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Thread: Do You Guys think Garrett cared about Viktoria?(major Spoilers)

  1. #1
    Keeper Zapp
    Guest

    Do You Guys think Garrett cared about Viktoria?(major Spoilers)

    SPOILERS FOR THOSE WHO HAVENT FINISHED THIEF AND THIEF2
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    I really mean it BIG SPOILERS
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    I have mixed feelings on the matter. I think no for a couple reasons.


    1) She ripped his freaking eye out.
    2) After Trail of Blood even though they work together for a similar cause he explains that they are not friends.(subtexual)
    BUT..... I think yes because

    1) He actually shows emotion when he finds out from the Keeper (not sure which one) that she had launched an attack on the Mechanist Cathedral planning to crowd it with plantlife. Because he knows she cant win alone. And the Keeper says he hopes things dont turn out how they are written.
    2) Again when she dies he gets kinda pissed off. (i think). He says "Karras" in a not to nice manner. Now this may be due to the fact that Karras had scored another victory.. kinda..but Im not sure. So Im asking you Guys.

    oh and I think its so awesome the way she kicks a little robot arse before kicks the can.Dont you????


    ------------------
    "Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time."- Keeper Chronicles of the Metal Age

    Zapp is my last name. Not a sound effect.


    The Official Commander of Commemorative Christmas Ornaments (C.O.C.C.O) of the SPCB

    [This message has been edited by Keeper Zapp (edited September 16, 2000).]

    [This message has been edited by Keeper Zapp (edited September 17, 2000).]

  2. #2
    PCommish
    Guest

    I recently posted a near identical post on the Eidos forum. I think it's retarded too. You'd think that Garrett, a master thief, could better distinguish between business associates and friends. They should both still hate each other. She's no less evil than Karras, she tried to take over the world no more than a few years ago. She ripped out his eye, tried to kill him. And he killed Constantine and brought on the Metal Age. He does get upset when she dies because he yells "Viktoria NOOO!". So, in conclusion I agree with you that Garrett does show feeling for her in the game. And that it's incredibly stupid for Garrett to care for an evil wooden demon woman who ripped out his eye.

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    Just a box no longer. Because I'm the commish and that's my wish.

    [This message has been edited by PCommish (edited September 16, 2000).]

    [This message has been edited by PCommish (edited September 16, 2000).]

  3. #3
    greypatch3
    Guest

    Yes, but don't you see? She didn't KNOW him very well before ripping out his eye. I've known times where people I was truly disgusted with at some point become very good friends later on...

    By the way, you can tell sparks are going to fly when she tells him not to touch the case full of rust gas...

  4. #4
    PCommish
    Guest

    Ok, I can see your point there. But I think that this would be a long lasting grudge. I don't think that either Garrett or Viktoria would be of the forgive and forget ideology.

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    Just a box no longer. Because I'm the commish and that's my wish.

  5. #5
    greypatch3
    Guest

    Just trying to make a joke. I guess LGS was trying to get a character built up that Garrett would grow very attached to. You can just imagine what would happen if it went too far...

    Viktoria: Yes, Garrett, we've had problems in the past, but we can put it all behind us now and think about...well, other things!

    Garrett: I agree, but, you ripped my eye out...

    Viktoria: Oh, are you still clinging to bygones? Stop those thoughts right now and join me in wanton bliss! Have you ever had Pagan love before?

    Garrett: Well, actually, yes, it happened several years ago in a spotty section of town, but this entirely...

    Viktoria: Enough talk! Spirit me away to my tree-top palace where we will make sweet love to the noises of my apemen patrols!

    Garrett: That doesn't sound very romantic...

    Apeman: Ooh, Vikki, offerings him your plumsies?

    Viktoria: Shut up! *kills apeman in horrible, dastardly ways*

    Garrett: Oh, now, that just killed the entire mood.

    Viktoria, voice going high-pitched and weird: Give yourself to me, Thief, or I shall remove something else you prize, and it won't be your other eye!

    Garrett: Well, talked me into it, I guess...

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    "We're through the looking glass here, people..." --Milhouse Van Houten
    <font color="D8D8E8"><font size="1">

    [This message has been edited by greypatch3 (edited September 17, 2000).]

  6. #6
    Keeper Zapp
    Guest

    Well thats quite funny greypatch3
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    I love her voice when it does that.Face me yourself MANFOOL!! She does that when fighting the Robots. I love that entire scene too!

    ------------------
    "Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time."- Keeper Chronicles of the Metal Age

    Zapp is my last name. Not a sound effect.


    The Official Commander of Commemorative Christmas Ornaments (C.O.C.C.O) of the SPCB

    [This message has been edited by Keeper Zapp (edited September 17, 2000).]

  7. #7
    screech
    Guest

    Well, it was all just a bit too gushy for me too. I had wanted Garrett to be more cold and less whiney about it all given the motivations that were presented in the game. Sounded like a 3 year old not wanting to pick up a toy [you know how many risks i am taking...whinge whinge].

    It would have been more fitting to have Vicky have to drag his nose in the facts a bit to get him to do some missions or that Karras melted down his home turf to get at him. That would have motivated Garrett to get back at Karras.

    ----
    but to answer the question, I think Garrett was in a state of confusion at the very end of the game for many reasons.

    Firstly, he's always been the one taking care of himself, and isn't too keen on having others help him for any number of reasons, ego being one of them.

    Vick who was a previously villanous character, makes a sacrifice to save him and everyone else. A rather significant act that can plausibly cut holes in his cynicism.

    Karras's rather mountanous despite for everyone was enough to punch holes in his apathy too.

    Also there is the notion that Karras presented Garrett with an amplified reflection of himself -- disdain raised to an exponential power, which put his own [petty] dislikes of society into perspective. In a way, Garrett just saw disdain taken to its extreme. After dealing with it, there really isn't that much left to explore.

    [This message has been edited by screech (edited September 17, 2000).]

  8. #8
    Shades
    Guest

    bullshit. the way it was done was fine.


  9. #9
    screech
    Guest

    for the very ending cutscene yes, but between blood and soulforge, many cut scenes he came off as smarmy and whiney to me at least. Alot of people reacted with some dissatisfaction one way or another.

    If anything I think its because Garrett operated only when there were direct insults to his pride, person or life in T1 and he never really makes it patently clear in T2 what is motivating him to keep playing James Bond. Garrett is a cynical creature, and it seems to me he'd have to say something arch before diving into a submarine or what not.

    [This message has been edited by screech (edited September 17, 2000).]

  10. #10
    punkard
    Guest

    Think of it this way. Your good at what you do and you know the way you want to do it will work, then this person you really are not that fond of (or maybe he is after a while) comes along and starts telling you what you need to do in order to complete this quest and the way in which they want you to do it is just about considered suicide.

    In fact look at what Viktoria planned on doing. She HAD to kill herself in order to accomplish the goal. Now Garret just didnt approve of her method 'cause it WAS suicide and if he hadn't have left at that moment to plan his own method, which he was going to do, and went along with her plan HE would have been the dead one.


    (I hope I didn't make that too confusing. I do that a lot sometimes. I'm tired.. Bleah.)

  11. #11
    Lancer
    Guest

    I have a comment to make about Victoria and Constantine.
    Vixtoria was not necessarily evil. Just had a different sense of morals.
    After all, the pagans would not have loved her so much if she had been an evil goddess.
    Constantine also, wasn't necessarily evil, just wanted man to fear and respect him as it did in the days before the builder taught men how to rise up, and take control of their environment. You get that much from one fo the books in the last treehouse I think it was.

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    Lancer
    www.banzaidesign.com

  12. #12
    frobber
    Guest

    First of all it is possible for enemies to become friends given a bigger common enemy. Happens all the time -- so the alliance between V and G makes sense.

    As to emotion -- she's a tree and he's a human. So apart from G seeing her as human there isn't much possible here.

    The story as is seems plausible given the extreme circumstances. But I doubt V and G would have stayed friends once Karras got his ass kicked.

    Of course we may never know unless the new Thief 3 team pulls a V clone out of the woods.

    Prefer that this gets left as is, though.

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    THE ENTERPRISE now playing. Rate it here.

    [This message has been edited by frobber (edited September 17, 2000).]

  13. #13
    Naartjie
    Guest

    Garrett- Hey Viktoria! Where are you taking ?

    Viktoria- To my leafy love-nest, manfool, to make sweet love to the sounds of my apeman patrols!

    They walk off together into a nearby tree...two figures detach themselves from a nearby bush..

    Haunt 1- What a prank!

    Haunt 2- Most definately, my brother. Those two heathen unbelievers'll get a nasty shock this evening!

    Haunt 1- ROFL- I can't wait to see Vik's reaction when she finds out we stole her mattress and replaced it with burrick skin!

    Haunt 2- LOL- I borrowed some spines from our crayman friends, Garrett'll have trouble pulling those out!

    Haunt 1 - If he wants help, he could come to the Cathedral and we'll pull them out, if he'd first Join us!
    Join Us NOOOOOoooooWWWWWWWWwwwwww!!!!

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    Ugh!.....Builder....

  14. #14
    LordBurrickBreath
    Guest

    Viktoria was (possibly) under the influence of the Trickster (like haunts) and now that Woody is dead she is free. or maybe she just likes his cape

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    If thine had a Hammer, thine wouldst Hammer in the morning....

  15. #15
    Grundbegriff
    Guest

    Originally posted by Keeper Zapp:
    2) He killed her father
    Eh?

    G.


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    Cutpurse-in-Chief, CLAN Larcenio Haul
    I'm tired of some guy....

  16. #16
    Keeper Zapp
    Guest

    My fault. I always have this temptation to call them family. Instead of "old associates" like she originally said.

    ------------------
    "Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time."- Keeper Chronicles of the Metal Age

    Zapp is my last name. Not a sound effect.


    The Official Commander of Commemorative Christmas Ornaments (C.O.C.C.O) of the SPCB

  17. #17
    Cybergoth
    Guest

    You know...I really hate to say this reason for Garrett liking her but...

    VIKTORIA IS HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  18. #18
    Keeper Zapp
    Guest

    I think she would be too if she wasnt a plant.

    ------------------
    "Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time."- Keeper Chronicles of the Metal Age

    Zapp is my last name. Not a sound effect.


    The Official Commander of Commemorative Christmas Ornaments (C.O.C.C.O) of the SPCB

  19. #19
    DarkWalker
    Guest

    I agree with Cybergoth.

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    DarkWalker
    Remember-The Shadows are your Friend.

    Watch for "Night on the Town," coming kinda soon to a CoSaS near you...I hope...

  20. #20
    PCommish
    Guest

    I agree with Keeper Zapp.

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    Just a box no longer. Because I'm the commish and that's my wish.

  21. #21
    greypatch3
    Guest

    I agree to disagree.

    Nine out of ten mothers also agree that Whizzo butter is absolutely indistinguishable from a dead crab.

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    "We're through the looking glass here, people..." --Milhouse Van Houten

  22. #22
    screech
    Guest

    ahh but guys are notorious for their lack of cultivational skills. they'd prolly forget to water her and she'd get disgusted and shack up with the gardener.

  23. #23
    Keeper Zapp
    Guest

    *****BUMP*****

    ------------------
    "Wisdom and balance lie in knowing your own nature over time."- Keeper Chronicles of the Metal Age

    Zapp is my last name. Not a sound effect.


    The Official Commander of Commemorative Christmas Ornaments (C.O.C.C.O) of the SPCB

  24. #24
    V. Equinox
    Guest

    As much as I adore him, I don't really think Garrett has a whole helluva lot of common sense. So, the fact that he would later find himself attracted to the woman who plucked out his eye isn't entirely strange to me.
    After all, this is the guy who, despite ALL the dead bodies laying around, waltzes into a zombie haven. MANY zombie havens. Not to mention the lair of a god. I sure wouldn't do that! (Come to think of it, maybe that's why I have no money...)

    Anyway, I don't think he loved Viktoria, but I think he found himself growing attracted to her. After all, I doubt he gets to hang around too many constantly naked women. Plus, because he works alone a lot, this might have been a bit of a shock to his system.


    V. Equinox
    (Anyway, he set himself up for it by proclaiming, "I equate feelings with getting caught." I mean, jeez, if that isn't asking for Murphy's Law, I don't know what is!)


  25. #25
    HammerTime
    Guest

    I think Garrett had the hots for Viktoria in thief one the dark project. That is until she plucked out his eye. Then he hated her guts. In Thief 2 he was pretty much forced into working with her. As the mission to stop Karras wore on he did get feelings for her. But they were not love, they were friendship. Garrett had been a loner all of his life. And now he had someone to talk to, relate to and work with. If Viktoria had never plucked out his eye in thief one, it might have turned into love. But when she did betrayed him and took his eye, that was just to much to ever forgive for the relationship to be anything more than causal friendship. And a heretic and a Pagan don't totaly see eye to eye so to speak...........HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

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