect thief - FAIL
Supreme ghost - Fail
Perfect Supreme - Fail

Total Time 2h 8 min 53 Seconds
Loot 2284/2284
Pockets Picked 17/18, Locks Picked 11
all damage stats 0.
secrets found 2/2

consumables used - two moss arrows to silently return keys to stationary key picks proximity, and total of four water-arrows to remotely hit light switches (turned off two, used the other two arrows to turn them back on when done)

got all the loot, but still busted.

Comments on 1st City Bank and Trust.

Starting out I followed the three patrolling guards towards the basement window - I picked the tailing archer before mantling onto the porch where I looted the bar before waiting for the patrol to come back.

I hit the basement next - I unlocked the vault then returned the buttons to the same starting configuration, then returned to the porch to start my east end looting. I used water arrow to hit the light switch/turn off the lights in the ramp room with the two child bots in their perpetual conversation to go to the third floor where able to perfectly ghosting the three cameras up there. while there I disabled the lobby cameras then went to the first floor lobby area where I followed the battle bot and cleaned the the rooms behind the lobby, then I looted the lobby and headed to the west end.

It was on my way to the red key that I busted ghost - I was able to pick the patrolling archer but I missed my perfect mantle near the key and landed on tile LOUDly. this resulted in level 2 alert searches by both archer and at least one battle bot. I was never seen but still it busts ghost. Ironman forbids save/reload so i continued anyway as i was probably close to an hour into the level and had nothing more than low-light chirps from camera's near the library and the bar before that.

After the bot started normal patrol and the the archer gave his settling remarks headed toward the vault on the 1st floor from the south hallway. I was was able to pick the key from the sword guard that is stationary near the vault. From the south portion of the hallway I was able to lean around the corner to nab the key as he turns. I found that by picking his key the archer failed to start his patrol so it made getting to the vault a bit trickier and subsequently missed one arrow pick.

After i got his pick I finished looting the rest of the bank than headed towards the vault. on the 2nd level i followed the bots to the rotunda where i arrowed down to get the last of the loot, then came back up and headed down the ramp to get the last vase, turn off the door camera, enter the vault and grabbed the recording. I had one camera turn yellow and pause on my way out of the vault. After I retrieved the recording I re-enabled all the lights and watchers I had turned off before returning the red key to the office and exiting via the lock-blocked side door.


this run is the fourth attempt at trying to ironman ghost. this is the farthest i have ever gotten before the bust. I usually get busted within 30 minutes.

[lordhern]

He is right. Perfect Thief=Ghost+Max Loot. If you fail all ghost modes, then perfect thief is also failed.

it's a good thing this site allows for delayed edits.

[klatremus]

No worries, lordhern. Remember, there is no shame in busting ghost. Sometimes the mission is designed in such a way that ghosting is near impossible.

1 hr into the bank before busting ghost is VERY good. It makes me want to try it myself.

[lordhern]

Thief 2 - OM Blackmail [NewDark]

IRONMAN
ghost questionable.
perfect thief FAIL - see below
supreme ghost FAIL
perfect supreme FAIL

Total time 1 hr 37 minutes.
2100 / 2100 loot
pockets picked 8/23
locks picked 9
all damage stats 0
secrets found 6/6

no 2nd level alerts. loot prioritized.

consumable used - three water arrows (two to hit switches), one to clean Benny's mess.

details - I grabbed all 365 loot from the houses out front - skipped all the picks as i don't need broadheads. took the side path, visited the grave for the quip from Garret then dove into the well for the two lucky coins. Once i had 405 loot i picked the balcony key from the guard then went to the far SE corner near the side path a flung a rope arrow into the top of the wall - climbed up there and creep-crouched my way to the balcony and jump-mantled directly to floor 2 bypassing floor 1 for the time.

I used the balcony key to open balcony doors, mantled up on the open door then mantled onto the angled roof and mantled up the third floor directly. the balcony key opened the north bedroom. I looted the third floor and took the roof-passage to the other side - grabbed the evidence and the body, dragged it back across the roof-passage to the other side and put his body outside the balcony door.

Went inside the 2nd floor via the balcony, I looted it completely even cleaned up Benny's mess (first supreme bust) to get the secret and loot and after his conversation he turned around so I WAS able to get the fine wine from the bar AND his purse with no first alert. I only occasionally see him turn around after his blustering I AM FEARLESS monologue so i'm not sure if it's scripted to be random or not.

I still fetched his silver key from the pool as i wanted the last purse later. I was able to clear the rest of the 2nd floor w/o alerts of any kind, returned to the balcony, flung a rope arrow into the side wall, and dropped down when the patrolling guard was on his way to the well.

I was able to dodge all the 1st floor patrols while looting and got both the key and gear pick. it's here where I took the rest of my supreme busts.

The first is waking up the sleeping man to get the chest contents w/o slashing the banner, the second is activating the fireplace "trap" for the secret, third is the guard that wakes up and starts patrolling on the loot chest pick and lastly the entrances and exits to the catacomb. couldn't close the exits.

from the fireplace-basement secret room I used a water arrow to open the gate and get the diamond, Then I opened the secret exit, lifted the purse from basement guard then went out front under the porch where i dodged patrols to enter the chapel where I used the 3rd water arrow to open the secret access to grab the golden skull from the catacomb.

I went back outside, rope arrowed up the wall and down the ladder on other side. I rope-arrowed up at the far north end of the back wall went down and back to the well entrance area for the the back balcony to set the scripted actions in motion and grab the last of the loot and picks.

After the 2nd floor guards split up I grabbed a gear pick from the guard looking for the tasty morsels then I then made my way back to the 3rd floor south bedroom and used a gear to open the south bedroom 2nd floor closet exit - I listened at that door for the patrols before using the gear then exited and followed a guard around collecting the loot from the front round room, then back up to the third floor before I dropped to the 2nd floor balcony used the silver key to open the door to the 3rd floor which to activate the "sound the alarm" events.

I picked the gear from the guard that runs down the stairs and i was able to creep-crouch up the steps and pick the purse before heading down and out to the balcony, where I mantled back up to the third floor balcony to fetch Truarts body.

I completed the bonus objective by burying Truarts body in the open grave.

[lordhern]

Thief 2 - Courier [New Dark]

EDIT for first playthrough - see delta.

ironman

normal Ghost - originally reported as success UNSURE - end of mission save file shows seen = 1 (yes you can find the number of times you have been detected in the raw data)

I had far too many 1st level alerts for perfect thief etc. "Hello??" "Who's There!" etc.

time of ironman successful run 47 minutes 12 seconds
loot 850/850 loot
secrets 1/1
zero damage yada yada.
zero consumables


I failed FIFTEEN TIMES in a row before my sixteenth run worked
It's far too easy to get level 2 busted by a wandering patrol, or spotted by the pagan, or letting the pagan get too far ahead I never have problems with Mosley.

One method I have tried is get in front of the pagan - He will level one alert a bunch of times but I find I can get much farther ahead in most areas w/o failing the mission compared to falling behind. I might try that again some day if i'm feeling masochistic.

Near the cemetery entrance there is a building with a balcony where the arborist shoots the pagan. if you can frob that door from closing when the first mechanist comes out it can be kept open. it makes it easier via the 2nd floor cemetery window to get into the locked part of the graveyard that is horrible to try and get into from the ground.

if you cannot get to the that door in time there are enough bottles around the drunk guard to bring into the graveyard where you can build a small stack to get over the wall.

On a side note in this level only the grey zombie can be enticed to come out to play as the fresher zombies won't follow you out of their crypts. The rotten one can eviscerate the arbolists and normal guards - only the mace wielding mechanist can destroy it.

Not much else to report other than "I hate both this mission and the next one." I won't bother ironman running trail of blood as the linearity is horrid and I have never been able to get through some areas without dousing torches


NEW RUN THROUGH DETAILS.

in my user.cfg file added the following lines.
cheats_active
FailOnSee

replayed the mission - six restarts due to mission failed - seventh playthrough results:

Iron
Ghost normal mode - CONFIRMED SUCCESS using mod above
Perfect Thief - SUCCESS
Perfect Supreme - FAIL - i grabbed everything that wasn't nailed down including stuff i don't need.

total time 54 min 8 seconds
loot 850/850
secrets 1/1
got all the pick pockets
all damage stats zero,
no consumables used

Note: I did *not* manage to stay ahead of the pagan on four of the six restarts (two failed before even getting to the pagan).

[Galaer]

I had far too many 1st level alerts for perfect thief etc. "Hello??" "Who's There!" etc.

You are incorrect. If it's only 1st alerts and I see you got all the loot, then you actually succeed perfect thief. You just failed supreme ghost and perfect supreme.

As for Trail of Blood - in regular ghost you are allowed dousing torches.

[lordhern]

You are incorrect. If it's only 1st alerts and I see you got all the loot, then you actually succeed perfect thief. You just failed supreme ghost and perfect supreme.

As for Trail of Blood - in regular ghost you are allowed dousing torches.

I am uncomfortable as I looked at the bytecode of my start of mission save for the next one I did see my "seen" count for the campaign set at one.

so have gone ahead re-playing trace the courier with cheats_active and FailOnSee set to confirm nothing more than 1st alert and I edited my post above to match my discovery.

[Galaer]

I watched your Thief 2 Demo report on Youtube, klatremus. And I must say that I disagree with your interpretation of grabbing plans through painting in Karras Office. You said it's not a supreme bust, because you can imagine that Garrett slips his hand behind painting. But you can clearly hear sound of something being locked after frobbing the painting. And painting only moves after pressing the switch, so there is mechanism behind it. Which means painting is actually camuflated safe door. Which means there is really no space for Garrett slips his hand into. Because safe doors have this ability of hermetically close space between wall and safe door. That's why I believe your action was exploit and also a supreme bust.

[klatremus]

Yes, that situation is debatable for sure. Taking items through banners have always been allowed for Supreme (unless Garrett physically pushes through them, as in transmigration), but not through doors or walls. Paintings are somewhere in between i guess. Is it only when you see a gap, like when i took the loot in chest beyind banner at Shemenov's, or is it dependent on the solidity of the surface? Engine exploits are vague, both in the rules and during execution. I understand your argument. It might be worthy of a discussion in THIS thread.

[Galaer]

Hey there. Not a report, but a discovery. It's about Sabotage at Soulforge. I found out that first watcher from the very beginning of the mission is ghostable. I know that alert from it is excused by community, but I found a way to avoid even first alert from it. Well, it's not without sacrifices. The idea is to buy invisibility potion and immediately after starting the mission use it. You really want to bind invisibility potion to single button. Timing is tricky and I found that mashing buttons didn't work for me. You need the proper timing. But it's really not that hard. Every time it take me just few tries. The sacrifice is that you can only achieve chemical ghost success that way. In current times it's probably just a fun fact rather than useful trick.

[klatremus]

This is awesome work Galaer! I was not aware that the community as a whole has excused this. If so, I certainly don't agree with it, as it clearly busts ghost. My report certainly claimed this to be a failed ghost. Perhaps people think it's a scripted response from the watcher, as it's a part of the story where Karras starts talking to you. But if you were able to avoid the alert, then it proves it's not a script. Chemical success is certainly a lot better than failure!

[Galaer]

I heard about that from travis whitsitt supreme ghost video first. But if you read existing Soulforge reports, you will notice nobody mention this first watcher as a reason of ghost failure. It meant to not be a ghost bust probably because of cinematic before that, which shows Garrett being seen by a watcher. So by avoiding this watcher I created some kind of paradox.

After finding this trick I read your own report, klatremus. And I noticed that you mention trying to use invisibility potion, but you failed. I don't know if it matters what version you play, but to be clear I played final version of Tafferpatcher.