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View Poll Results: How long with Biden be president?

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  • 1 Term

    9 36.00%
  • 2 Terms

    6 24.00%
  • Impeachment

    2 8.00%
  • Incapacitated

    8 32.00%
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Thread: Biden

  1. #126
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2002
    Location: Point Nemo
    Quote Originally Posted by Tocky View Post
    I'm sure you have to say that because you can't counter my facts which are bureau of labor stats. How does it feel to know that you can't counter with anything but personal anecdote? No facts support your argument.
    You have to subtract the jobs lost from the total gained. Then you have to look at what jobs were lost compared to the ones made. One small example is what REI recently did when they cut 250 full time jobs then turned right around and created more jobs than that but they were all part time roles with no benefits. During my recent interview with them they suggested that part time hours could exceed what is considered full time but they don't consider that full time. These corporations are delusional and nuts.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tocky View Post
    Edit: okay I do admit a certain resemblance to the Zig Zag man




    Quote Originally Posted by Starker View Post
    Apparently, some people in the US think Brandon got off easy with the documents case because of bad memory or something:
    Some would say that Reagan used a similar tactic, but 'I do not recall'.

  2. #127
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Looking at the facts of the case, it's also really difficult to think he's guilty -- he didn't refuse to give the memos back, he didn't claim that they rightfully belonged to him because he wrote those memos or because he used to be a vice president or something, he didn't lie about handing all of them over to the proper authorities while secretly holding on to some, he didn't try to destroy evidence.

    On the contrary, he actually proactively contacted the authorities about the discovery of the documents, let them search all of his properties, and otherwise fully cooperated with them.

  3. #128
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Quote Originally Posted by Starker View Post
    Looking at the facts of the case, it's also really difficult to think he's guilty -- he didn't refuse to give the memos back, he didn't claim that they rightfully belonged to him because he wrote those memos or because he used to be a vice president or something, he didn't lie about handing all of them over to the proper authorities while secretly holding on to some, he didn't try to destroy evidence.

    On the contrary, he actually proactively contacted the authorities about the discovery of the documents, let them search all of his properties, and otherwise fully cooperated with them.
    Seems like you're making the argument that he isn't guilty of obstruction of justice, which is quite different from saying he didn't violate the law by knowingly keeping TS/SCI documents in his possession for years and sharing them with someone without the security clearance to view them (his ghost writer). Because he did do that, and that's against the law. You don't get bonus points for not obstructing the investigation--thats the minimum and you're penalized for obstruction. So, sure, he didn't obstruct the investigation into his violation of the law like Trump did. Kudos to Joe Biden! What an upstanding guy!

    Your video dude is a bit too slow and obnoxious to watch all of but I noticed he addressed the Sisi mistake. That seems like a slip of the tongue to me and not that big of a deal. Did your boy Beau address Biden's conversation with the deceased leaders of France and Germany? Years after they died? How about the fact that Joe turns into a malfunctioning Roomba every time he finishes a speech until he's guided off stage? He's not well, it's getting worse, and according to polls it's widely noticed. 3/4 of US adults think he's too old to be president, and that include 50% of his own party.

    The Democrat answer to this latest report is to deflect and blame Hur. Hur was appointed by Biden's AG, followed his orders in writing why he didn't think it was a winnable case to prosecute, and turned the private report in to the AG. Garland chose to publish it even though he wasn't legally obligated to do so. I'm wondering if there aren't some forces in the Democrat party who are trying to get a different candidate by any possible means.

    Team Biden's problems and ineffectual flailing would be wickedly fun to watch if he wasn't facing off against Trump. Biden and Trump are both narcissistic lying sacks of offal and, as in 2016 and 2020, it looks like I'll be writing in a name again. I think I'll vote for Netanyahu.

  4. #129
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Having classified documents in your possession alone isn't a crime and for a good reason -- every tiny memo gets classified because the US overclassifies everything. What happened to Brandon, that some memo or other gets overlooked, happens all the time. What is a crime is wilful retention and that's what Brandon was accused of.

    The argument isn't that he didn't obstruct justice, the argument is that he isn't guilty of wilful retention of classified documents, because, according to the report, 1) there isn't evidence to show he's guilty and 2) his version of events cannot be refuted.

    As for the other stuff, I don't personally care whether Brandon has all his marbles or not. As far as I'm concerned, he's the most boring president since Obama, if not even more boring, and has practically zero entertainment value -- which for me is the most important function of a US president apart from making us feel slightly better about our leaders. But I do find it entertaining how every little slip of tongue gets turned into some kind of a diagnosis, especially when Lord Dampnut is much worse in that regard, mispronouncing everyday words and confusing people and places as if there was some quota he had to fill every day.

  5. #130
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    About subtracting the jobs lost from those gained, did you miss where they already had been, mxleader? That's what Pyrian was talking about.

    What most amazes me is that Trump would somehow do better than Biden on the economy. How? He rode the coattails of Obama's economy in then rose the deficit all four years with his stupid cut taxes on the 1% bill. Is he going to lower gas prices? How? By allowing Canada to dump oil on Native American land on it's way to the gulf with the XL? By finding another US journalist to sacrifice to a Saudi prince? By allowing yet more drilling in National Parks? Maybe drill in Lincolns nose at Rushmore? No. But by sacrificing Ukraine and the hope of democracy for many emerging countries he might get Putin to lower his prices and get another fifty cents less. Is that the cost of your soul?

    Biden is doing as well as can be done right now without selling out our principles. We need more Democrats in congress to reverse the 1% favoring tax bill. We don't need Trump in to call people names, work morons into a neighbor killing frenzy, and make himself emperor and kill his enemies. Civil war will not work well for the economy.

    Have ANY of you been paying attention to facebooks "reels" section? Lot's of civil war wanting rednecks and roid ragers wanting civil war. Putin is loving that.

  6. #131
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2001
    Quote Originally Posted by Starker View Post
    Having classified documents in your possession alone isn't a crime and for a good reason -- every tiny memo gets classified because the US overclassifies everything. What happened to Brandon, that some memo or other gets overlooked, happens all the time. What is a crime is wilful retention and that's what Brandon was accused of.

    The argument isn't that he didn't obstruct justice, the argument is that he isn't guilty of wilful retention of classified documents, because, according to the report, 1) there isn't evidence to show he's guilty and 2) his version of events cannot be refuted.

    As for the other stuff, I don't personally care whether Brandon has all his marbles or not. As far as I'm concerned, he's the most boring president since Obama, if not even more boring, and has practically zero entertainment value -- which for me is the most important function of a US president apart from making us feel slightly better about our leaders. But I do find it entertaining how every little slip of tongue gets turned into some kind of a diagnosis, especially when Lord Dampnut is much worse in that regard, mispronouncing everyday words and confusing people and places as if there was some quota he had to fill every day.
    I think you need to re-read the report. He said Biden willfully kept and shared classified information in 2017 with his ghost writer, and that is, indeed, a federal crime. It is in violation of 18 US Code § 793(f). The same one Jack Smith is prosecuting Trump for violating by sharing information with people lacking the clearance to see it. This didn't happen when he was vice president, but when he was a private citizen in 2017. He declined to prosecute because he thought there was enough doubt that Biden would be found culpable (I find this questionable) due to his current mental capacity. But in 2017 he told the ghostwriter that he found classified material that he proceeded to share--accorsingnto thr aforementioned code that should have been returned immediately, and he is clearly in violation of that code by holding onto it for another 6 years.

    Tocky, I think reels are personalized by the almighty FB algorithms. I use Facebook for cycling, cooking, knifemaking and bushcraft. The only rednecks I've ever had pop up are usually talking about field dressing game or showing off their san mai blades. These are both areas that a redneck is worth hearing out. Those Arkansas boys can do some magic with venison and steel.

  7. #132
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2024
    Location: Egyptian Afterlife
    Ok rumor control, anyone can confirm or deny California's supposed economic disaster (like people in San Francisco living in the streets in tents, well, homeless, in parking lots) and massive migration going outside of the state (some people mentioned Mexican immigrants leaving for Mexico, hence no one left to pick up the crops), any truth to that situation?

    I know some people just tell me the most disparate things.

  8. #133
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Quote Originally Posted by Draxil View Post
    I think you need to re-read the report. He said Biden willfully kept and shared classified information in 2017 with his ghost writer, and that is, indeed, a federal crime. It is in violation of 18 US Code § 793(f). The same one Jack Smith is prosecuting Trump for violating by sharing information with people lacking the clearance to see it. This didn't happen when he was vice president, but when he was a private citizen in 2017. He declined to prosecute because he thought there was enough doubt that Biden would be found culpable (I find this questionable) due to his current mental capacity. But in 2017 he told the ghostwriter that he found classified material that he proceeded to share--accorsingnto thr aforementioned code that should have been returned immediately, and he is clearly in violation of that code by holding onto it for another 6 years.
    I think you need to re-read the report. He also said that there are other plausible explanations for why Brandon kept his notebooks. For example, he brings out a similar situation with Reagan, who also kept his handwritten diaries after leaving office believing he was allowed to do so, even though they contained top secret information.

    Contemporaneous evidence suggests that when Mr. Biden left office in 2017, he believed he was allowed to keep the notebooks in his home. In a recorded conversation with his ghostwriter in April 2017, Mr. Biden explained that, despite his staffs views to the contrary, he did not think he was required to turn in his notecards to the National Archives--where they were stored in a SCIF--and he had not wanted to do so. At trial, he would argue plausibly that he thought the same about his notebooks.
    If this is what Mr. Biden thought, we believe he was mistaken about what the law permits, but this view finds some support in historical practice. The clearest example is President Reagan, who left the White House in 1989 with eight years' worth of handwritten diaries, which he appears to have kept at his California home even though they contained Top Secret information. During criminal litigation involving a former Reagan administration official in 1989 and 1990, the Department of Justice stated in public court filings that the "currently classified" diaries were Mr. Reagan's "personal records." Yet we know of no steps the Department or other agencies took to investigate Mr. Reagan for mishandling classified information or to retrieve or secure his diaries. Most jurors would likely find evidence of this precedent and Mr. Biden's claimed reliance on it, which we expect would be admitted at trial, to be compelling evidence that Mr. Biden did not act willfully

    Also, everything in the report says that it doesn't warrant such a conclusion. Just let me quote directly (bolding mine)...

    However, for the reasons summarize below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Prosecution of Mr. Biden is also unwarranted based on our consideration of the aggravating and mitigating factors set forth in the Department of Justice's Principles of Federal Prosecution. For these reasons, we decline prosecution of Mr. Biden.
    In fact, all the evidence against him basically consists of Brandon saying he "found all the classified stuff" to his ghostwriter more than 8 years ago. Everything else is purely inference.

    Notably, the classified Afghanistan documents did not come up again in Mr. Biden's dozens of hours of recorded conversations with the ghostwriter, or in his book. And the place where the Afghanistan documents were eventually found in Mr. Biden's Delaware garage--in a badly damaged box surrounded by household detritus--suggests the documents might have been forgotten.
    And his cooperation with our investigation, including by reporting to the government that the Afghanistan documents were in his Delaware garage, will likely convince some jurors that he made an innocent mistake, rather than acting willfully--that is, with intent to break the law--as the statute requires.
    jurors may hesitate to place too much evidentiary weight on a single eight-word utterance to his ghostwriter about finding classified documents in Virginia, in the absence of other, more direct evidence. We searched for such additional evidence and found it wanting.
    In addition to this shortage of evidence, there are other innocent explanations for the documents that we cannot refute.
    So, not only is there no evidence of Brandon's wrongdoing, the accusers cannot even refute his version of events.

    Furthermore, there is no evidence Brandon knowingly shared classified information with his ghostwriter...

    We also considered whether Mr. Biden willfully disclosed national defense information to his ghostwriter by reading aloud certain classified notebook passages to the ghostwriter nearly verbatim on at least three occasions. Mr. Biden should have known that by reading his unfiltered notes about classified meetings in the Situation Room, he risked sharing classified information with his ghostwriter. But the evidence does not show that when Mr. Biden shared the specific passages with his ghostwriter, Mr. Biden knew the passages were classified and intended to share classified information.
    But the crux of the matter is that it is not the case that the report found Brandon guilty, but they refused to prosecute for some unfathomable reason. It is that they could not find evidence of his wrongdoing and in fact he fully cooperated with the investigators and gave all the stuff back. Y'know, pretty much the opposite of wilful retention.

    Lord Dampnut, however, not only refused to give the documents back, he also lied about it to the investigators. And he knowingly showed it to other people while saying he should not be doing that. Just read the indictment.

    Which, btw, is also addressed in the report:

    It is not our role to assess the criminal charges pending against Mr. Trump, but several material distinctions between Mr. Trump's case and Mr. Biden's are clear. Unlike the evidence involving Mr. Biden, the allegations set forth in the indictment of Mr. Trump, if proven, would present serious aggravating facts.
    Most notably, after being given multiple chances to return classified documents and avoid prosecution, Mr. Trump allegedly did the opposite. According to the indictment, he not only refused to return the documents for many months, but he also obstructed justice by enlisting others to destroy evidence and then to lie about it. In contrast, Mr. Biden turned in classified documents to the National Archives and the Department of Justice, consented to the search of multiple locations including his homes, sat for a voluntary interview. and in other ways cooperated with the investigation.
    Last edited by Starker; 12th Feb 2024 at 03:05.

  9. #134
    Having a president declared incompetent to stand trial would seem to confirm that the president is merely a figurehead. Don't you ever wonder who is really making the decisions behind the scenes? Or it doesn't bother anyone?

  10. #135
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2002
    Location: Point Nemo
    Quote Originally Posted by RippedPhreak View Post
    Having a president declared incompetent to stand trial would seem to confirm that the president is merely a figurehead. Don't you ever wonder who is really making the decisions behind the scenes? Or it doesn't bother anyone?
    I'm okay with the office of the President being more of a figurehead with veto power and not much else. Limiting the executive branch's power is how we stay free. Of course being declared incompetent has different meaning depending on whether you're talking about the aging Biden or the buffoon Trump.

  11. #136
    OK...but to look at it another way then: If the President is just a powerless puppet, why worry about Trump? If he did somehow regain the Oval Office he would only be able to sit there watching while the big corporations keep a firm hand on the tiller (just like today).

  12. #137
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    I really do not want a pawn of Putin shutting off aid to Ukraine for one. The Republican party quakes in their boots and does everything Trump says. Just look at how they had a border deal and quashed it so Trump had something to run on. All those immigrants who could have been stopped. It just goes to show that isn't what really matters to them.

  13. #138
    If the Dems wanted to stop migrants they could have done it sometime over the last 3 years. I mean, you don't see tent cities full of migrants sitting around in Chicago, NYC, Denver etc just because of some bill that was voted on last week. This was due to events happening for years.

    The "border deal" would not have stopped a single invader anyway. The bill specified that 5,000 invaders would still be allowed in per day which = 1.8 million a year. So what's the point of the bill? Just to hire more immigration judges to process them into the country faster? *slow clap*

  14. #139
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2001
    Location: under God's grace
    Quote Originally Posted by RippedPhreak View Post
    If the Dems wanted to stop migrants they could have done it sometime over the last 3 years.
    I think you might be mixing things up a bit here. It's not the Dems that [politically want*] to stop migrants, it's the Republicans. The Dems asked the Reps what they want, and they replied: "Border security." So the Dems were willing trade to also get the support package for Ukraine through. But even then speaker Johnson said: "Absolutely not." It seems that Trump told Johnson to block Ukraine support (and also border security) because he wants to campaign on border security. This is the kind of behavior from Trump that I don't appreciate. He's playing political games at a time like this, and he's unpredictable.

    Most of the support for Ukraine wouldn't even leave the US. It would be going to US defence contractors like Lockheed and Raytheon, thus helping the US economy.

    The "border deal" would not have stopped a single invader anyway.
    This is incorrect.

    The bill specified that 5,000 invaders would still be allowed in per day which = 1.8 million a year. So what's the point of the bill? Just to hire more immigration judges to process them into the country faster? *slow clap*
    If there are more than 5000 people coming in on any given day, the border will shutdown completely, not allowing anyone in.



    *I don't know what the term for this is, but I mean a political party working to accomplish something their voters want.

  15. #140
    If there are more than 5000 people coming in on any given day, the border will shutdown completely, not allowing anyone in.
    To use your phrasing, "this is incorrect." How would the government "shut down the border completely?" I don't see entire divisions of troops moving to the border with heavy equipment. They certainly won't be building a wall (that would be too Trumpish). So how would they shut it down? You're being fooled by an empty feel-good headline.

    The Republicans did say they wanted border security, and the Dems responded with "we might think about some security if we see 5,000 invaders per day." Their plan was probably to bring in 4,500 a day and smirk about how stupid the Republicans are. Plus because the walls are old, unguarded and have been cut in many places, thousands would sneak through that wouldn't even be counted as part of the 5,000.

  16. #141
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2001
    Location: LM's Dungeon
    There is more to this than we realize. All this bullshit, and that's what it is. For your viewing pleasure. They are only guarding eagle pass, last I heard. There is no way to fully close it, but, let's not kid ourselves by the headlines.
    Don't believe everything you hear and see.
    Last edited by BrokenArts; 12th Feb 2024 at 16:47.

  17. #142
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    The bill in the Senate was not some kind of a masterful ploy by the Democrats -- it was drafted by Republicans and contained basically everything they wanted -- billions of dollars for border security, more border patrol, more judges, more wall, automatic shutdowns when 5000 daily encounters* are passed, automatic deportations. If this bill was law, the border would already be shut down.

    * encounters doesn't simply mean "people coming into US", it means all the asylum applicants, all the people detained, etc.

    Republicans in the House torpedoed the bill for only one reason -- they want to keep this issue for the election. And it's not like it's a secret or something -- they are openly talking about it, that they don't want to give a win to Biden, etc.

    Jake Broe basically laid it all out in his border security / immigration video:


  18. #143
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2001
    Location: LM's Dungeon
    Republicans and Democrats, doesn't matter, we're screwed. I hope I'm wrong.

  19. #144
    You're right. Both parties are working together to loot the US and basically do a controlled demolition. Get ready because it's only getting worse from here.

  20. #145
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: The other Derry
    When the dollar is high and we have low unemployment, lots of people come here for work. When the dollar is low and it's hard to find a job, fewer people come. That's true regardless of who is in office and how many miles of border wall we have. If we actually wanted to discourage people from coming, we'd prosecute the people who illegally employ workers. But there is no way a Republican controlled legislature will do that because they represent businesses who make more money from the status quo. At the national level, Charles Koch and other big Republican donors are open borders guys. Trump has employed lots of illegal immigrants.

    Did you know that nearly 10% of Texas's workforce is illegal? How often do you hear of the Texas state government trying to prosecute a business owner for hiring illegally? They don't. The state will put up wall, floating barriers, razor wire, and other visible symbols to point to and say they are doing something, or transport people out of state in a bit of political theater. But it's all for show. The state's economy is dependent on illegal labor and the pols are controlled by the business owners. They're good at keeping you distracted while they make money.

  21. #146
    It never fails.

    Ripped Phreak: "BOTH parties are awful, they are looting and screwing over Americans."

    Some Doofus: "B-b-but look at your Republican "heroes," they are screwing you over! Betcha didn't think about that, smart guy!"

    Ripped Phreak: "I said...BOTH. PARTIES, ARE. EVIL. How was I not clear?"

    Some Doofus: "Yeah keep defending the Republicans you love, they sure got you fooled!"

    Ripped Phreak: "......."

  22. #147
    Member
    Registered: Sep 2001
    Location: The other Derry
    I'm not so stupid as to believe that you are neutral. Besides, you said above that Republicans wanted border security. My point is, they don't. The people who control the party via their donations profit from the cheap labor and lack of enforcement. They can pay illegal workers below market wages with no benefits, often off the books so there are no taxes or paperwork, make them work in unsafe conditions, and generally ignore a lot of labor laws because illegal workers don't dare complain, especially in places where the cops are friendly to the business owners.

    The two parties are not the same on immigration. The progressive wing of the Democratic party is naive and idealistic. They're getting a wake-up call right now because the sanctuary cities are out of housing. The Republican party is two-faced. In public they pander to working class voter fears, but in private they are paying illegal workers under the table and don't want to stop. We will not see a well managed immigration system in this country until both sides agree it should be well managed, and right now the Republican party is the one preventing that.

  23. #148
    Member
    Registered: May 2004
    Location: Canuckistan GWN
    Quote Originally Posted by RippedPhreak View Post
    "I said...BOTH. PARTIES, ARE. EVIL. How was I not clear?"
    Don't worry, sparky, your false equivalents are crystal clear. So is the difference between the sporadic self-dealing of some members from both parties, and the wholesale, deliberate, country-killing, election stealing, body autonomy stealing grifts of the Magatrumpians (of which you are clearly a card carrying member). Your POE is weak.

  24. #149
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2024
    Location: Egyptian Afterlife
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sta...en-from-office

    State attorney general officially calls on Kamala Harris to invoke 25th Amendment, remove Biden from office
    West Virginia AG Patrick Morrisey: Biden's 'serious mental missteps have equally serious consequences'
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/mee...n-replacements

    Meet 5 Democrats who have been floated as possible Biden replacements
    President facing increased scrutiny over questions surrounding his mental stamina
    1. California Gov. Gavin Newsom
    2. Vice President Harris
    3. Former first lady Michelle Obama
    4. Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer
    5. Kentucky Gov. Andy Beshear
    I don't remember, I don't recall.


    EDIT
    Yeah I know the Attorney General is Republican, and fox news isn't exactly "reliable" and if I recall correctly is also Republican?
    But it was the only mainstream media outlet I could find on the subject, the others were smaller and even more unreliable.
    Last edited by DuatDweller; 14th Feb 2024 at 05:27. Reason: reliability

  25. #150
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: The Plateaux Of Mirror
    Mitt knows what's up


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