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Thread: ☣ Coronavirus ☣

  1. #1351
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: Netherlands

    Coronavirus

    I’m probably going to watch the 6-part HBO series The Plot Against America. Maybe also Netflix’s The End of the F**ing World, the episodes of that are only 20 minutes, it’s snack-sized entertainment for when you have a little time to spare. The creators recently made I Am Not Okay With This (also with short episodes) starring the girl from It and I had a good time with that.

    I’m also reading some books, right now Nemesis by Isaac Asimov. That guy can write for sure!
    Last edited by Harvester; 2nd Apr 2020 at 16:57.

  2. #1352
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: Land of the crazy
    Quote Originally Posted by heywood View Post
    One thing we have going for us, militarily, is our huge Navy and Marine Corps. They normally operate in inherent isolation...
    I guess was wrong about Navy readiness being relatively insulated from disease outbreaks:
    https://www.npr.org/2020/04/01/82564...odore-roosevel
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/militar...id-19-n1175351
    https://www.npr.org/sections/coronav...rusliveupdates

  3. #1353
    Quote Originally Posted by SubJeff View Post
    Why am I not surprised.


    You don't say!


    What scale are you using?


    Oh boy.


    mmmhmmmm


    You know what Chinese medicine with real evidence behind it is called, right? I'll tell you. It's medicine.



    Welp. Let's wrap it up boys. Vitamin C and Elderberry. That's it. This man has saved humanity.
    Funny how You're mysteriously immune from Renzatic's threat to ban people who keep throwing around the insults.

    It's not me saying it. Go read the medical journals yourself.

    I even gave you link to papers outlining the specific benefit and you couldn't be assed to read them, and instead prefer to attack this bizarre strawman you've set up. Whatever lets you pat yourself on the back for being super smart I guess though.


    If you insist on denying settled science that's your prerogative and you're the one who will bear the greater risk of dying as a result of your own willful ignorance. You really SHOULD read the medical journals yourself (but you won't, because it requires more work than snark and narcissism) because you're one of those boomers who is likely to be killed off by this thing if you get it.

  4. #1354
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    Quote Originally Posted by heywood View Post
    I guess was wrong about Navy readiness being relatively insulated from disease outbreaks
    This thing is on another level of contagiousness thanks to the subclinical symptoms.

  5. #1355
    To clarify,

    Nobody is claiming Vitamin C and Elderberry are cures. That's one of your weird-ass projections.

    What they do accomplish (See the peer reviewed studies from Chinese doctors) is that they reduce the symptoms. That's extremely important because it can mean you stay on the right side of the line between recovering at home and needing to make a hospital visit that kills you.

  6. #1356
    Still Subjective
    Registered: Dec 1999
    Location: Idiocy will never die
    Tony, I have you on ignore. I made the mistake of opening one of your messages to see what you're coming out with these days. No surprises. Anyway, that's how we get into this. But I don't see any paper you've linked to and the only link in your posts is concerning Elderberries, and that link doesn't work.

    The difference between you and I is I know how to read a medical journal. I also know that information in journals doesn't usually constitute an expert recommendation. You get those by other means. Its great that so many journals are free to read, but there's the slight danger that people take things the wrong way.

    Oh, and I'm a Generation Xer. You?
    Last edited by SubJeff; 2nd Apr 2020 at 18:14.

  7. #1357
    Still Subjective
    Registered: Dec 1999
    Location: Idiocy will never die
    Aaaanyway.

    Week 3 of isolation.

    We have daily chats, at least 2, with family in Other Places, via video call of some sort. I use WhatsApp but my wife uses that and Skype. It's odd, but it works.

    I've managed to order some more household essentials for delivery via Ocado, which is amazing. I got priority access because I'm a regular user I guess. No eggs though. Amazing and disappointing.

    The rest of the lockdown seems to be okay. One of our neighbours is too friendly for lockdown and I'm wary that he'll come too close if we meet outside so I've been actively avoiding him. Shame, he's a nice guy usually but lockdown is lockdown and social distancing is the Law right now.

    Numbers still increasing in the UK but I'm hoping we can ride this out. Provided things stay the same as they are now, I think we'll be fine. I'm still hoping to plant a load of vegetables this weekend if I can get some resources for it. If it works out it might be my new thing.

    Weather is getting better and it's almost cycle season for me. Except asshats seem to be using my usual track for walking in non-socially distancing groups and if there's one thing worse than getting Covid-19, it's getting it of an idiot.

  8. #1358
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    Maybe Tony can't realize that ICU reanimation practice too is NOT a "cure" but a life support strategy to enable your own body to recover from the unforeseen consequences (Hello Gordon!) of an excessive inflammation state of the lungs in response to the infection/pathogen.

  9. #1359
    Here's a US media article titled "New York Hospitals treating corona patients with Vitamin C" https://nypost.com/2020/03/24/new-yo...ith-vitamin-c/

    On Elderberry here's one sample article demonstrating some antiviral capabilities. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4848651/

    Disclaimer is that it doesn't seem to be too clear yet on how the stuff interacts with COVID 19 specifically, (different docs saying different things with Eastern/Chinese more likely to say yes and American more likely to say no) but it does have an anti-viral effect that's well established and there is literature available if you're looking at how it interacts with SARS.


    Is that good enough for you?

    Note that I didn't say that I was "genius" and knew the right thing to do. It was kind of accidental and I wouldn't have thought twice about it if this thing hadn't blown up later.
    ***

    Maybe Tony can't realize that ICU reanimation practice too is NOT a "cure" but a life support strategy to enable your own body to recover from the unforeseen consequences (Hello Gordon!) of an excessive inflammation state of the lungs in response to the infection/pathogen.
    Iowenz right now:



    You're tilting at imaginary strawman windmills. It seems weird to me but more power to you I guess.


    *****

    Anyways our WONDERFUL New Jersey Governor last week ordered private businesses to disclose how many items of PPE they had on hand. He promised that this was just to gauge readiness and that this information wouldn't be used for confiscation.

    Today: "We're sending the police to confiscate your PPE".



    https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2020/04...ical-supplies/


    So yeah. Make that ANOTHER instance of "amazing leaders" lying their asses off brazenly. Kind of like how the CDC insisted for weeks that Masks were useless.
    Last edited by Tony_Tarantula; 2nd Apr 2020 at 19:55.

  10. #1360
    Adding a quote for the benefit of those who refuse to click on
    Seriously sick coronavirus patients in New York state’s largest hospital system are being given massive doses of vitamin C — based on promising reports that it’s helped people in hard-hit China, The Post has learned.

    Dr. Andrew G. Weber, a pulmonologist and critical-care specialist affiliated with two Northwell Health facilities on Long Island, said his intensive-care patients with the coronavirus immediately receive 1,500 milligrams of intravenous vitamin C.

    Identical amounts of the powerful antioxidant are then readministered three or four times a day, he said.

    Each dose is more than 16 times the National Institutes of Health’s daily recommended dietary allowance of vitamin C, which is just 90 milligrams for adult men and 75 milligrams for adult women.

    The regimen is based on experimental treatments administered to people with the coronavirus in Shanghai, China, Weber said.

    Enlarge ImageDr. Andrew G. Weber
    Dr. Andrew G. WeberLinkedIn
    “The patients who received vitamin C did significantly better than those who did not get vitamin C,” he said.

    “It helps a tremendous amount, but it is not highlighted because it’s not a sexy drug.”

    A spokesman for Northwell — which operates 23 hospitals, including Lenox Hill Hospital on Manhattan’s Upper East Side — said vitamin C was being “widely used” as a coronavirus treatment throughout the system, but noted that medication protocols varied from patient to patient.

    “As the clinician decides,” spokesman Jason Molinet said.

    About 700 patients are being treated for coronavirus across the hospital network, Molinet said, but it’s unclear how many are getting the vitamin C treatment.

    SEE ALSO

    Hero of the Day: Young doctor spreads hope in city’s darkest hour
    The vitamin C is administered in addition to such medicines as the anti-malaria drug hydroxychloroquine, the antibiotic azithromycin, various biologics and blood thinners, Weber said.

  11. #1361
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Tarantula View Post
    Iowenz right now:



    You're tilting at imaginary strawman windmills. It seems weird to me but more power to you I guess.
    It' "L"owenz, not "I"owenz :/

    Are you very smart, aren't you?

  12. #1362
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Tarantula View Post
    Adding a quote for the benefit of those who refuse to click on
    It's not that we all refused, Tony (well, I kinda dismissed it, I'll admit), it's that you didn't provide a working link.

    People have been bringing up the wonders of Vitamin C for years now, claiming it's the cure-all immunobooster that'll save humanity. These days, I usually just let any claims of such slide off me if someone mentions it in any context beyond adding it to orange juice to maybe make your bones stronger.
    Last edited by Renzatic; 2nd Apr 2020 at 20:44.

  13. #1363
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    Quote Originally Posted by lowenz View Post
    It' "L"owenz, not "I"owenz :/

    Are you very smart, aren't you?
    Hey, let's not be directly insulting now, huh?

  14. #1364
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Melbourne, Australia
    Quote Originally Posted by SubJeff View Post
    What are people watching in the Covid-19 era?
    You've not been reading the "What are you watching" thread?

  15. #1365
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    NYT made a US map of stupidity and while it seems there are numpties everywhere, not all states are equal:

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...istancing.html

  16. #1366
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Case in point:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...breakers-sick/

    As stores and offices closed throughout March, many people watched with anger as thousands of college students poured into tropical locales, crowding beaches and bars to party during their regularly scheduled spring breaks.

    Now, as the pandemic has spread further, many people’s fears have been realized as college students by the dozen have tested positive for covid-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus.

    About 70 students from the University of Texas at Austin, all in their 20s, chartered a plane to Cabo San Lucas, Mexico, in late March. They took the trip despite public health advice to avoid crowding as well as nonessential air travel.

    On Tuesday, Austin public health officials announced 28 students, more than a third of the young people who took the trip, had returned and tested positive for the coronavirus. Many of the remaining students are under public health monitoring, according to officials.

    [...]

    Despite early reports the coronavirus would largely spare the young, dozens of spring breakers have returned to their college towns in places like Texas, Florida and Wisconsin and tested positive for it.

    At least five students from the University of Tampa who went on spring-break trips together tested positive for the coronavirus last month after Florida officials faced intense scrutiny over their decision to keep beaches and bars open while spring breakers poured into the state.

    At the University of Wisconsin at Madison, multiple students tested positive after developing symptoms since returning from a spring-break romp in Nashville and Gulf Shores, Ala., WKRG reported.


    [...]

    Although most of the serious cases of covid-19 occur in older people and those with underlying health conditions, young and otherwise healthy adults have also been hospitalized with the coronavirus.

    In Travis County, Tex., home of UT-Austin, nearly half of the coronavirus-related hospitalizations involved people between the ages of 20 and 40, public health officials said.

    Young people have accounted for a significant number of coronavirus hospitalizations nationwide. While deaths are concentrated among older adults, some counties have reported fatalities among young people and even children.

    The 28 Texas students who have tested positive are self-isolating, and others who went on the trip are being monitored for symptoms by public health officials. Four of the coronavirus-infected patients did not show any symptoms, Austin public health officials said.

    “The virus often hides in the healthy and is given to those who are at grave risk of being hospitalized or dying,” Austin-Travis County Interim Health Authority Director Mark Escott said in a statement. “While younger people have less risk for complications, they are not immune from severe illness and death from covid-19.”

    Even more concerning for many officials is the risk to older Americans posed by infected young people, who may not show severe symptoms.

    “They’re coming back and they may not have the illness themselves, but they could spread it to their grandmother, grandfather, they could spread it to their favorite aunt,” Bonnen said. “And that is the danger of covid-19. While many of us can act responsibly, while many of us can stay at home, while many of us can socially distance, all it takes is 70 college kids to act irresponsibly. It’s time to grow up.”

  17. #1367
    Chakat sex pillow
    Registered: Sep 2006
    Location: not here
    Quote Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post
    It's not that we all refused, Tony (well, I kinda dismissed it, I'll admit), it's that you didn't provide a working link.
    I'm pretty sure most of us refused it on the basis that it's from someone whose internet handle abbreviates to T_T. There's no real reason to pay attention to him or his septic pipage of links when there's dozens of articles saying 'pinch of salt', but there is reason to hope the diarrhoea that a vitamin C overdose would give him keeps his shit in the pot instead of all over the forum.

  18. #1368
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Yeah, anyone who reads Tony's posts these days does it out of morbid curiosity. If I didn't know better, I'd think they are some form of parody.

    Anyway, Russia is still measuring 3.6 röntgen for the outbreak:

    https://apnews.com/dbbf02a747b11d8ffe3b07d5e33ff129

    MOSCOW (AP) — Two weeks ago, an opposition-leaning radio station in Russia interviewed political analyst Valery Solovei, who alleged the government was lying when it said no one had died in the country from the coronavirus.

    Solovei told radio station Echo Moskvy at least 1,600 people might have died since mid-January. Russia’s media and internet watchdog, Roscomnadzor, quickly pressured the station to delete the interview from its website.

    The demand was part of a widespread government campaign against what authorities called “fake news” about the pandemic.

    On Tuesday, Russian lawmakers began putting some teeth behind the campaign, approving fines of up to $25,000 and prison terms of up to five years for anyone who spreads what is deemed to be false information. Media outlets will be fined up to $127,000 if they disseminate disinformation about the outbreak.

    Lawmakers rushed the bill through all three readings in just one day after President Vladimir Putin spoke about the need to counter “provocations, stupid gossip and malicious lies” about the outbreak.
    [...]

  19. #1369
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    What do you expect from Putin? Putin is putining. Not-So-Soft Power exemplar show case.
    A true (ce)zar, a non-violent non-paranoid Stalin.
    A great machiavellian politician nonetheless.
    A human being with an enormous pressure on his shoulders.
    And not a communist by all means (but this is NOT a compliment), he's very religious man.....an educated version of Erdogan from this perspective.

    Still all my thanks to russian army helping us here.
    (Bogdanov's dream one day will come true, comrades!)
    Last edited by lowenz; 3rd Apr 2020 at 05:58.

  20. #1370
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Berghem Haven
    SubJeff, here's some good reading

    https://www.nursetimes.org/covid-19-...ami-autoptici/ (Autopsy reports)

    Please translate
    Last edited by lowenz; 3rd Apr 2020 at 07:40.

  21. #1371
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: Land of the crazy
    Quote Originally Posted by Starker View Post
    NYT made a US map of stupidity and while it seems there are numpties everywhere, not all states are equal:

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...istancing.html
    I think you would need to control for agriculture before you could draw any conclusions from that map. In counties where the economy is primarily agricultural, most people are still working, and may travel a fair distance throughout the course of their day, even if it's just moving around a single large farm. Ranching probably involves even more travel.

    I suspect agriculture explains most of the orange and red you see in the Midwest and West. I don't think it explains the Southeast though - that's probably just denial.

  22. #1372
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2005
    Location: Not Kansas
    Meanwhile, Jared just told us all that 'our' Strategic National Stockpile isn't really 'ours'.

    '"It's not supposed to be states' stockpiles that they then use."'
    (Jared Kushner, April 2, 2020)

    However: 'The Strategic National Stockpile describes itself as having "the nation's largest supply of life-saving pharmaceuticals and medical supplies for use in a public health emergency severe enough to cause local supplies to run out. When state, local, tribal, and territorial responders request federal assistance to support their response efforts, the stockpile ensures that the right medicines and supplies get to those who need them most during an emergency."'

    Wait ... is it a coincidence that our government just sold China bigly PPE supplies? Announcement of New Investigation at 8 tonight?

    Frankly, I wouldn't put anything past anyone in this current administration. *smh*

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/jared-kus...060500191.html

  23. #1373
    Still Subjective
    Registered: Dec 1999
    Location: Idiocy will never die
    Quote Originally Posted by lowenz View Post
    SubJeff, here's some good reading

    Please translate
    I did translate and it makes for some scary reading. Not good reading at all!

  24. #1374
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2006
    Location: Washington DC
    Despite early reports the coronavirus would largely spare the young, dozens of spring breakers have returned to their college towns in places like Texas, Florida and Wisconsin and tested positive for it.
    Oh for fuck's sake, did people read that the virus doesn't usually kill young people and conclude that they wouldn't contract or carry it?

  25. #1375
    Moderator and Priest
    Registered: Mar 2002
    Location: Dinosaur Ladies of the Night
    I doubt they even thought that far.

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