I mentioned this a couple of posts ago. A proper third dimension probably would have helped in making the locations look more like actual places, but I guess that back then no one even thought about aiming for "realism" when it came to the locations. Even Wolfenstein 3D could have had maps that look like interior of a fictional German castle, but they chose to go for something a lot more gamey. Doom and probably every other FPS at the time followed the same path - the maps are full of silly traps and mazes and lava pits and all sorts of things that just don't make much sense. The first FPS that I can think of with somewhat real looking maps is Duke Nukem 3D.Originally Posted by Thirith
Thinking about it now, it's quite odd really how the mindset in game design was so different at the time. Even Doom was initially going to have a score counter and everything.
btw, Magic Carpet was better than both Doom and Descent.
It's not that they "chose" to make the maps more gamey than realistic, it's that they put together the tools as well as the engine and then made a bunch of "Does this work?", "Wouldn't it be cool if?" and "This looks neat/thematic/awesome in the editor" levels. It's not like anyone had much experience making levels that looked good in first person at the time.
Yeah, there was nobody who was doing Ultima Underworld levels of realism at the time. Except, of course, Ultima Underworld.
Speaking of Wolf and Doom and Underworld, this conversation reminds of a game called ShadowCaster, from some upstart studio named Raven Software. It's like a proper halfway point between Wolf and Ultima Underworld, and the engine Carmack wrote for it eventually led to what id used in Doom. I remember being put off by its oppressive and restrictive, Wolf3D-ish labyrinths as a kid, but I think I'd fare better with appreciating it today.
Woah, childhood memory unlocked, I'd completely forgotten that game existed. We got it with our first PC and I was into anything with even a faint whiff of an RPG so I put quite a bit of time into it, but I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing and never got anywhere. We also got Ultima Underworld and Ultima 7 as pack-ins so ShadowCaster's fate was sealed. Might be interesting to give it another try, although while I'm better at figuring things out these days I haven't exactly grown more patient with aggravating game design.
Yeah, it was one of the games along with Heretic/Hexen that used to make me violently ill and end up with a splitting headache after even 15-30 minutes of playing, so I was never able to get into it.
Must have been something about the Raven engine implementation, cause I was completely (or at least mostly) fine with Wolf 3D, Doom, Duke Nukem, Blood, and Redneck Rampage.
Last edited by Starker; 14th Sep 2024 at 07:01.
Did the pack-ins come courtesy of a SoundBlaster, by chance? Because that's exactly how the friend who loaned me the disks got all of those, as well. I still remember the smell of those glossy paper manuals.
There was nothing better to me than going to a computer store and browsing all the PC games on the shelves and getting help from unshaven and unshowered computer enthusiasts who never slept and had more knowledge in their heads than the computers they were selling. Then you'd take those games home and open them up and get that blast of new cardboard, freshly printed game user manuals and plastic CD/DVD case in your face. Then it was a coin toss to whether the game would be an quick and easy install or if you'd have to consult forums or make an actual phone call to someone for help. Downloading a game from Steam is still exciting but not in the same way.
The very same! Found a picture of the CD; pretty amazing collection for a freebie. I have this extremely heavy IKEA bag full of random old game and demo CDs that I've been lugging around through every move even though I haven't even looked inside for 20 years, so I probably still have it stashed away there. I don't even have a disc drive anymore, but can't make myself get rid of them.
Edit: better pictures with the case and a PDF of the manuals, mine wasn't the fancy blue CD though so they must've had slightly different editions for different regions
Last edited by reizak; 14th Sep 2024 at 13:44.
I'm trying to remember the last game I even bought in a box / CD case.
I'm pretty sure it was Dishonored which Google is telling me was released in 2012.
Didn't even realize it's been that long.
An interesting thing I like to do is I like to keep my original install from the CD for new computers, at least for the classics. So instead of just re-getting the game on GOG or Steam, I'll literally copy all the files over with a crack to a new computer just so I can keep hold of something that was once a real thing I could touch. Does anyone else do that; that's not obsessive is it?
Last edited by demagogue; 14th Sep 2024 at 13:34.
Strange, I've never even heard of ShadowCaster before. It looks like an advanced version of The Catacomb Abyss, another early classic. I only just found out that Catacomb is even older than Wolf 3D!
Yeah, and of course the technical limitations were a big factor too. But surely they could have tried to make something a bit more realistic. Slap some different textures on the wall, computer screens and random electronic gadgets, make the rooms a bit smaller, add a few really simple objects here and there, and I bet that'd be more realistic. Or maybe they tried exactly that (that would fall in your "Does this work?" category) and it wasn't fun at all.
The maps in Doom were clearly designed to be fun, while immersion and realism took a back seat. I mean, I don't think I ever imagined that I'm in some research lab on Mars while playing Doom. I never imagined anything really. The Doom maps are just video game levels. There's nothing wrong with that, but I think that the levels would be more memorable if they felt a bit more like real places.
I still use the original CDs for installs but I also backed everything up to a external hard drive just in case.
I had a small shrine set up in my last apartment:
Nice! Thanks for the link, the PDF is appreciated and bringing back my memories too. Some great games on there, with one of the GOATs (Ultima VII: The Black Gate), and I remember Space Hulk, Chuck Yeager's, and Populous II. Good times. Wing Commander Academy was a pretty good adjunct to WC2 as well, it was just gauntlet runs but neat all the same. I still have my old CDs too, they ain't going anywhere.
While I'm playing T2X: Shadows of the Metal Age, I also realise that I need a game on the side where I can jump in and have some fun without having to commit too much of my attention and energy - so I finally installed Far Cry 4. I've only just done the intro sequence so far, so I can't say anything about the game, but hey, it's an Ubisoft open world game, so I'm pretty sure I know what to expect. It's very well possible I'll not play this beginning to end, but it may be just what I need after 8-9 hours of work as the days become shorter and darker. And if it doesn't hit the spot, well, the game's quickly uninstalled.
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