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Thread: FMEditor Project (Update: Devlog #2 - Polygons, Cells and WorldRep)

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: Cracow, Poland

    FMEditor Project (Update: Devlog #2 - Polygons, Cells and WorldRep)

    Hi folks!

    [Edited]

    We will update this post in case of any news.

    This topic is about two work-in-progress projects:


    FMEditor

    &

    NewDarkLib

    by PyTaffers:
    Konrad (Marzec)
    JuliuszK (PinkDot)


    FMEditor Devlog: [Playlist]
    #1 - Thief Fan Mission Editor: https://youtu.be/epmTvLwDay0
    #2 - Polygons, Cells and WorldRep: https://youtu.be/G18nIav7q1g

    ~ * ~

    FMEditor (meaning Fan Mission Editor) aims to replace old and clunky DromEd editor. We think DromEd is cool, but the times of 3D editing have changed. Modern 3D graphics applications gave us much more convenient and effective tools, that allow us to build 3D scenes faster and better. Our motivation is that every fan mission is worth its weight in gold, but authors often leave their projects unfinished. To fix that, better tools are needed and we are here to build them How FMEditor will look and feel, the best is to describe it by pictures, not words, so here is a teaser for ya!

    (Full screen and HD recommended)



    https://youtu.be/5U6aDVErJUU

    NewDarkLib is a library for reading and modifying Dark Engine's files, with a support for unofficiall New Dark Engine patches. NewDarkLib is used as a "backend" in FMEditor, but it's also a more mature and versatile project. Made possible by 8 years of JuliuszK research in Dark Engine files format, this Python library should allow other programmers to create their own tools (or editors) operating on Thief 1, Gold and 2 mission files format.

    We plan to release both of them at the same time or NewDarkLib first, then FMEditor, if the latter will need more time.

    Both editor and the library are written in Python, with the FMEditor's UI part written in Qt framework (written in C++) and with plans for NewDarkLib crucial parts written in Cython or pure C.

    We started both projects in early 2019. Our plan is to release both of them as free / libre and open source software.

    Have yourself a merry taffy Christmas




    ---


    UI layout mockup:

    (You can see some of the features already planned, but in general, it's only a sketch, so everything is a subject to change)

    Last edited by Marzec; 30th Jun 2021 at 05:27. Reason: Updated title

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2020
    Location: London, UK
    Oh man this is fantastic news! and extremely impressive work. Hah, I might yet be able to make a mission for T2 now....

    you guys enjoy your Xmas :-)

  3. #3
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2012
    Location: Slovenia
    Is it possible to hook this up with custom made algorythms for precedural generation of maps?

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Constantly losing tug o'war
    A very interesting project.

    Will brush dimensions by displayed when creating/selecting them?

  5. #5
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2004
    Location: Ireland/Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by neux View Post
    Is it possible to hook this up with custom made algorythms for precedural generation of maps?
    Yes, Python scripting will be embedded in the editor, so you'd able to create stuff procedurally.

    Will brush dimensions by displayed when creating/selecting them?
    Yes, there will be an Inspector panel on the right. Everything you can see in Dromed, will be there and more.

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Montpellier, France
    Incredible!!! This is awesome news!

  7. #7
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2004
    Location: Ireland/Poland
    I might just as well add a design image for the UI Layout. Things will change, of course, but you can see certain planned features, like the Scene Manager with groups or the Inspector on the right.


  8. #8
    New Member
    Registered: Feb 2003
    Location: Forest town
    Marzec
    PinkDot
    That's great incredibly awesome work! Respect to you guys! And THANKS! It's really appreciated!

  9. #9
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2013
    Very cool! Have you guys made your own level compiler?

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2004
    Location: Ireland/Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by Force View Post
    Marzec
    PinkDot
    That's great incredibly awesome work! Respect to you guys! And THANKS! It's really appreciated!
    Thanks a lot! Glad you like the idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by nemyax View Post
    Very cool! Have you guys made your own level compiler?
    No, not at this moment.
    The plan is to have project developed and released in two phases. First one will be fully compatible with Dromed and will use it in the background for scene processing and for gameplay testing, of course.
    In second phase, we plan to introduce more sophisticated brush system with custom portalization and lightmapping. Ideally all the scene processing including RoomDatabase and Pathfinding will be replaced at that point as well. Dromed would be used only for game testing.

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2020
    Location: London, UK
    Quote Originally Posted by PinkDot View Post
    In second phase, we plan to introduce more sophisticated brush system with custom portalization and lightmapping. Ideally all the scene processing including RoomDatabase and Pathfinding will be replaced at that point as well. Dromed would be used only for game testing.
    This is brilliant. Can I ask what the current render being used for 3D view is and what it will be in the second phase..?

  12. #12
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: Cracow, Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by Bikerdude View Post
    This is brilliant. Can I ask what the current render being used for 3D view is and what it will be in the second phase..?
    Current render is Qt3D Framework which runs OpenGL under the hood. No plans to change it so far. From our benchmarks, we can handle complex Dark Engine scenes quite well and that's all we need.

  13. #13
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2020
    Location: London, UK
    Regarding the editor, what stopped you guys from using an existing editor like GtkRadiant ..?

  14. #14
    Hate to be that guy, but any idea on a timetable for release?

  15. #15
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2009
    Invaluable, thank you for your work.

    Perhaps it would be worth creating a github with public releases for testing purposes?

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2004
    Location: Ireland/Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by Bikerdude View Post
    Regarding the editor, what stopped you guys from using an existing editor like GtkRadiant ..?
    It's just a completely different editor, with a different world building logic. We'd have to fight too many systems to make it work for Dark Engine.
    Also from a user experience point of view, not having an editor bloated with unrelated stuff is much better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brethren View Post
    Hate to be that guy, but any idea on a timetable for release?
    Oh, no - you had to ask this, didn't you?!? No, seriously - there's no rigid time frame. It's all driven by internal motivation (now externalized as well), but constrained by RL matters.
    I think it would be nice to have it released some time before the New Dark 10th anniversary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ascobol View Post
    Invaluable, thank you for your work.

    Perhaps it would be worth creating a github with public releases for testing purposes?
    We're on GitLab and plan to open up for testers and futures contributors, but the ground work needs to be more solid or else it may drift off in too many directions.

  17. #17
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Does anyone actually use the Front and Right windows in DromEd? I find them more confusing than anything, so I always just drag the layout center to the bottom and rely entirely on the Top and 3D View windows.

  18. #18
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2001
    Location: Constantly losing tug o'war
    I mainly use them for stairs and slopes and placing objects on other objects such as tables.

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2011
    Location: Montpellier, France
    Same as R Soul, these viewports are fairly useful for specific things. That being said if the 3D manipulation with FMEditor is robust enough, every 2D viewport except top will be made pretty much obsolete.
    Actually there is something that could fairly useful but it's rather niche, it's the ability to have only two viewports, the 3D view and one 2D, and be able to cycle through top/front/right through a key press or a button like in Radiant.

  20. #20
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2009
    You might find that the testing focuses development and cuts features that are unneeded, saving time!

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: Cracow, Poland
    Quote Originally Posted by ZylonBane View Post
    Does anyone actually use the Front and Right windows in DromEd? I find them more confusing than anything, so I always just drag the layout center to the bottom and rely entirely on the Top and 3D View windows.
    How do you align heights of your brushes? Do you type them by hand?

    Quote Originally Posted by skacky View Post
    Same as R Soul, these viewports are fairly useful for specific things. That being said if the 3D manipulation with FMEditor is robust enough, every 2D viewport except top will be made pretty much obsolete.
    That's our goal. Sometimes, rarily, side views are needed. But 3D view with grid aligning, rulers and all that kind of stuff, should be enough in most cases.

    Quote Originally Posted by skacky View Post
    Actually there is something that could fairly useful but it's rather niche, it's the ability to have only two viewports, the 3D view and one 2D, and be able to cycle through top/front/right through a key press or a button like in Radiant.
    Niche or cliche, it's actually pretty standard in modern 3D graphics software. And it's not hard to implement so you'll have it in FMEditor

    Quote Originally Posted by Ascobol View Post
    You might find that the testing focuses development and cuts features that are unneeded, saving time!
    Beta tests are one of the most important points on our roadmap.

  22. #22
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2020
    Location: London, UK
    Quote Originally Posted by Marzec View Post
    Niche or cliche, it's actually pretty standard in modern 3D graphics software. And it's not hard to implement so you'll have it in FMEditor
    Imho neither, I use 2 viewports in Darkradiant. I have camera view on the left and orthoview on the right and I flick between views (top, front, side) using ctrl-tab.

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: Cracow, Poland
    So in this context, it wouldn't make Darkradiant a modern 3D graphics software j/k

  24. #24
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2020
    Location: London, UK
    you have a few different layout views, the above is just what I like to use.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2009
    Location: thiefgold.com

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