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Thread: FMs - Ghost/Perfect Thief Results (Part 9) [SPOILERS]

  1. #501
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    OFF TO MILHORN MANOR - OVERHAUL EDITION

    CHANGES


    This mission is now possible to ghost, so I decided to play it. Many tricky situations are gone, but there is still some challenge. This time there is no shenanigans with green spider at the beginning of mission and you can drop into well without any problem as spiders will not hear you. There is easy path to rooftops via ladder. Also tricky purse on archer doesn't exist anymore. On top of Alchemist Shop is wooden beam and thanks to that you don't need to very carefully crouch walk through this roof. Also Alchemist Shop can't be entered, so there is no need to return to this roof later in the mission and destroy grate in chimney, which was one of ghost busts.

    In Sewers red spider doesn't have random patrol route anymore. In 2nd station I noticed that 1st lever can be reached without using rope arrow. You can lean towards it from very edge of platform and then strafe jump to ladder.

    Ground Floor still has a lot of enemies. In kitchen's storage there is no big crate and chest behind it. There are only 3 bags of spices behind normal crates. Basement also has lots of enemies, though I think there is less of them. Major difference in Guards Lodging is you can crouch and go through banner to obtain Sewer door. Also there is no spiders in basement. SW sewer room leads outside, so you can obtain pick from gardener's hut that way. This is also my exit from mansion. North sewer room leads to alchemy room where is located sulfur. In inner garden is grave, but unlike in original version, you don't need to move slowly. I wonder if guard's range of seeing has been lowered. Upper Floor has only 1 patroller an 1 stationary guard near poll, so it's twice easy to ghost it. And the same like before, in chapel you can grab 2 pieces of loot through banner.

    In Cave stationary burrick is turning, so there is no need to use invisibility potion. Next room is patrolled by 1 burrick, so it's not a problem. Originally exit tunnel was watched and I was forced to use 4 rope arrows to ghost this cave. There is the same amount of fire elementals in ruins, but stationary elemental has been moved closer to entrance to this area and he's looking towards entrance, which has good shadow. So this area is much easier to ghost too. Big boulder doesn't break into small boulders anymore, it just vanish after using pick. Spider tunnel is empty and wider than before. Light mushrooms can't be frobbed to douse, but it's easy to get to burrick cave without being seen by them. Here are just 2 patrolling burricks and a lot of shadow on left side, so it's again easy. There is low plank leading to vault and it's frobbable. You can move it to side and then frob again to make it return to original spot, so last 2 ghost busts also don't exist.

    I collected 3 special loot, no idea how many there is in mission, but you need to get at least 1 of them for loot requirement. Also I completed bonus objective by finding mysterious note, which also trigger secret.

    FINAL NOTE

    When overhaul edition came out and it was stated that ghost is now possible, I was worried that mission will become too easy. And I was partially correct. Cheap ghost busts has been removed and I appreciate that and there is still a lot of patrollers i basement and ground floor. But a lot of tricky areas has been made much easier - mostly in cave where number of monsters has been lowered or they look in different direction. Also wooden beam on Alchemist Shop was unnecessary. Without it it was interesting challenge. I really wish that FM creators wouldn't care about ghosting community too much, because despite ghost busts, I had more fun ghosting original version of this mission, because it was more challenging.

    STATS:

    Time: 1:20:15; Loot: 6398/6718; Special Loot: 3
    Pockets Picked: 6/6; Locks Picked: 16
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 1/1

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: POSSIBLE

  2. #502
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Thank you for your new reports, Galaer. I am very happy with the last statement you made in the final report. I completely agree with you. Although it is nice that mission authors care about the ghosting community, when they make missions ghostable, it quite often makes the mission too easy and less fun. The missions I would classify as fun to ghost are those that were made long before ghosting was a common thing, like Ruins of Originia, Calendra's Legacy, etc. It forces the ghoster to think differently and experiment in new ways. Newer campaigns like Death's Cold Embrace, although fun to play, isn't that much more fun to ghost. It seems mission authors think they are helping us by making the mission ghostable, while they are really lowering the quality of the mission, in my opinion. It is difficult to explain to someone who doesn't ghost.

  3. #503
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Lyon, France
    I understand what you're both saying and agree to a degree. I usually make sure my missions are ghostable so those who like to play pacifist and "casual" ghost can have fun doing that, but I don't really care beyond that, e.g. I will not go out of my way to make sure you can Supreme them. Case in point with the second Chalice of Souls mission and The Sound of a Burrick in a Room, both can be Supreme'd I believe but I just made sure they could be ghosted (and in the case of the latter mission, I didn't take property damage into account in the slightest).

  4. #504
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    Location: France
    I feel like there's an important distinction to be made between a mission that's ghostable and ghost-friendly. I myself don't find missions from the latter category all that fun due to a lack of challenge, but I also don't think missions that disregard ghosting entirely are super fun either. My favorite example is Thieves Guild. It's ghostable. You can complete it without being detected once. It's by no means ghost-friendly though, and that's what makes it so damn fun. There are so many little, unique challenges in it, like stealing the loot from right under the gamblers' noses or getting Thom's key. On the other hand, putting a guard in your way with no other way to get past him (and I mean literally no other alternate path to take) other than get spotted or knock him out is not a fun challenge for ghosting, and not even fun design in general.

    I also have lower tolerance for bullshit enemy placement than I do for other kinds of busts. I will gladly accept the need to slash a banner if there is no other way to progress, but I won't try and ghost a mission that actively pushes you towards confrontation. In fact, I don't think I'd enjoy playing such a mission casually either.
    Last edited by marbleman; 26th Dec 2021 at 20:38.

  5. #505
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    I guess I shouldn't have said just mission that are "ghostable" per se, but those that are made with the ghost (or even Supreme) mode in mind, or overly so. Just the fact that a mission can be ghosted of course doesnt make it bad, but if the author is deliberately thinking about the rules, often very few challenges present themselves. Skacky's missions have almost a perfect balance, I'd say, but even they tend to lean towards the less challenging side (Beyond the Secluded Passage being a very good exception). But the outright quality of design and gameplay also counteract any lack in ghost challenges for his missions. Nothing wrong about giving the player options, but a combination of non-linearity and challenge is often what helps make a mission stand the test of time.

    Please don't take what I said above as an absolute, but rather an average impression I've got for those missions where I know the author has considered the ghost modes.
    Last edited by klatremus; 26th Dec 2021 at 21:50.

  6. #506
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by marbleman View Post
    On the other hand, putting a guard in your way with no other way to get past him (and I mean literally no other alternate path to take) other than get spotted or knock him out is not a fun challenge for ghosting, and not even fun design in general.
    I understand your point, but this kind of enemy placement isn't always impossible to ghost. For example in Lost City you have small spiders blocking passage. So I guess ghosting it is impossible, right? Wrong, someone found out that it's possible to nudge spiders with a crate. I'm guessing that finding out about that brought him a lot of satisfaction. Another example is from Strife Campaign. In one of missions there is central island and bridge leading to it is well lighten. On the side are 2 bots and the intended way is to run on bridge and avoid cannonballs. But for ghost mode you can jump to ledge with bot, nudge him a bit and do very tough jump to wooden beam and then to central island. This area wasn't supposed to be ghosted, but miraculously it was.

    Ghosting is about beating the odds. There are situations where in order to ghost mission you must play it in unintended by author way and satisfaction from ghosting these impossible situation is huge.

    You mentioned lack of alternate path, but it's not always true. Sometimes it's just you who don't notice alternate path. Sometimes using new mantle to find unintended high route is enough to ghost mission. Sometimes you must be more creative. Example: In Ruins of Originia Mission 2 there is alternate path to Bathar's Lab, but it gets blocked by avalanche of giant boulders. This path was deemed to be impossible. But guess what, it's actually possible to block avalanche and use this path and avoid confrontation with Bantar.

    Other example is Patriot Mission 7. In there you must get in and out of west wing. Intended way in is by destroying barrels in wine cellar, but that's damage property. You can also use slow fall potion to get there and author predicted that. He put another fire arrow in west wing, so it's possible to destroy barrels from the other side. Since there is a way to climb up to window, to prevent players to use this path, after certain even in west wing this window gets barred. But figuring out how to block it from happening required some thinking and eventually it was possible. I was really happy.

    Just because certain challenge looks impossible, it doesn't always mean that it's really impossible. For a very long time ghosters thought that ghosting Running Interference without KO-ing anyone is impossible. It just required me to try this challenge to find out that it's much easier than a lot of crazy techniques discovered in the past. Other example of trying something that looks impossible would be ghosting control room in Patriot Mission 10. There is only one way in - from vent. Below is combat bot looking in your direction and room is well lighten and patrolled by engineer. Since this run was going so well I had thought that I should do ghost run immediately instead of doing test run first. So I didn't brought with me mines to deal with bot. Anyway I would drop or jump out of vent I would be caught and killed by bot and I didn't want to restart this mission. So I did hundreds of jumps and failed miserably. Then I tried to moss vent and drink speed potion to do strafe jump. It took me another 100 of tries to finally succeed. I was really satisfied and at the same time relieved that it worked.

    The conclusion of this long post of mine is that successfully ghosting these bullshit unfair situations gives me the most of fun. This way I discovered a lot of techniques I had no idea about. Like I learned that in certain situation you can drop into water without making splash by just cancelling mantle right above water. Unfortunately FM creators most of the time don't understand what makes their missions interesting to ghost and makes missions too easy to ghost. This ends with me writing super short reports that only say that mission is "pretty easy to ghost". And I have nothing else to say. I hate writing these kind of reports. Like for example report to your mission - Cracks in the Glass. I only write that it's pretty easy to ghost it. I had really nothing to add as I didn't notice any challenge and I felt sorry that i only write these couple of words on the mission you put so much effort. At least in missions with cheap ghost busts, I can mention them in my reports.

  7. #507
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    Location: France
    Different strokes for different folks. Although you enjoy these situations, not everyone else does. The spiders at the beginning of the Lost City, I will still say, are an example of bullshit enemy placement even if they are technically possible to ghost. I don't get any fun or a sense of accomplishment from spending 30 minutes pushing them with a box, so I usually just use a couple gas arrows in my "casual" ghost runs. Anything that neccessitates engine exploits or tedious workarounds just isn't fun to me.

    This is not to say I don't enjoy figuring out situations that are difficult to ghost at all. In the original version of Catacombs of Knoss, I was pretty proud of limiting the busts in the water shrine to just two second alerts instead of actually being chased by those flying swords. That said, I think the remaster is a better mission because it provides an alternative.

    Does this make me a "lesser" ghoster? Maybe. But then again, I don't really care. And I am well aware that Cracks in the Glass is too easy. I'll be the first to admit that t's one of these, as I would say, ghost-friendly missions. If I made it today, it'd be a bit more challenging.
    Last edited by marbleman; 27th Dec 2021 at 15:46.

  8. #508
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    DEFAMATION OF CHARACTER

    Mostly easy mission. The only problem may be in basement as it's patrolled by 2 bots and there are watcher and also blue gem lights from Lost City. When bots are going through corridors and activate blue gems on ceiling, don't try to sneak past watchers. Wait until blue gems will go dark. On 2nd floor there are watchers, spider bots and marble floor, but there is also a lot of shadow, so it's not that hard to ghost it.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:40:00; Loot: 3410/3450
    Pockets Picked: 3/8; Locks Picked: 14
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 2/3

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: POSSIBLE

  9. #509
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    DECEPTIVE PERCEPTION 2: PHANTASMAGORIA

    I had a lot of problems with making this mission to work correctly. Luckily fortuni send me updated by Glypher version of this mission, so I managed to do a run.

    After conversation in bar you fall on crate and destroy it. Since you have no control of Garrett just yet, I don't count that as ghost bust. Unfortunately opening 1st portcullis breaks switch controlling it - there are sparks and switch becomes unfrobbable (ghost bust #1). Next is scarecrow. When you approach other side of portcullis scarecrow will go after you. He can track you for couple of seconds, then turns around and start searching. During search quickly go to locked door and frob it. After couple of seconds scarecrow will track you again and start searching after couple of seconds. Since you frobbed door, soon after he will disappear.

    After conversation with woman in storage room you can easily sneak past 2 turning haunts. But then angry ghost woman materialize in front of last door. It's impossible to sneak past her (ghost bust #2). I can run through her, but her skull shots will alert haunts and spiders in next room. So I'm running to angled wall to spawn her and then I run away to earlier storage (without haunts). Ghost will go after me. When she will start walking back to door, strafe run to her along right wall and go through her when she's turning around. In next room just quietly drop down to avoid alerting spiders.

    After finding corpse of guard you get objective to kill doppelganger, which you do. Next rooms has a lot of things breaking on it's own. Just run past them. You are forced to use smasher to destroy sealed box (ghost bust #3) and get key to sewers. Then use slow fall potion to drop down. Go to bridge. It will get broken 3 times. I jump into air while it's happening, so it will not count as damage property done by me. Get key and go to temple.

    In shadow world you must ghost walking women and spiders, but it's easy. It will just take some time as women move slowly. After activating portal you must break mirror (excused by objective) and return to normal world. Here are fights between Keepers and women. Giant woman from portal room will get summoned and she's impossible to be killed, so Keepers will ultimately die. When giant woman will appear on stairs to fight Keepers you must mantle on metal railing, quietly drop on lamp below and on ground. It's possible to do it without being noticed by enemies. Go to portal.

    Avoid eggs and in room with monster on the right, go along left wall to ladder. Then drop on edge of metal bridge. You must attack wall with sword to make bricks frobbable. I believe that it count as damage property (ghost bust #4). After getting caught by evil doctor you must escape from freezer. You do that by throwing crates into icicles. Don't destroy crates by mistake. Last challenge is in ancient temple. When you go through room with 4 statues, they will break and 4 giant women will spot you. Unless you strafe run to shadow under gate. Then giant women will just go into search mode, which I believe is scripted.

    STATS:

    Time: 1:00:25; Loot: 200/460
    Locks Picked: 5
    Damage Dealt: 30; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Kills: 1; Back Stabs: 1
    Number of times you jumped: 6
    Cried like a little girl: 3
    Almost shit your pants: 1

    GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE

  10. #510
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    DIRTY BUSINESS

    Mission based on Cragscleft Prison, but you can only explore mines. Mission is mostly easy to ghost. The only problems are in watcher corridors in temple as some corridor have even 3 watchers close to each other and corridors are well lighten. Rooms near corridors have blue gem lighting like from Lost city. Luckily security rooms are fairly close and they are protected by just one watcher, so it's not that hard to disable them.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:26:05; Loot: 1952/1952
    Pockets Picked: 1/1; Locks Picked: 8
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 0/0

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

  11. #511
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    THE LAST LIGHTHOUSE KEEPER

    Mansion mission. Not too hard as you can frob douse lamps and turn off switches under statues. Still there are places with a lot of Hammerites and there is a lot of going back and forth for quest items. In Jeremy's room you are forced to use crowbar on trapdoor. Since there is no lock I believe crowbar is used just to raise trapdoor without breaking anything. But later crowbar is used to break open door to Sid Maier's room (ghost bust #1). In Shepard's room you are forced to use acid on lock to open safe (ghost bust #2). Also after using cuckoo on clock, bookcase vanish. Since it's a mechanism created by inventor I don't count that as damage property.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:52:06; Loot: 2525/2525
    Pockets Picked: 1/0; Locks Picked: 4
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 3/4

    GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE

  12. #512
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Quote Originally Posted by Galaer View Post
    Number of times you jumped: 6
    Cried like a little girl: 3
    Almost shit your pants: 1

  13. #513
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    Quote Originally Posted by klatremus View Post
    I decided to leave that as this is part of the stats. For me Deceptive Perception 2 is way less scary than previous Deceptive Perception and I didn't even jumped out of fear because of it. There is just way too many jokes that really ruin the atmosphere. The mission that really scared me and I abandoned it very quickly because of that is Better Tomorrow.

  14. #514
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    A Better Tomorrow is on my short list of missions to play, so that'll be ghosted soon.

  15. #515
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2016
    Location: France
    That's a sequel to Greenbay though, so you should probably do that one first.

  16. #516
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Oh I am!

    By the way, I just realized I ghosted 40 different missions in 2021, and I have exactly 40 missions (Thief + TDM) on my short list. Of course, all of those would immediately be interrupted by The Black Parade should it get released.

  17. #517
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth
    Game: Thief 2
    FM: Katharsis

    Ghost - Success
    Perfect Thief - Failed
    Supreme Ghost - Success
    Perfect Supreme - Failed
    Time - 3:17:10
    Loot - 7623/7989
    Pockets Picked - 40/42
    Secrets - 7/8
    Locks Picked - 0
    Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0
    Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0
    Healing taken - 0, Other Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0
    Consumables - None

    See the entire report with screenshots here!
    Loot list here.
    YouTube let's play here!

    Comments:
    Due to several requests to play and record this mission, I decided to give this brand new release a try. I have absolutely no regrets. A stellar creation by Personne, a debutant author, which apparently took him two years to make. A nice changeup from all the stock texture missions we’ve gotten lately, this takes you to a mechanist mining facility in a flooded, misty cave system. If you want a challenge, Katharsis should be right up your alley. However, the story also has a deep, melancholy tone to it, which I think hits harder than its difficulty and high level of detail. Two thumbs up!

    I was to break into Lord Tomas’ mining facility and locate his precursor mask, which he had been gifted by the mechanists. Besides that, 5,000 in loot was my other main goal. I also had an optional objective of no knockouts, which ghosting already required.

    Outside
    Absolutely nothing to report from the first compound ghosting wise. Didn’t pick the lock on the first door, but instead swam to the southern building, since that door was unlocked. Dodged all the guards without issues. Couldn’t fully replace the board that covered the loot in the barracks. It could only be put sideways, so I replaced it as best I could (see image). After getting the key, I left the elevator on the top floor, knowing I had to return later. Got all the way to the water tower without issues. I knew where all the loot was from my practice run; some of it was quite hidden.



    The first problem came when trying to enter the courtyard outside the mining complex. A stationary archer was located just inside the entrance gate (image above). He commented on the doors opening, which was a bust for Supreme, so I needed to find another way around. I could easily climb the surrounding walls from either side. I found a good method from the hidden forest to the north. There were snowy outcroppings in the wall on either side. I could drop from the fenced section down to one of these and plan my final descent. I found a reliable method in the courtyards northwest corner, where I could run off the aforementioned outcropping and land in a mantle on a boulder below (image below). In order to get back up on my return trip, I’d have to use my only starting vine arrow. I was planning on not needing to pick up any more equipment for that mode. If you choose to instead use a vine to climb down, then leave it there for later, I don’t think that would be considered a bust.



    Mining Complex
    The central hub, although exposed, wasn’t difficult at all. It was bright, but enemies were so far away that they never heard anything. I could run and jump on the upper walkway without even a comment from anyone. Cleaned the western end on ground level first. Could take the purses from the patrolling guards from either of the dark tunnels in the southeast and southwest. Used one of the wires to get to the top floor of the central hub. Here I could open the main entrance to the whole facility, the laboratory gate, or the treasure room gate. I didn’t touch any of the control panels. If so, I’d have to come back to reset the switch for Supreme, plus there were other ways into every single of those locations.

    Accessed the laboratory storage room via the top floor vent. Had my first loot skip in this area. A sleeping thief was boarded up in one of the crates (image below). The only way to get in there was by breaking the boards, so I skipped his purse. There was a silent crowbar in the mechanist chapel that would remove the boards without alerts, but it still destroyed the boards and that is disallowed both for Ghost and Supreme.



    Had to take the lift up to the laboratory entrance. It was impossible to reach the ladder any other way. I could fasten a vine to the metal walkway, but that alerted both guards on the top level. Getting the crystal shard on the top walkway was very tough. I had to experiment a lot with vine arrows into the ceiling. There was a convenient pillar that blocked the guards’ view just southwest of the ladder. I could hop onto a vine unseen from here, then furthermore mantle up the top walkway. If I placed the vine so that it hung directly onto the ladder, then when going back down, I could grab the arrow and catch the ladder in the fall (image below). The lamp in here pulsated on and off slowly. If I timed this drop so that the luminosity was at its lowest, I could quickly hide behind the aforementioned pillar without any comments.



    The biggest challenge in the mission so far came when entering the laboratory itself. Two boards blocked the entrance, and as mentioned before, destroying them wasn’t allowed. Although the lab wasn’t strictly speaking necessary, there was over 500 worth of loot in there. I first tried squeezing through by leaning forward. I could get my head through on the west side quite easily, but couldn’t get the rest of my body to follow. Then I tried stacking boxes and get through in the top left corner, but with the same disappointing result. I finally accepted defeat and was going to see if I could clip through the boards with the block-crouch-lean-jump technique I had applied in The Haunted Cathedral to avoid the Ghost bust there. Placing myself in the western corner, facing east, I looked slightly down, blocked, crouched, leaned right and jumped. This got me almost all the way through, but my sword clanged against the boards and this alerted the guards. After a reload, I tried doing that move again, but this time without the sword, just with a crouch, lean-right and jump. It worked!! I got all the way through on the first attempt! I tried it again just for good measure and was successful a second time! This was great news, as what I was doing now wasn’t an engine exploit, but instead a Supreme-clean move. I was simply hopping in between the boards sideways. It didn’t work forwards or backwards, only from the side. That is why it didn’t work earlier.



    After grabbing all the loot, getting back out was a lot harder. I managed to do it using a fairly predictable maneuver, but it required using the crate near the guards to block the jump (image above). In the same corner as before, if I crouched, leaned left and jumped, I got my head through, but nothing else. I realized if I in this position turned to face north and kept jumping and wiggling the mouse, eventually I got through. This move isn’t reliable more than 1 out of 5 times or so, even after a lot of testing. The reason I needed the crate was to stop me from landing on the metal floor. I would instead silently bump against the box.

    Mechanist Facility
    Cleaned the rest of the central grotto and entered the mechanist facility via the underwater tunnel. This was the absolute stealthiest way in. The upper floor was full of metal floors, but had enough shade to dodge the patrollers. I couldn’t enter the boarded up room in the southwest to get the doll in there (image below). The boards were much closer together than in the laboratory, so there was no room to squeeze through. The upper left corner was the only place I could get my head through, but only after stacking some items. This hall was on a patrol route, so that method wouldn’t have been allowable for Supreme anyway. Regardless, I couldn’t get my body through at all. I tried the block-lean-jump technique as well, but to no avail. This meant the diamond from the doll bonus objective had to be skipped.



    The area around the eastern staircase was difficult. The two patrollers covered the grounds well, plus there was a wary maid downstairs. Although there was plenty of shade, very few areas had any perfect shadows. If moving, most guards could see me across the room unless I creep-crouched. Some lights also flickered or pulsated, which made progress fairly unpredictable. I descended to the chapel via the big windows instead, then headed to the northeastern hallway via the windows on the north side. From here I could more easily get to the coins northeast of the aforementioned staircase (see image). I imagine coming from the south to be possible, but very difficult.

    Now I could access the vertical mine shaft and the coal tunnels below the kitchen. There was nothing to report from here, other than having to skip another piece of loot on the top level of the mines. The mining tunnel was boarded up, without possibility of getting through. Reached the loot goal up here though, which was a plus. Reentered the mechanist facility and snuck west to the main foyer. Had to be super careful moving fast here. The camera could give clicks indicating first alerts from far away. I cleaned the kitchen and headed up to the northwest hallway. This area was empty for now, so I dodged the camera here and robbed Lord Tomas’ quarters. Found the vault code and his body in the cellar. Also cleaned the cold storage from this direction, that way I didn’t have to get there from the foyer. On my way back, two mechanists had spawned outside Tomas’ front door. I got into the hallway again via the window and stole the slave’s purse (image below). It was somewhat tricky dodging the camera while avoiding comments from the guards.





    Another mechanist servant with a purse had now spawned outside the door to the mine shaft. I tried approaching from the western hallway, but couldn’t get farther than in the screenshot above without a comment. For regular Ghost it was easy to rush around the corner to the left and snatch the loot along the wall, but for Supreme that wasn’t possible. Coming from the other door was even brighter. My thoughts then went to the above walkway. I could drop down from the pipe along the northern wall. The best place would be the northeast corner, landing on top of the sloped metal wall stud. The problem was how to get back up there. It took a long time before I finally realized the top of the walkway was carpet! With angled vine arrows I could perhaps be able to climb back up. But the only location to mantle up was the southeast corner, and even that was a very difficult mantle. The pipe here allowed enough room to mantle, but it was very hit or miss. I experimented a lot with proper arrow locations and came up with the successful configuration in the first screen capture below. I had to use 3 arrows, so 2 more had to be picked up for Supreme. The most important rope placement was in the aforesaid southeast corner. The attachment was also tough to get right, because the arrow had to stick up, yet the line had to be far enough out from the walkway to clear the edge when ascending later. I tested to make sure it was climbable before going for the loot. Dropping into the corner was silent, luckily. After getting the purse, there was a small pipe sticking out from the wall in the corner where I was concealed from all patrollers (second image below). Here I hopped onto the closest vine. Climbing up a bit, I suddenly turned dark. I leapt onto the second rope over the radio looking device. I couldn’t climb too far up to make this jump, since a pipe above me would push me back down. The last jump was easy, but the mantle to the top level very hard. I saved on the rope and probably needed 10-12 tries. Very happy to get this move done Supreme clean, despite the reward being a measly 13 gold.





    Treasure Room
    Entered the treasure room via the top vent, just like earlier in the laboratory. The biggest problem was dodging the cameras heading down to the vault. I got stuck troubleshooting for a long time going from the first floor that had a camera to the floor below. I first tried using the intended ladder, but the cameras were badly synchronized, so that didn’t work. The light stayed dark quite a while, for then to go bright for 1-2 seconds. The problem was even at the darker setting, it wasn’t dark enough to prevent the cameras clicking, which is considered a first alert and a Supreme bust. I abandoned the ladder idea and instead looked for other ways down. I tried various locations to drop landing in a mantle on the level below. The problem was the mantle animation was slow and the camera below always caught me in the act. I had to find a way to stay concealed while mantling, which meant dropping to an area protected by hardcover. The best area to do this was just north of the crate with the coin stack next to it (image below). In the southeast corner on the level above I had hardcover from the camera on this floor. Timing the watcher’s pivot, I dropped and landed behind hardcover down below. The maneuver was difficult, but definitely repeatable.



    In the vault, only a single patrolling spider bot was the issue. It wasn’t hard to dodge, but occasionally it would just stop, never to continue its route. Once, it stopped right outside the vault door, staring straight at it with no possibility of entry. Then I had to reload to an earlier save and redo it all. This time, it didn’t stop until I was in the vault, and then it was staring straight into the corner of the storage room. I imagine this could be quite random. Couldn’t reset the code panel to all zeros, so I did ‘1111’ instead. I imagine it doesn’t matter what you put it to, as long as the vault door closes. It was absolutely impossible to climb back up past the cameras undetected, so I used the alternate ventilation exit instead. The vents couldn’t be closed up, but there was no way around that.

    I then made my way out of the mining complex and returned to the guards’ barracks. A few new enemies had spawned by the water tower, three of whom had purses, but none of them were difficult to dodge. The final thing to do was to return the elevator key. It couldn’t be put onto the actual sill without waking up the guard, but it could be placed on the tiny lip of the window just above it (see image). This was close enough for Supreme, so I deemed it ok. I’m not sure why, but this tiny ledge was quieter than any of the other surfaces.

    Not long after finishing my run, Matt99 told me the grate above the elevator could be reclosed, so I went looking. I found a hidden lever underneath the top floor that I never noticed during my ghost run (image below). I thus reloaded my last save and went back to close it. If it can be closed, this is required for Supreme. The pipes leading up to that floor can be climbed, plus the underside of the top floor is rope attachable, so getting the elevator key not even necessary for any ghost mode.



    Notes:
    - Skipped a purse worth 13 on a thief in the laboratory storage room. Breaking the boards to his hideout is property damage and not allowed.
    - Couldn’t obtain Atropos the doll from the boarded up room in the mechanist facility. Thus, I had to skip the bonus objective and the diamond it yielded worth 253 gold.
    - Skipped a gold nugget worth 100 on the top level of the mine shaft. The tunnel was boarded up, with no way to enter.
    Last edited by klatremus; 21st Jan 2022 at 20:58.

  18. #518
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    LINGERING WHISPERS

    MINE


    First I wait for guard to open door to Entrance and go quickly to 2nd floor for flares, then I need to wait for 3 patrollers and then I quickly go to 1st floor and open secret passage to Mine. In Mine you are forced to destroy 3 things: lower plank blocking door (it's also heard by guards) (ghost bust #1) and 2 "X" walls containing copper ore and tin ore (while I don't consider stone walls of Mine as property, to destroy them you need to use explosive barrels and flares and barrels are property) (ghost bust #2-3). 1st "X" explosion is also heard by guards while 3rd "X" explosion is probably heard by undead, but for me they were occupied by listening to different kind of explosions.

    Mine is patrolled by 2 zombies and it's visited by indestructible shadow Mechanist from Mechanist Quarters. But at the top of stairs there may be walking ghost of Karras. He can only be killed by Vorpal Sword after entering Vault. Other than that he can't be killed and Karras is hostile to shadow, so they can meet and fight. Karras will contantly shoot magic at shadow, but both enemies are indestructible and noise of shots will alert zombies. They will eventually stop fight when I will be far away. This fight actually happened when I was about exploding 3rd "X" wall.

    I mentioned 1st and 3rd "X" walls, but what about 2nd "X" wall? It leads to Burrick Cave and Temple, but after visiting Vault you will get teleported there, so there is no need to open it. And when I will appear there, there are 2 ways to exit without destroying wall: through Bay 1 (there is timed panel near lying zombie, so I can get out from there anytime I want) and there is much harder way out through wagon in Mine if somehow Bay 1 route will get blocked.

    Now for the ores. They are part of inventory that slows you down, but I noticed that there is a glitch. If you grab explosive barrel and put it down, your speed resets back to normal. So after grabbing 2 ores I'm looking around to find explosive barrel to reset my speed, loot east part of Mine and then go to Mechanist Quarters.

    MECHANIST QUARTERS

    1st elevator leads to combo lock (#5-9). Other numbers are on the other side accessed from Offices D (east side). Path to other numbers is blocked by 2 poison plants. You can destroy them with fire arrow, but it's loud, so I don't know if anyone will hear explosion. So to open bays you will be forced to go back and forth to use combo lock, then go down to Beta Warehouse north part and use panel opening bays.

    This place is occupied by shadow Mechanists, but crouching in full shadow is safe. Here is secret near Library, which gives you 2 vine arrows. Very useful. 2nd floor leads to place where you need to use bronze gear to open Vault, but you don't have it. There is also safe with loot, but Karras can spot you through window in floor and there is shadow visiting this corridor. In Basement is another secret switch on top of pillar in church - I shoot water arrow to activate it. For Amulet of Inspiration I need holy water, which is in Undertaker's room. I skipped that for later. At the end of Basement is hatch. Since I skipped valve, I can open it and grab 3 coin stacks. I can't power up this place, but I prefer to wait with that as it activates watchers. I also grab mask (it's 2nd mask, because 1st was in Mine). Masks teleport me to different places, but the most useful is 5th maks, because it teleports me to Bay 1, so I don't need to use combo lock to open it. Because of that I'm choosing to open Bay 4 first.

    LOOTING WAREHOUSE

    Using Mine I return to Entrance and use vent to get to Offices A. In next room is valve needed to power up Warehouse. Then I need to go through Alpha Warehouse to Offices B. Unfortunately 2 guards got stuck walking into each other in left passage, so I'm forced to use vine arrow to climb on top of crates. Next is archer walking into door, so just open it and quickly hide behind corner. After looting Offices B I'm going to north crate of Alpha Warehouse to find 3rd mask. It teleports me to Beta Warehouse, so I loot it and frob 4th mask. In this warehouse is also 5th mask on top of crates (crate with lava). Since it's a 5th mask, it will teleport me to Bay 1.

    Unfortunately after teleportation I found out that lying zombie near panel is attacked by angry burrick. Since burrick can't kill zombie and looks like going far away doesn't change this situation, I can't get out from Bay 1 without getting spotted by burrick. This means I will be forced to open Bay 1 through combo lock and also my exit from Burrick Cave will be through wagon in Mine.

    Now I go through Mine back to plank door to loot it. I must skip golden hammer (worth 50) behind banner as you can't grab it through it. Then I find ladder in Mine. i can grab 3 crates through trapdoor and then open it. This is area of Offices D. Sometimes it's visited by guards. In Undertaker is holy water. Then go find middle stairs in Mine. They lead to Offices C. Again they are sometimes visited by guards and there is drunken guard at the middle, but going along wall makes not being spotted by him easy. In Actress is another secret switch, but there are also 4 goblets behind glass (worth 100 together), which I must skip. In Toymaker is mine on note. It's very easy to activate it.

    BAY 4

    Bay 4 is connected with Gamma Warehouse and Bay 3, but Bay 3 code requires less running from side to side of combo lock, so I chose to enter Bay 4. Here is wisp flying around, which can still hurt you if you run into it, 2 patrolling apes, stationary treebeast further away and patrolling Trickster (just like Karras he can only be killed with Vorpal Sword). There is also a lot of hiding loot here in high places and Tear of Maw (blue gem ) flying around just like wisp, but higher. I recommend dousing all torches and frobbing all light mushroom (or shooting them if they are too close to enemies).

    First you must grab floating gem either by going on well visible branch or by roping up. Be careful of treebeast. If everything is doused you can go along west side from him. To go in other direction you can rope up on crate and drop down. Go behind treebeast and rope up to very top of crates for nugget. Douse roots at the bottom and gradually shoot lower vine arrows to retrieve all of them. On top of SE crates is last mask, but I can't grab it yet, because it will teleport me to Bay 1. Lastly is Smashing Machine. Drop Tin Ore into lava to get Refined Tin. There is no way to open Bay 3, so you are forced to return all the way through forest to Bay 4.

    OPENING VAULT

    Open Bay 1. Luckily code is made from numbers #5-9, so there is no need to run around. Go to lava mask to get teleported there. Here is Spinning Machine for Copper Ore and you get Refined Copper from that. Then go to Bay 2 and drop both refined ores into lava in Smelting Machine to get Bronze Control Gear. Next step will be powering up warehouse as it will power up Vault door, but first let's do all other business. Once again open Bay 4 and go to last mask to trigger bonus objective. Then go to Basement of Mechanist Quarters and shoot holy water arrow into gear in church to find Amulet of Inspiration. Lastly use 2 switches at the end to power up warehouse.

    So now watchers are activated, there is more light, 2 passages to Alpha Warehouse are open and Vault door can be opened. Go to 2nd floor while crouching to avoid being spotted by watcher and use gear to open Vault door. Use elevator. You must time watcher, but also Karras can appear out of walls, so you must take that into account. Go into Vault and mask will teleport you. Open door and bot will kill Victoria, then you get teleported to Temple and you get Vorpal Sword to kill Karras and Trickster.

    TEMPLE

    In corridors are magic bolts traps and there is invisible trigger activated whenever you enter corridors with statues. Here is also pedestal where you need to put Goblets of Yin and Yang. This creates Goblet of Balance, but also summons zombies into this area, so do it at the end. In sarcophagus near pedestal is Jewelry. There is last secret requiring vine arrow. Loot the whole Temple and then create Goblet of Balance. Unfortunately traps alert zombies. Traps are activated by invisible trigger, so I don't count this alerts as ghost busts.

    The problem with zombies starts in room with water. You must quickly hide in left corner, then go behind zombies to pool and slowly enter it. The problem is that zombie alerted from previous room will enter corridor with traps and eventually die. So you must be quick to get to pool before zombie will explode and alert zombies near pool.

    GETTING MASK OF TORMENTER + ESCAPE

    Burrick Cave is rather easy. but escape from it is tricky. I didn't destroy wall in Mine and Bay 1 is blocked by burrick. The only way is to get on wagon, but you can't mantle on it. Grab barrel and drop in front of wagon. Mantle on it and crouch. Drop potion on it, jump and crouch. If you did it correctly you can crouch walk on wagon. Go to Mechanist Quarters. There is new combat bot patrolling this area. Now I went to Bay 4 to kill Trickster. He can't be killed in one hit, so that's a ghost bust. Then I went to combo lock to open secret compartment in Vault.

    And here I realized that strongly advertised by story objective of killing Karras and Trickster is actually optional. I was fooled. So I reloaded save from before I killed Trickster and this time I didn't kill him. So there is no new ghost bust. Open secret compartment and go to Vault. Again you must worry about watcher and Karras. Grab 3 masks including Mask of Tormenter and crystal from eye of statue from secret compartment. This will complete loot objective. Time to return to starting point via Mine.

    STATS:

    Time: 2:25:49; Loot: 2615/3000
    Pockets Picked: 0/3; Locks Picked: 26
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 4/4

    GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE

  19. #519
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    LORD GIBSON'S ESTATE

    The biggest problem in this mission is reaching letter in Planning Room. It's located in small room with 2 stationary Mechanists. One of them is right in front of door looking at it. So I tried to block open door to reach it and learned that gap is too small to highlight it. Plus leaning forward would immediately 2nd alert other Mechanist. Very quickly I assumed that I must KO front guard and he must fall forward. Then you can quickly enter, grab letter and leave without any alert from other guard.

    This was the only ghost bust in the mission. After completing ghost run I decided to return to previous saves and try to avoid triggering objective regarding this letter. Mechanists objective is triggered after you visit hall leading to Lord Gibson's personal rooms. To avoid triggering it I wanted to use roof. Some of ceiling windows aren't solid and you can mantle through them to roof. Unfortunately Lord Gibson's rooms have solid ceiling windows, but you can get to hall has non solid ceiling window. So maybe avoiding entering through doors would be successful in avoiding this objective.

    I highly doubted plus my last save was from opening Planning Room. I didn't want to replay the whole mission, so I decided to try more block opening this door. And after couple of attempts I managed to leave door in good place. Part of face of Mechanist and part of his body was visible for me, but he couldn't see me yet. Gap was big enough, so I could highlight letter and steal it without being spotted by any of these 2 guards. Then I just replayed the rest of the mission.

    Entering upper floor can be tricky as lower floor Mechanist turns a lot and upper floor Mechanist walks around room. I climbed on bookcase on the right and mantled on wooden railing. I also activated secret, but it's impossible to take loot from it as area is well visible and has a lot of zombies looking at entrance. Because of that I'm skipping 205 loot from there.

    Cave is another tricky spot. To get to Book of Ash you must mantle on last cell's door and jump on wall of locked room. You can go through tunnel up to room with 3 statuettes on table and you can't continue as in narrow corridor is haunt looking in your direction. Because of that I need to skip tapestry worth 150 loot. To return to mention you must go along right wall, mantle on torture device, go behind haunt, mantle on chain and then on wooden ledge. Other way is doing strafe jump from 1st cell's door to wooden ledge above lying ladder. This way is a bit more tricky.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:33:09; Loot: 3733/4088
    Pockets Picked: 1/4; Locks Picked: 5
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 4/4

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE. You must skip 205 loot from zombie secret in library as entrance to this room is well visible and watched by many zombies. You must also skip tapestry (worth 150) in cave, because haunt is blocking corridor to it.

  20. #520
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    TEMPLE OF DEATH

    Another "kill them all" mission by Cardia. I believe this is 4th mission of this kind I try to ghost. First 2 failed ghost run very quickly, but 3rd mission was possible to ghost with exception of 4 bosses. This mission also has 4 bosses, so it's already known for me before playing it that it's impossible to successfully ghost it. But is everything else than bosses can be ghosted? Starting point has full shadow, so maybe yes.

    Starting room is fairly visible. You are only safe on starting point and under one side of pillars. Wait under right pillar and get purses from 2nd and 3rd patroller. 1st patroller from group can get stuck on stairs and become new 2nd patroller. This way you can get his purse. Go to further right corner and mantle on ledge. This way you can get to skeleton and drop near him without being spotted. Corridor is easy. Then hide under ramp and steal purse from 1st skeleton. 2nd skeleton is easy to rob. Quickly go upstairs and take purses from archers. Go right and steal 3 more purses. Go more right.

    This is room with 4 skeletons. Some of them walk, but after a while they will stop in 4 corners. You should quickly go downstairs. Here are 3 purses to get, which isn't that hard. Go right. You have 3 choices. Go straight. You can get 3 purses from 2 archers on the side and from patroller. Sadly upstairs archers are too close to ramp and when you run on it, they will spot you. So I must skip 2 purses worth 200 loot. I'm starting to worry, because my leeway is another 200 loot.

    Return to crossroad. Side corridors have easy 4 purses (2 purses each). Downstairs is nothing on the right. On the left is speed potion and 1st boss - Alfredo, the zombie. You can go along left wall to him, but attacking him will also alert 2 patrolling skeletons (ghost bust #1). If you start shooting from ledge with skulls, he will not see you and he will start walking towards big stairs. Kill him. I tried to wait for skeletons to calm down, but it's impossible. So I just ran for it and used flash bomb on big stairs to escape skeletons (ghost bust #2).

    Return to 4 skeletons room and sneak along right wall to next area. Skeletons are pretty easy to dodge. Just run along right wall first, then go along left wall.and pick up 5 purses on the road and invisibility potion. There are 2 archers on the side, but you can easily run at the middle behind patroller. Last room has 2 skeletons walking on the side (with 2 purses). It can be a bit tricky to get. You can hide from enemies on the sides and in hole with speed potion behind small wall. At the end of room is Albertina - female zombie. She's pretty easy to kill with sword, but it's impossible to kill her in one hit (ghost bust #3). And other skeletons don't hear the fight. Return to 4 skeletons room.

    Return downstairs and go under stairs. Climb other stairs and sneak past archer to previous room, but via other passage. Go right to red carpet room. You must dodge skeleton with purse while he's turning and go right. Next room with 5 skeletons and 5 purses is easy. Just dodge skeletons when they turn. At the end is Raimundo - haunt. Fighting too close to the center may alert skeletons, so I hit him first with sword, then back off to further wall and continue killing him (ghost bust #4). Also at this time I thought about 2nd ghost bust in Alfredo's room. I think it's avoidable if I would lure Alfredo to me by jumping in place. This way I could still ghost skeletons. Too bad I didn't think about that earlier. Go back to red carpet room and use last passage.

    Here is another easy purse to get. Going left will lead you to starting point, but also to 2 easy purses. On the right are only fire arrows, so go straight. Long path downstairs has 3 purses. Then is room with 2 patrolling skeletons with purses below. Wait at the top, because there will be another skeleton with purse go upstairs. Steal his purse and crouch in well visible corner at the bottom. Left skeleton can get stuck making small loops around ledge with healing potion. You can reload game to fix that. You can also use that to your advantage and dodge him during his turn animation when you run along left wall. Hide in shadow in passageway and steal both purses.

    You have 3 roads. Right path leads to 3 vases and invisibility potion. Left path leads to bridge. You must wait at the middle of stairs and then run to dodge skeleton. Other skeleton must be walking away. You must dodge him too. Because of that you need 2nd skeleton time well with 1st skeleton. This can take couple of rounds. Both has purses, so steal them. You aren't safe yet. In next room there is 4 patrollers walking along left side around the room. You must wait for one to pass and go behind him to next corridor. Be careful as 2 skeletons go near each other. And if you will have bad luck to wait for them, you may be forced to replay the whole bridge.

    Climb stairs and nudge skeleton with purse to the left side of entrance in next area. Then go to right wall. There is metal tile near walls, but there is also tiny gap between metal tile and wall. If you run close to wall, you will not hit it. So strafe run along right wall. Next arena has 2 easy purses on both sides, invisibility potion and Arnaldo - the zombie at the end. He can't be killed with one hit (ghost bust #5), but like Albertina he's far away from other skeletons,.Return to crossroad. This is much harder as you aren't safe in 4 patrollers room and you need to correctly time bridge skeletons. Again on bridge there is no safe spot. You can try to hide behind pillar in 4 patrollers room, but pair of skeletons can spot you. Plus and use middle path when strafe running to skeletons on bridge you must avoid stepping on metal lines on floor as it can 2nd alert enemies.

    Enter middle path. Patroller is easy to rob, but then there is stationary archer in a bit narrow corridor. Luckily left side has good shadow, so you can crouch walk along it. Next 2 skeletons with purses are also easy to dodge. Next is archer looking in my direction and area in front of him is well visible. Luckily you can strafe run to his right side and he will just 1st alert. His purse completes loot objective. Go downstairs for last 2 purses and Horn of Triumph. Last skeleton must be dodged during his turn animation. To escape you will be forced to nudge top archer to the left of passage. Then return to starting point. You will meet skeleton who was climbing stairs before. He's walking to the starting point near wooden gate. But it's not a problem, because mission ends in good shadow behind very 1st stationary skeleton.

    STATS:

    Time: 1:20:10; Loot: 6300/6500
    Pockets Picked: 68/73; Locks Picked: 0
    Back Stabs: 2; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 232; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 4
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Bodies Discovered by Enemies: 1
    Secrets: 0/0

    GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE

  21. #521
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    THIRD TIME IS THE CHARM

    The only problem is entering Monastery. The intended way is to use cave, but you must destroy wall, so you can't use this passage. You can also rope up to top of elevator shaft, douse 2 torches and crouch walk along left side. 3rd way is to mantle on metal fence above cave with intended way in and go through mountain behind front door Hammerite. This way you don't need to douse torches. To exit without dousing torches you need to shoot rope arrow into wooden wall above front door and jump to wall and return via mountains to starting point. I also douse 4 torches around statue as I need to go there, but statue is well observed.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:30:51; Loot: 3000/3000
    Pockets Picked: 7/8; Locks Picked: 9
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 6/6

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

  22. #522
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    THROUGH NO VAULT OF MY OWN

    Expert difficulty already forces ghosting. Mission is small, but there is many thieves to avoid. Sometimes they can get stuck on walls and stop patrolling. Another times they can go into search mode without any reason. Once after starting mission I saved and reloaded and suddenly patrolling thief went into search mode even though I was in completely different room and there was no eye contact between us and I didn't make any noise. Jumping out of hole in ruins to rope and going back to ruins is a bit tricky. I mossed floor on ruins side. But thanks to that I got Mask of Mantu (bonus objective).

    If you don't read Tanner's Book, then mission will end automatically after looting vault. Reading this book gives 2 objectives - setting off alarm and finding different exit. This is much harder. First it's a good idea to despawn metal door as they requires code to open and they stay open for just couple of seconds. So despawning this door is life saver. Picklock safe (triggers alarm) and quickly hide in corner near vault door. Vault door automatically closes, so 2 guards walking out of elevator room will not spot him. Alerted guards also go into opposite to vault direction, so if you hide in corner near safe you are done for. You can't hide on ladder as thieves below will spot you. You are only safe in dark corner near vault door. wait for guards to go to opposite wall and quickly go into passage and to elevator. I did that in my 1st ghost run, but I noticed that I played on Hard difficulty, so on Expert I skipped Tanner's Book.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:10:51; Loot: 11180/11180
    Pockets Picked: 1/1; Locks Picked: 4
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 1/1

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

  23. #523
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    TILL DEATH DO US PART

    This mission is hard to ghost. In this small museum mission is a lot of guards patrolling all floors. There are stationary guards and interesting feature with them is whenever patroller get KO-ed, stationary guard will start his patrol. We can't KO anyone, so you need to go very slowly near these stationary guards. You could try to nudge them, but it's time consuming and you have time limit of 30 min in this mission. Plus loot objective is very tight. You just have 239 loot of leeway, which in this mission is very small.

    You must go past 3 stationary guards while very slowly crouch creep walking and while all lights are turned off. 2 archers guard secret switches near stoves and one guard protect valuable breastplate. In guard post on 1st floor you need (though it's optional) very slowly crouch creep walk along right wall and very slowly sneak between 2 stationary guards for last pickpocket and code from safe. To exit museum I just dropped on one of outside patrollers. Due time limit this mission is very stressful.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:23:13; Loot: 14239/14239
    Pockets Picked: 24/24; Locks Picked: 4
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 5/5

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

  24. #524
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    TRIBAL BREEZE

    Mission is split into 2 parts. First part is mansion and it's forced ghosting. There is a lot of shadow, so it's not that hard, but AI can turn on light. Second part is forest and it's much easier to ghost as there is less enemies. I skipped 2 nuggets (worth 100 together) in Water Talisman cave. They can't be picked up without mantling out of water and dropping back into water 2nd alerts small spider. This is also the reason why I don't grab Water Talisman. Fire Talisman because of that is also pointless. To get Tribal Mask you only need Air and earth Talismans. Both are located in treebeasts area.Air Talisman can be a bit tricky as it's floating and you need to worry for treebeasts and apes with lanterns. Also it's a good idea to quickly check cave with blackjack inside as it's possible for patrolling it spider to get stuck somewhere.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:44:27; Loot: 4799/6034
    Pockets Picked: 3/3; Locks Picked: 11
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 0; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 0; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 4/5

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE. 2 nuggets (worth 100 together) from Water Talisman cave must be skipped as they can't be reached from water and it's impossible to drop into water quietly.

  25. #525
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2018
    RETRIEVAL

    This mission was already reported by Vanguard, but I noticed that there are actually 3 versions of this mission. I believe Vanguard reported original Komag's mission, but version I play has different max loot stat and all loot can be collected. All versions has the same objectives, mostly the same readables and also chest with 6250 loot. There are 4 objectives: get 7000 loot, get a sword, kill merchant and return to starting point.

    KOMAG'S VERSION

    Original version made by Komag is actually tutorial mission to help other people create their own missions. It's a small mission. Guard from mansion can 2nd alert by seeing street patroller, but he's very quickly calming down, so I wonder if it's not a scripted behavior. Killing merchant is easy - just shoot him with arrow when guard is away. Then frob douse light mushroom and leave body there.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:05:54; Loot: 7520/7520
    Pockets Picked: 0/0; Locks Picked: 3
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 15; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 1; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 0/0

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

    HANSCZ'S VERSION


    This mission is smaller. There is no basement. There is less loot - 6300. Loot objective still shows that you need to get 7000 loot, but it completes with 6000. Patroller from mansion doesn't go outside and merchant is walking in bathroom. You need to douse 3 gas torches: in entrance room, corridor and bathroom. When guard is in entrance room, shoot merchant, then hide his body in darkness.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:03:58; Loot: 6300/6300
    Pockets Picked: 0/0; Locks Picked: 3
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 15; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 1; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 0/0

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: SUCCESS

    PEDRO QUINTELA'S VERSION


    Layout of this mission is completely different. Because it's Pedro Quintela's mission, loot objective is very tight - you have only 95 loot of leeway. Also mission doesn't end, so I will be forced to return to start and use cheat to end it. This is the hardest version to ghost - you need to be very careful with water arrows. You use them to douse torch above drunken guard on street, because he have purse. In kitchen are 2 loot pieces, but skip it for later. Guard with doll doesn't alert to us yet. Go behind him to next room and douse left torch. Go to shadow and from there you must douse 2 torches: near knight and other on one side of corridor. Go behind archer to barracks. In left room douse right torch to get to 2 chests: with loot and water arrows. Right room doesn't require any torches to be doused. Dodge archer and jump to 2 cheats with loot. Go to last room.

    2 guards on the sides and patroller. also lots of chests, but only 2 have loot - on left and right side of door. You don't need to douse any torch, go just through chests by crouch jumping on top of them and direct jumps towards wall. This way you will quietly jump on top of chests. Left path leads to swimming pool and at the bottom of it is coin worth 50, but dropping into pool always 2nd alert stationary guard with lantern. So this coin must be skipped.

    Right door leads to merchant. To deal with him you must enter, close door and jump on top of cabinet on the left and crouch. When merchant will go near desk, shoot him. Nobody should hear his screams. Interestingly arrow dealt him 20 damage instead of 15 like in other versions. Before I killed him, he 1st alerted to me, which means that 1st alert gave him 5 more health. Now you just need to go back to kitchen, go behind guard with doll, dodge him when he will turn around and douse all 4 sources of light. Then sneak slowly to right side of female servant and grab goblet and plate from sink. Loot objective completed.

    STATS:

    Time: 0:15:57; Loot: 7045/7095
    Pockets Picked: 4/5; Locks Picked: 7
    Back Stabs: 0; Knock Outs: 0
    Damage Dealt: 20; Damage Taken: 0; Healing Taken: 0
    Innocents killed: 1; Others killed: 0
    Iron Beasts Destroyed: 0; Disabled: 0
    Secrets: 0/0

    GHOST: SUCCESS
    PERFECT GHOST: IMPOSSIBLE. You must skip coin (worth 50) from pool as dropping into water 2nd alert nearby guard.

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