A Secret Affair - by Aisha

[kfgecko]

Aisha, thanks for contributing your mission. I played it this evening and I had a good time. Nice and clean architecture, nice story to give weight to the mission.

I'm guessing you're a girl, like Jonquil? Something feels familiar with Inheritance... something in the style or feel. Dunno.

Few things though:
- I found a key suspended in midair of the back yard (your master editor key?). I piled some boxes up and climbed up the wall and leaned out to make that key mine. Heh.
- The servant male doesn't ko from the bj until after he's ran to the shed; is he on "absolute" instead of "high priority"?


Lastly, I'm STUCK! Ack! I found the lady's switch and I *hear* a door slide open, but I can't find where it is. I did find the secret downstairs though (with her letter). Hints?



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"I'll poke 'im with my sword until he goes, 'oops! I'm dead!' Ha! See? No one'll mess with ol' Benny."
My Thief 1 missions: Bloodstone Prison and The Library

[aisha]

First of all, I'm glad you liked it
Hmm, the key, I should have placed it somewhere else indeed (stupid mistake), it's a master key, but it was never the intention that people whould stack up boxes to climb over the wall, there's absolutely nothing to do over there
The servant, I put him on absolute, so you're forced to be really quiet and not to wake him up. If you really want to blackjack him, it's possible while he's still sleeping
In the bedroom with the lady (minor spoiler):


just do a little floor searching

[aisha]

Oh yes, I forgot to mention, I'm female. I'm curious what exactly made you think it has a "female touch"?

[kfgecko]

Thanks, I completed it on expert too. It's the treasure huntin' that's cool in this mission!

I was very proud of myself to find the tiara.

Oh, and maybe it was just subliminal that I had a feeling you were a girl. Knowing that GOING INTO probably just made me feel that way, but now that I think about it, there's no good evidence.

Maybe it's the choice of wall paper.

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Hmmm... include Benny, include Benny, how can I include Benny in my mission?
My Thief 1 missions: Bloodstone Prison and The Library

[Despot]

There's definitely something unique, I've noticed the very same thing myself. It seems to affect the style of posting, too. 9 times out of 10 you can tell whether a the user is a woman just by reading the post. The message is the same, the words are the same, but there's something there that writes "lady" all over it. Very mysterious. Must be a subliminal thing. Or maybe the wallpaper.

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'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.

[aisha]

I agree, it must have something to do with the wallpaper, I mean, not the wallpaper itself, but the way women have more "eye" for decorating things? (hehe, don't want to start a discussion here) When I chose my textures, I always wanted them to match, the colors and patterns, adjusting and stuff like that. But this takes a lot of time of course, putting them on and going into the game to check if it was the effect I desired. I can understand when someone builds a huge level, it's hard to spend a lot of time on details like that, but as far as I'm concerned, this was the biggest fun I had when I created my mission, because that was the easiest part
Still I only know a small part of the way dromed works, but I hope to learn a lot more when I start working with dromed 2 (with a little help from all you people around here).

[Growler]

People once thought James Tiptree Jr. was a man, based on writing style. . . .

[Ithel]

Aisha, WOW! I finally played your mission today. Although it is on the small side, the place feels very real. Your architecture and eye for details could give Mokkis a run for his money. The fountain looks great. I love all the secret levers and doors (you did a great job disguising secret doors, btw). I'm still looking for the bracelet, but from your comments above, I'm pretty close. You have lots of wonderful details in this one.

If you update this mission, could you please add room brushes to the empty streets outside the mansion? Kinda quiet out there. (And some of the walls there have sky texture.)

Thanks for the fun mission.

[This message has been edited by Ithel (edited May 04, 2000).]

[Bruny]

Hee hee. Did *everyone* who played this mission climb those walls into the fake streets like I did? Just goes to show, never underestimate the determined Thief player!

Bruny (who's checking her spelling, grammar and punctuation VERY carefully)

[Llewelyn Amadeus]

I haven't played this mission but the comments I've read here certainly contradict those in the review here: http://www.thief-darkproject.com/mis...bronze/affair/

[Myoldnamebroke]

Wow! Critical. Was GayleSaver in a bad mood when that was written? I beta tested this one, and I loved the feel of the level. I found it too easy, rather than too hard. The mission is small, but that's the only one of the comments I agree with.

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Hammer, Anvil, Forge and Fire Chase away the hoofed liar.
Hoof and doorway, Block and Beam, Chase the Trickster from our dream

Leader and founder of the SPCL. Join today!

[Llewelyn Amadeus]

This is why I don't really like the reviews at t-dp.com. Just because one person didn't like the mission, A Secret Affair will forever rest in the Bronze Hammer section. Personally, I've never played any missions from that section just because I don't have a lot of time to play. So I figure I'll play the good ones in the Silver Section. Makes sense doesn't it?
I just wonder how many gems there are in the Bronze section and how many Silver rating deserve Bronze. I think either the fate of a mission should not be left in the hands of one reviewer, or the Bronze/Silver/Gold sectioning should be done away with. What's wrong with percentages or "out-of-ten"?

[Avalon]

Perhaps there should be an official 'reviewing staff' of some sort. Some of these reviews are very... off, IMHO.
I thought this particular mission was worth a silver.

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Beware the coming of the machines...
Check out my Tutorials on creating the Soulforge Machinery, all with working demos included.
Coming Soon
The Children of Chaos, a FM featuring the Keepers and their struggle with the lasting legacy of Karras...
The Sanctum

[Ithel]

I just checked out the review and have to say I completely disagree with it. If you want a small, well-designed mission you can finish in under an hour, this is the mission for you. I really enjoyed the mission (and I finally found the bracelet). As the review notes, some of the special effects have been seen before. But I certainly wouldn't say these had been "ripped off" from other fan missions. So is the reviewer implying no one can have lantern-carrying guards because someone else figured out how to do them first? That's crazy!

If this is what Aisha can do on her first try, I can't wait to see what she has in store for us!

[Bruny]

I disagree with anybody who says it was "too small." Yes, it was a small mission, and as a small mission it was EXCELLENTLY designed. More people should take this approach to their first Thief FM. Take on what you can handle, learn something in the process, make it tight and self-contained. In fact aisha wasn't sure whether to release it as a "real" mission or not exactly because she knew it was small. I was one of the playtesters who encouraged her to take the dive. She'd learn a lot from the reviews and comments.

I wish more authors would take this approach to their first missions. I prefer small and satisfying to large, grotesque, clumsy and ugly!

[aisha]

Pfffff, what a huge disappointment, reading that review. Fortunately, you guys and girls around here don't take this too seriously. It's only been a first attempt, and I was sure it wouldn't deserve silver, but I spent a lot of time working on it, trying to understand the program bit by bit. I had some good feedback from a few people outside this forum too. Of course, it IS small, and if I would start it again, I would plan it a lot better. And I don't understand the critic about the locked gate, what does he mean when saying the lock is drawn on?
Anyway, I won't let one bad review keep me away from my second mission I just started with dromed 2, playing Thief 2 gave me some fresh ideas, and although story telling isn't one of my best talents, I hope to come up with a mission that deserves at least one silver hammer.
Thx for your support all!

[Myoldnamebroke]

It's not worthy of a silver hammer. I'm not being harsh, but there's no way I'd mistake it for an OM (or have we stopped using that?). But the review was WAY out. I really liked the mission. Oh, and aisha - go back to t-dp.com. Dan's put up a second opinion.

And as for gems in the Bronzes - yes, lots. Before the reviews got out of hand, they really were silver = om quality. So there are many good missions in Bronze. Last good one there I tried was Temple of Forgers.

------------------
Hammer, Anvil, Forge and Fire Chase away the hoofed liar.
Hoof and doorway, Block and Beam, Chase the Trickster from our dream

Leader and founder of the SPCL. Join today!

[SilentSleep]

I read this thread before reading the review, and I expected GayleSaver to have given it 3 or 4 hammers, but two! My jaw slammed against the desk. That's just two out of ten!

It's easily worth four or five bronze. It's a good first mission, doing what it tries to just about perfectly. It's definitely a worthy download.

Congratulations, aisha . It's a fine little mission.

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The Order Of The Vine
...and other stuff.

[Phosphor]

I think a rating system should be done away with, and replaced with mini-reviews that are totally objective, stating the good and the bad, ignoring personal opinion. That way it's up to the player to make the choice, based on accurate facts. I've played a couple of Silver FM's that are absolutely nothing to shout about, and I have played some that perhaps deserve more accolades than they recieved.


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I shall build shelters from the winds,
Feel the countless waters,
See the vast earth
And burn in the eternal fires.

[Myoldnamebroke]

You've just illustrated why your idea is impossible - they're nowt to shout about in your opinion. Everyone is opinionated, there can be no objective reviews of an art (as DromEDing is).

------------------
Hammer, Anvil, Forge and Fire Chase away the hoofed liar.
Hoof and doorway, Block and Beam, Chase the Trickster from our dream

Leader and founder of the SPCL. Join today!

[Avalon]

I think the rating system needs a few tweaks. The way they make it sound, is that Silver Hammer missions are just as good as the OMs. And Bronze, "ain't". But this is far from the truth.
When put in Myoldnamebroke's way, I don't think I would mistake any of the missions out so far as an OM. All of them are slightly under par. It's something you can't quite define that makes an OM what it is. It's the life behind the mission, the story, the things that make even the guards who say next to nothing seem more than a computer generated guard. The Vigil, Bloodstone, DoG... All of them are lacking in those areas, if not by much. Every guard seems like just a guy, the haunts seem like nobody but ghouls, and the four people gathered around C's coffin don't seem like family or friends at all. Which is why truly, with the system we have now, only a gold hammer mission will really have the "feel" of an OM. Or perhaps even that not-yet achieved 5 Silver Hammer mission.
Anyhow, the point is that with our current system, Affair could have gotten a silver. Probably a bit stretching it, as a full 5 bronze is more likely. But it certainly deserved either of those. No less.
But, we all have our oppinions. I honestly thought Secret Affair was a nice vacation from all the odd brain twists and annoying little buggers everybody thinks must be put into their mission to make it a success.

------------------
Beware the coming of the machines...
Check out my Tutorials on creating the Soulforge Machinery, all with working demos included.
Coming Soon
The Children of Chaos, a FM featuring the Keepers and their struggle with the lasting legacy of Karras...
The Sanctum

[Goit]

I really enjoyed this mission. It's only not silver hammer quality because it's just far too short.

In every other respect it's on a par with many silver hammer missions, and surpasses some (including, I reckon, one of my own).

A good story, some nice architectural features (fountain was very nice) and clever use of AI in places (I particulary liked the AI who patrols up to the gate while you pick it.)

I've played it three times now, which I think says enough.

My best advice to the author would be that the internal architecture needs improving. I learnt everything I know about internal architecture from 'The Library' and 'Circle of Strain' - both still the best missions to look closely at to see how to make architecture interesting.


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Suppose I'd better make a level then?

[kfgecko]

Two important things:

- Aisha should not feel bad because of the review.
- Gaylesaver should not be condemned for his own opinion.

There USED to be a full review staff but it was impossible to keep a team that stayed active. Because of this, DN opened up the floor to EVERYONE who would write a coherent and reasonably complete review.

I wish each mission had at least 3 different reviews from 3 different people. How come you guys aren't writing the reviews? (Note that: "This levels rocks! First let's talk architecture... blah blah" and "This level sucks! It was totally stoopid... blah blah" are not coherent reviews and will and should be rejected by DN.)

Another thing, why do people still give bronze such a stigma? Bronze does not mean "suck". It means "not quite comparable to an OM". Silver means "about comparable to an OM". Have you people played Odium, Skull of Lysander, Temple of the Forgers, and several others? These are fun bronze missions that should not be missed!

Aisha, you know I liked and enjoyed your mission. I'll take a risk here and say that I would probably give a 4.5 Bronze to Secret Affair. You definitely have the potential to create great missions. Secret Affair was fun, but it was also quite simplistic and light on the story. But this is what we expect for first time missions. Personally, I would not be surprised if your next one is a 4-5 silver quality. So keep up the good work.

To everyone else, just in case you're newer to this forum than 3 months, we've beaten the "rating system" debate to death. Realize that there is no perfect system. But this is a reasonably working (and of course flawed) system that still is getting the job of giving people and idea of what to expect the mission to be. Therefore, unless you want to re-review everything that's been done, stop talking about scrapping the system and use that energy to write more reviews! In fact, if we really could have at least 3 reviews (intelligent, coherent reviews that is) I think the current system will actually inherently improve.

BTW, I would have written a Hunt For Montrose mission pack review by now but it keeps crashing as it goes to the second mission.

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In development: "Lesser Evil" (working title) not one brush laid yet, planning, planning, writing, planning...
My Thief 1 missions: Bloodstone Prison and The Library

[GayleSaver]

First of all, Aisha, I apologize. I didn't mean to offend you, and I think that you would make a great FM author. It's just that, as I said, I'm a perfectionist. I'm not taking my score back - and I like this forum for its respect of opinion. I think you should work some more on the mission, re-release it if you will. I didn't want to hurt your feelings!

As for all of you saying that I was in a bad mood and all that - I'm sorry that I'm a perfectionist. I emailed KFGecko and was about to withdraw the review when he reassured me. I agree with him completely. If aisha wants to improve the mission, I'm open to any changes. I will publicly change my own score, and hopefully a reviewer with more luck than me will get it reviewed.

[This message has been edited by GayleSaver (edited May 05, 2000).]

[aisha]

Avalon, I think you're right about the fan missions being not as good as the OM's, but the OM's are the work of a group of people putting all their best talents together to make an outstanding game like thief, and the fan missions are usually created by only one person, not everyone is capable of telling good stories, building nice architecture, and bringing in twists and turns at the same time, we all have our limits at some point. If we were as good as the thief designers, we would probably all work in the gaming industry, wouldn't we?
I've been playing a lot of fan missions myself, and most of the time I had some good fun with them, and fun is basicly what we need when addicts like us are done with the OM's.
I definitely would like some sort of player review like it's being done at gamespot.com, let them give a score from 1 to 10, and then make some kind of objective review out of the player reviews.