TTLG|Jukebox|Thief|Bioshock|System Shock|Deus Ex|Mobile
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 57

Thread: WE'RE GOING

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.

    WE'RE GOING

    We're going back to the moon. We never should have stopped. I recall the last mission, Apollo 17. It was so commonplace by then folks had quit watching and were complaining about the coverage cutting into their soaps and other worthless programs. Not me. I watched from my hospital bed. I had a cyst nodule come up in a lymph node that they had to cut off the side of my jaw so I laid in bed and watched it start to finish. And on some pretty decent drugs too.

    I love the space program. We've got to get out of this place... if it's the last thing we ever dooooooo. We belong in the stars. Don't you feel that? We need to populate the universe. Okay, maybe not the anti vaxxers, but those who understand science. And if we die out before we can then it's still a noble undertaking. We went down swinging. And the next swing is Artemis. The new SLS Orion engine puts out 8.8 million pounds of thrust. That's 15% more than the Saturn V. The earth is going to shake people. And I'm going to be there.

    We are heading down to Cape Canaveral by way of highways 95 then 1 along the coast of Georgia from Savannah. There are a couple of light houses along the way we might see before we stop at New Smyrna beach. And then it's the anticipation oh god the anticipation till about three in the morning when we wake up and shower to drive down to Playalinda beach. We have a foldable beach wagon, not unlike the moon buggy, we are going to deploy filled with sunscreen, umbrellas, water and soda on ice, some snacks, folding chairs, and the like to drag .9 miles down the sand to the fence which is the closest viewing point. Closer than the stands at the space center or observation gantry. If any crackhead tries to rob us in that distance I will gut them like a fish and hide their body in the marsh. I will see this launch. It may be the only one I get to see.

    Artemis one. It will be unmanned. It will go around the moon just to test the systems. That's okay. At least if it blows up I won't see anyone die. With manned missions there is always the possibility. Good and true and noble men and women have died to further the cause of science. They knew how important it was. They are true heroes. It will go forward. WE will go forward as a species even if it does blow up on the pad. We will learn and push and nothing will stop us. We will land on the moon. Again. We will use it as a stepping stone to Mars. I may not see it but most of you will. I already envy you. We have to go all the way. I don't give a shit if it's at the cost of our DNA, we have to one day see the stars as... something... Waterbear/human hybrid I don't care. We have to. We must have the universe. We must understand it all. We must see the last light wink out in the cold dead final entropy. We must know. I don't give a shit why and you can't tell me we can't.

    I will feel the air pressure change. I will hear the roar. I will see the sand shake the footprints level. WE ARE GOING.

  2. #2
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Awesome! Enjoy.

    I want humanity to go to the stars, but I'm not convinced now is the right time, honestly. We need resource extraction and industry on the Moon and then Mars - preferably self-sustaining, or at least mostly self-sustaining. (E.g. making advanced chips locally might be a bridge too far, but at least those can be imported at relatively low weight and last a long time.) I think that would be done more efficiently, robotically.

  3. #3
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2020
    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrian View Post
    Awesome! Enjoy.

    I want humanity to go to the stars, but I'm not convinced now is the right time, honestly. We need resource extraction and industry on the Moon and then Mars - preferably self-sustaining, or at least mostly self-sustaining. (E.g. making advanced chips locally might be a bridge too far, but at least those can be imported at relatively low weight and last a long time.) I think that would be done more efficiently, robotically.
    A good goal would be a lunar space elevator. The engineering for that is much more trivial than an Earth based space elevator.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_space_elevator

    You need a large counterweight above the stationary point for the elevator, relative to the mass of the cable+payload, but those could be anything you like, such as habitats, space docks, engineering, solar collectors. etc.

    "to the stars" is clearly pie in the sky if you don't have engineering capacity in space already.
    Last edited by Cipheron; 21st Aug 2022 at 06:52.

  4. #4
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrian View Post
    Awesome! Enjoy.

    I want humanity to go to the stars, but I'm not convinced now is the right time, honestly. We need resource extraction and industry on the Moon and then Mars - preferably self-sustaining, or at least mostly self-sustaining. (E.g. making advanced chips locally might be a bridge too far, but at least those can be imported at relatively low weight and last a long time.) I think that would be done more efficiently, robotically.
    "If you have built castles in the air, your work need not be lost; there is where they should be. Now put foundations under them."- Thoreau. This is but one of many stones. Our detour was the shuttle missions to advance communications, GPS, and weather forecast. That was the logical infrastructure advancement needed then. This foray is a testing for further missions with other testing. It isn't just going to the moon. There is always boundary pushing and learning (also learning the effects on our new chip tech). For what you said to come to pass this must happen first. I'm happy to see it now. I want it continuous.

    That elevator from the moon seems a much more logical one than from the earth. Less gravity and no air pressure so not the wear and tear as well. Too bad our moon is not geosynchronous like Charon is with Pluto. But then we wouldn't have the tides and I'm not sure what no shifting pull against the crust would change. Anyway, there is no power to change it so we have to work with what we have.

    Edit: Am I wrong in thinking electromagnetism loss and loss of atmosphere with a geosynchronous moon?
    Last edited by Tocky; 21st Aug 2022 at 13:19.

  5. #5
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2019
    Location: Deepest Sussex, England
    > … If any crackhead tries to rob us in that distance I will gut them like a fish and hide their body in the marsh. I will see this launch.
    HaHa. I hope it goes really well. Sounds like you have a very good plan.

    In the Summer of ‘69 I was working in Manhattan and a couple of us went down town (it must have been a Saturday) to see the ticker-tape welcome home for the first Moon astronauts. We got there really early and took spots as close as we could get to a platform where they were going to be. Soon, others came along behind and around us and pretty soon we could hardly move. As always there were a few loudmouths who pushed and shouted as though they owned the place, but we were OK, we were right at the front. Nobody could get in front of us. Unfortunately we didn’t anticipate a load of TV crews who arrived somewhat late, casually wheeling several pieces of tall equipment which they set up on the other side of the barriers, indifferent to lots of angry shouting from the crowd. Not only couldn’t we move, we couldn’t see a thing either.

    Edit: Your post and enthusiasm got me reading. According to Wikipedia there may even be a crew of sorts ... ‘Artemis I will carry a mannequin, "Captain Moonikin Campos" (named after Arturo Campos, an engineer who played a major role in resolving the emergency that occurred during the Apollo 13 mission), alongside NASA's Snoopy and ESA's Shaun the Sheep.’
    Last edited by Aged Raver; 21st Aug 2022 at 14:49.

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2001
    Location: Ireland
    I would have named the thread "WE'RE GOIN' BACK"


  7. #7
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2020
    Quote Originally Posted by Tocky View Post
    Too bad our moon is not geosynchronous like Charon is with Pluto. But then we wouldn't have the tides and I'm not sure what no shifting pull against the crust would change. Anyway, there is no power to change it so we have to work with what we have.

    Edit: Am I wrong in thinking electromagnetism loss and loss of atmosphere with a geosynchronous moon?
    How you're thinking of it would be dwarfed by how much closer the moon would need to be for that to happen.

    "Geosynchronous" is a set height: 35,786 kilometers above the surface. Things don't get to orbit slow or fast, they always orbit at a set speed depending on how far away they are (mostly based on the mass of the Earth).

    So the moon would be 10 times closer and 100 times the size in the sky, and be above one location on Earth. So *intense* solar eclipses there every lunch time, and 100 times the moonlight at night. The moon's gravitational pull would also be 100 times as strong (inverse square law) so yeah, whichever location was lucky enough to get the moon would be underwater.
    Last edited by Cipheron; 22nd Aug 2022 at 05:09.

  8. #8
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    Ah. I was not aware that geosynchronous had a distance/mass component but now that you say so it makes sense. We can't change either anyway. Having said that, it does seem such a fragile dance of so many things that came together to make and support life, much less us. It would be a shame to not try and spread this happenstance elsewhere.

    I would have said "going back" except then the phrase wouldn't have pulled double duty with my wife and I also "going". I've never been, never seen a rocket launch, and I've always wanted to. As it is it has to be sandwiched between finding out my mother in laws biopsy results and being home to take care of my daughters' animals while she takes her husband to a Braves game. Also the weather has to hold out. It has a 62 % chance of rain. Not sure if it matters depending on how much. The backup dates of Sept. 2nd and 5th are problematic. I absolutely cannot make the 5th.

    There are estimated to be one hundred thousand people going and I want to be one of them. I can't wait another three years till Artemis 2 & 3. Although I might go for those too. If it is scrubbed this time I'm going nuts. But "best laid plans" eh Aged Raver?

    Nice song Nameless, the words fit how I feel, but this is my energy right now-



    Not the best sound quality but the only one I could find where I actually was there.

  9. #9
    ZylonBane
    Registered: Sep 2000
    Location: ZylonBane
    Quote Originally Posted by Cipheron View Post
    So the moon would be 10 times closer and 100 times the size in the sky, and be above one location on Earth.
    Being over the same spot all day would be a geostationary orbit.

  10. #10
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2020
    Quote Originally Posted by ZylonBane View Post
    Being over the same spot all day would be a geostationary orbit.
    Yeah, you're right sorry. It could be for example. a polar orbit, I was just thinking of equatorial orbits.

    However, when Tocky originally said "geosynchronous" he probably did mean "geostationary" in context: i.e. the whole benefit is supposed to be that the moon is stationary relative to some place on the surface. Which does mean both geosynchronous and orbiting exactly on the equator.
    Last edited by Cipheron; 23rd Aug 2022 at 18:28.

  11. #11
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    Quote Originally Posted by ZylonBane View Post
    Being over the same spot all day would be a geostationary orbit.
    With one small correction, if I may, if an object is geostationary it is also geosynchronous and thus I was not wrong. Anyway, that was not the smarty pants answer I was looking for. What I wanted to know was how much such a thing would, though it made a ground to moon elevator possible if bendy stretchy and segment addable to account for the constant drift, also reduce the electromagnetic field and totally fuck us. And yes, yes, geosynchronous isn't necessarily geostationary.

    In any event, it's just a distraction from my worrying over the trip. I have no premonitions of danger or anything like that but I do worry about traffic and whether or not we may get a parking spot near. That's why I want to leave at 3 AM. We can always sleep on an air mattress once we get there in the back of the Expedition if the heat isn't too bad and I don't actually have to bury any would be thieves in the marsh.

    Does anyone have any advice? Has anyone been to a launch? Is there anything I'm not foreseeing? Sunscreen, chairs, snacks, drinks, umbrellas, rain ponchos, lens cover extension, ear plugs, cap, alarm clock, a full tank, a full phone charge, new sim card, anything else? I've travelled the route on google maps using the little man and only the turn onto Kennedy drive is a tad obscure. Well, the turn on 1 from the hotel is also not well marked but I've little manned it to that point too. It's freaking Daytona 500 weekend Saturday but maybe those bastards will be heading the other way by the time I pull in. I should check the water in the radiator overflow. The alternator is new so that won't go out. It's been a while since I changed brake pads. Shit the battery is about four years old. Ugh. I don't feel anything going wrong yet though.

    I had wanted to go on down the Keyes to Hemmingway's house but not enough time this trip.

  12. #12
    El Pato
    Registered: Jul 2000
    Location: Under your fingernails.
    Fly me to the Moon...

  13. #13
    Moderator
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: NeoTokyo
    I outlined a novel (actually a series) about the moon race.
    It's funny because it follows a lot of the beats of For All Mankind, the tv show, actually kind of disturbingly so, but I think my version can still stand independently. My version has one little difference that made the stakes a lot higher and the drama a lot bigger, but even with that I played it straight, I mean, as in it's based on history exactly as it was in the 1960s on-wards, mutatis mutandis with the little change.

    I'm kind of surprised, as far as I know no one has played out this idea and connected it to real history.
    Anyway, long story short I studied a lot about that period of the space race for that story.
    It's not probably hard to guess what the hook is, but anyway the working title is By the Shores of Tranquility.

    It'll be interesting following this. Be nice to see our closest neighbor in a lot more detail.
    It's so close to us, it's actually scandalous how little we've explored it up close.
    All that said, the one I'll be really interested in seeing is when they send a lander to one of the outer planet moons.
    That'll be the day!

  14. #14
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2019
    Location: Deepest Sussex, England
    > ... Is there anything I'm not foreseeing?

    Looks like everything's covered. These days when I go anywhere I try to go with empty bladder in case there aren’t nearby toilets (or long queues). But if it’s marsh land ... A pair of strong boots?

    I see there’s an Artemis Web Cast so I’ll be watching. How far away from the action do you think you’ll be? If you've got a humongous pole and flag on your moon buggy I’ll look out for you. Mind you, if there's 100,000 going there could be loads of flags ... Perhaps a giant inflatable banana. Seriously it looks like you're well prepared. Improvisation on the day will cover anything else.

  15. #15
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    The sea is a friend in such situations as well. That only requires braving the sharks these days. I doubt the web cast will cover those on the beach but if it does I'll be the old bearded hippy in the NASA T shirt grinning from ear to ear. I've loved NASA since I was a little boy. I've watched every mission. I've followed every exploit. I've hoped for this for so long.

    It's not just going to the moon. It's that it is a stepping stone to Mars. I had so hoped we would be farther along. There were plans to be. Did you know that? They teased for so long. The show "For All Mankind" is based on much of it. That moon base was a plan in the seventies. The time we bombed the south pole? I joked that we poked it in the ice hole. But we had to know. The resultant plume showed a spectrometer reading of water. We got distracted with low budgets leading to other missions. I'm not so certain they were wrong. We needed the things that interval brought us. But now we are going back. Back to the dream.

    I'm fairly certain I'm not going to see it. Like Bradbury it will be out of reach for me. But it won't for mankind. That is enough. That will soothe my soul. Some of you may see it. I'm happy for you. I want to know we will rise above all the bullshit and do what is good and true and right as a species. Nothing else will do. There is no substitute. No political evangelical oil company science denying bullshit. Just science. Just those who make me proud to be human giving every ounce of brainpower and even their lives to further our advancement to the place we should be... in the stars.

    I want to believe that. I have to believe that. And I will be cheering loudest.

  16. #16
    Member
    Registered: Dec 2020
    Quote Originally Posted by Tocky View Post
    We got distracted with low budgets leading to other missions. I'm not so certain they were wrong. We needed the things that interval brought us.
    I'm not too sure about that logic. It would be equivalent to, for example, imagine investment in computers in 1980 crashed and never recovered, and computers stayed as big clunky mainframes with terminals, then in that alternative future you're trying to explain the idea of the internet to people as why we should invest in computers, but they still can't envision it other than as terminals logging into some big central computer.

    So similarly, when we say "there were plans for a moon base in the 1970s" it's wrong to just envision them building a whole moon base just with 1970s tech, just as you can't explain the 1980s PC boom leading up to widespread internet access, to someone who's only thinking in 1970s computer technology terms. The plans themselves would have fueled the research and creation of technology and manufacturing capacities we have no idea about.
    Last edited by Cipheron; 25th Aug 2022 at 05:04.

  17. #17
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    We had to have the satellites the 80's brought us by way of the shuttle program. And having Gates and Jobs bring computers into the competitive arena boosted their output and storage. As far as the moon base goes, we certainly could have built it with 70's tech. Airtight aluminum sections age well in a non-corrosive environment. An update or two through the years and you are good to go. But all in all things likely happened as they had to. My main gripe is that they should have happened faster. But then, I didn't help, did you? Had there been a rockets not bombs box to check on my taxes I certainly would have picked it.

    Electing Trump sure brought down my expectations for our future. Artemis will help my feelings considerably.

  18. #18
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2019
    Location: Deepest Sussex, England

    Turn Left at the Moon

    > … we are going back. Back to the dream. I'm fairly certain I'm not going to see it.

    Well… an advert from a couple of years ago, but the vehicle might interest you, it’s a Van Morrison with autopilot.



    These two are in London in 4 weeks, with Josh and Carson and Mary Spender but the show has been marked “sold out” all year so I won’t be going. It seems all tickets for a 2021 show that were cancelled due to lockdown are valid for the new date, but no extra dates added. Probably just as well. I’d be too excited.

  19. #19
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    WE'RE NOT GOING. The biopsy on my mother-in-law turned into three biopsies and a "we don't know what the hell it is but it is rare". Last night she took a turn for the worse. She isn't getting the oxygen she needs and may well be dying. There is a mass on one of her lungs. They have her sedated and haven't told us a damn thing so far. For the past eight years they had her diagnosed as COPD without checking anything else. All that time it must have been growing.

    My wife looked at me and asked was there anyone else I could go with to see Artemis take off. No. I'm not going to leave her at a time like this.

    "... gang aft agley and leave us naught but grief and pain for promised joy." Maybe there will be an Artemis two and three and twenty. I hope so. I just have this terrible feeling this was my one shot to be there for it.

  20. #20
    Member
    Registered: Mar 2005
    Location: Netherlands
    Sorry to hear that Tocky, good on you for supporting your wife, even if that means missing an event you were looking forward to. Best of luck to all involved, and I wish all family members lots of comfort and strength if the time should come to say goodbye to a loved one.

  21. #21
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    Thanks Harvester. It has been a depressing kick in the gut all around.

  22. #22
    Member
    Registered: Jun 2019
    Location: Deepest Sussex, England
    I’m truly sorry to read that. I know you mentioned your Mother-in-Law a few days ago. It sounds like you and your wife are a very good team. Artemis can look after itself. Strength and good luck to all the family for whatever is coming.

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered: Feb 2002
    Location: In the flesh.
    Thanks Raver. I try to hide the fact that I'm screaming inside. It's a type of squamous carcinoma. What pisses me off most is it could have been caught years ago and fixed but now it is such a mass that I don't know if it can. Her doctor stuck with the COPD diagnosis without a thorough examination for so long. I'm angry and hurt and, despite how I should feel, I'm still so disappointed I can't see Artemis take off. I love my mother-in-law. Rena jokes that she takes my side instead of hers in our arguments and it's true. I don't mean to be petty. Her life is way more important than seeing a liftoff I've waited years for but I can't help but feel as if life has purposely kicked me square in the balls. The timing is too dead on to think otherwise.

    Nevertheless I have done the adult thing while the child inside me kicks and screams. I've held her hand and told her we are not going and will be here for her.

    I did think of this song all afternoon though.



    And naturally I'm dealing with it in my usual way, by copious self medication of alcohol. I hope I don't feel too bad on the drive to the hospital in the morning but I need this now. Nevermind the times I have no excuse.

    So help me life better not do that to me. I have to go out saving that busload of school kids. It can't be in a hospital bed.

  24. #24
    BANNED
    Registered: Apr 2022
    Location: Eureka Springs currently
    Tocky:

    Ever seen the movie The Right Stuff? It's my favorite movie (and I'm not all that into movies—this is a GOOD movie) —about the American space program in the 1960s. Actually, it covers history from the 50s when Chuck Yeager for the first time in history broke the sound barrier in the experimental plane called the X-1, continues to cover the Mercury program with the Redstone rockets, then the Gemini program with the Atlas rockects. With the first American astronauts of the space program (a.k.a. "space race"): John Glenn, Alan Shepard, Gus Grissom…

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Right_Stuff_(film)

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086197/

    If you've never seen that movie, then please, as an enthusiast of the space program and someone who wishes to explore the stars, you need to watch that movie. It's not only historical but it's actually what I would call historical comedy— the movie will make you laugh and piss yourself, I swear. Best movie ever made. Period.

    And I wish you luck going to the stars to preserve humanity through this seemingly total self-annihilation that we humans have fostered here on Earth, destroying our planet without an apparent clue as to what we were doing (humans aren't long-term thinkers). I hope you will be one of the ones who survives the filter. I won't be. I work a low-paying job as a dishwasher and fantasies of exploring other planets are out of the question for me. But for you, good luck. I pray and believe in our species, by which I mean, I believe we humans will do what it takes to evolve and adapt beyond human to plant the necessity that we will continue as some consciousness, in whatever form, as we humans are only one chapter in the universe's progressive task to know itself. There will be no death or lost memory, everything will be known and manifest for eternity.

  25. #25
    Member
    Registered: Aug 2004
    Aw man I'm so sorry. Every part of that sucks.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •