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Thread: Insurrection, T2 FM (04/05/2005)

  1. #51
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2003
    Location: some things never change
    Great mission Very nice atmosphere in the mansion with the moonbeams and the occasional zombie walking in front of the windows. In the last part I got killed at least 5 times before I reached the observatory

    Sir Lance
    spoiler:
    the observatory is outside the mansion, you have to go back through the sewers. The note with the code is on the 2nd floor in the room before you go to the attic. It says something about going eight times into town etc.(that's on "expert", I never had bots in the game so I assume, that you play on another difficulty?)

  2. #52
    Ghost
    Registered: Aug 2003

    More ghost whining

    Hm. If this mission is ghostable, then there must be some huge thing that I'm missing... like some sort of electrical cut-off that kills all the lights in the mansion.

    When guards spawn in previously empty and well-lit areas, and some of them spawn already alerted -- when you're supposed to "sneak" through brightly lit areas guarded by watchers -- I have kind of a hard time believing that this is a ghostable mission, even though the author assures me that he has ghosted it "many, many times."

    All I can say is hats off; if Hipbreaker can really ghost this mission, then either I'm just missing something huge, or else he is a thousand times better a ghoster than I.

    Or else we have different definitions of ghosting. Has Peter Smith, Old Man, or Vanguard played this mission? I'd love to see where I'm going wrong.

    Dafydd

  3. #53
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2003
    snowcap21 thanks for the help but I am confused with the
    spoiler:
    note with the combination to the vault. I am playing on expert and the room next to the attic does not have a note unless it is in the locked chest to which I have not been able to find the key. I can't understand why you don't have all the bots.

  4. #54
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2003
    Location: some things never change
    Hm, strange, perhaps I don't remember it correctly.
    spoiler:
    The scroll should lay on a table, not in a chest. In the room that has the door, which leads to the small gallery, which leads to the attic door. Sorry if I'm not clear. And I think you should be able to open the small chests with the lockpicks.? edit: no, sorry, it's a big chest and you need the "chest key" for this chest. No idea where I picked it up though.


    Question: Should there be bots in the mission, or not? I don't have any bot.
    Last edited by snowcap21; 7th Apr 2005 at 05:43.

  5. #55
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2005
    Location: in here
    I read the book on the desk of the scientist but the ojective does not tick of. I also got all the scrols from observatory and the evidence but still nothing hapens.

  6. #56
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2005
    Location: Kouvola, Finland
    Quote Originally Posted by Kin
    I read the book on the desk of the scientist but the ojective does not tick of. I also got all the scrols from observatory and the evidence but still nothing hapens.
    Same here, but I couldn't even read any of the scrolls in the observatory. I just CASEd in the end.

    Btw, a very good mission, but I'd still consider the possiblity to not add guards that spawn when certain loot is picked up. Especially when these guards know exactly where you're and are in full alert. Also the sarecrow was rather lame.

  7. #57
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2003
    snowcap21

    spoiler:
    Found the scroll you were talking about and looted the vault. Found the observatory but can't read any of the messages on the desk or floor.

  8. #58
    Member
    Registered: Oct 2001
    Location: 0x0x0
    A very good effort. I enjoyed it a lot. The lighting was outstanding as were the differnt colors. (If you've played my missions you know I like to mix it up with lots of color )

    Question: What ambient light setting was used? The dark areas were much darker than usual. I've always stuck with 19 19 19 just to take the edge off.

  9. #59
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Austin, TX
    Quote Originally Posted by Dafydd
    Hm. If this mission is ghostable, then there must be some huge thing that I'm missing... like some sort of electrical cut-off that kills all the lights in the mansion.

    When guards spawn in previously empty and well-lit areas, and some of them spawn already alerted -- when you're supposed to "sneak" through brightly lit areas guarded by watchers -- I have kind of a hard time believing that this is a ghostable mission, even though the author assures me that he has ghosted it "many, many times."

    All I can say is hats off; if Hipbreaker can really ghost this mission, then either I'm just missing something huge, or else he is a thousand times better a ghoster than I.

    Or else we have different definitions of ghosting. Has Peter Smith, Old Man, or Vanguard played this mission? I'd love to see where I'm going wrong.

    Dafydd
    Alrighty,
    spoiler:
    In terms of those alerted guards, they teleport in when you collect all the candles off the table, kind of a consequcne for wanting all loot I suppose hehe. If you are sneaky enough you can jump from shadow to shadow and get behind them. Also, be very stingy with the gas arrow and mine, they are very critical to ghost this mission. Now about ghosting, I have ghosted, and it is possible, not recommended but possible. The reason being for it to be so hard is because of the haunts when you come back into the city. This isn't a good example for a ghosting mission you could say (which is one reason why I didn't send it to you, nothing against you) It is just one of those nearly impossible, get lucky ghosting ones.


    Also for SlyFoxx, I didn't use Komag's Dromed tools, because for some reason my computer didn't like that. So I used standard DromEd throughout the entire building process. Anyway for rendering I used .04515 for all.
    Last edited by HipBreaker; 7th Apr 2005 at 12:56.

  10. #60
    Ghost
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Okay, thanks, Hipbreaker: I think I misunderstood your e-mail. (By the way, you can't use gas arrows while ghosting -- unless you're using them to put out torches!)

    I think I'm going to restart from the beginning and just KO everyone this time.

    Dafydd

  11. #61
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Austin, TX
    Quote Originally Posted by Dafydd
    Okay, thanks, Hipbreaker: I think I misunderstood your e-mail. (By the way, you can't use gas arrows while ghosting -- unless you're using them to put out torches!)

    I think I'm going to restart from the beginning and just KO everyone this time.

    Dafydd
    Gotcha, maybe it isn't possible. maybe I am not ghosting but this is what I do:

    spoiler:
    Okay first I blackjack everyone, and no one even knows I exist. You can either leave one candle on the table or, the one guard searching, and the one standing there, place a mine in his path, and hug the wall and blackjack the other guard. Or blackjack them both (possible) Now it gets tricky. Go out the sewer after you get the antidote, and backstab the haunts. Careful, it's loud, heh. Go into the observatory, if you set a moss arrow and do it carefully, you can one hit the commander. Grab the objective and leave. NOW as for complete ghosting with no blackjacking and/or killing haunts, I'm pretty sure that's impossible. I must have gotten a different definition, so maybe what I do isn't ghosting, but I think it's as close as you are going to get in this mission. Now that I think about it, I might give it a go (complete ghost) on Normal difficulty, that should be possible.
    Last edited by HipBreaker; 7th Apr 2005 at 14:28.

  12. #62
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Austin, TX
    Okay so that was interesting:

    spoiler:
    On Normal, I ghosted everything, minus a couple zombies who are triggered to wake up no matter what. The only thing I may have broken the rules was, for the guard in front of the vault, I shot an arrow to make him look in another direction a couple times, but he did eventually stop searching. I blackjacked/backstabed nothing, and I witnessed a brawl in the city which I escaped unnoticed. So that's as close as I'm going to get I think.

  13. #63
    Ghost
    Registered: Aug 2003
    You're absolutely right, Hipbreaker... you're not ghosting!

    The rules of ghosting require no blackjacking, no KOs by gas or any other means, no backstabs, no broken windows, slashed banners, or any other property damage (including no breaking of boxes) -- and that you must play on Expert level. I know, because I helped write the final draft in an effort headed by ghoster extraordinaire Peter Smith!

    Here they are:

    http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthr...threadid=30310

    That's the reason I always offer to ghost test missions when they're in beta-test mode... usually, a few simple tweaks here and there can make a really nice mission like this one also a ghostable mission, which adds an extra layer of enjoyment to players who like playing in that mode.

    I would have suggested very minor stuff: for example, sticking in another watcher control room, so Garrett could shut off the ones by the vault -- or just some more shadow, so he could creep past them. Also, a switch that would turn off the chandeliers in the room with the spawning, alerted guard and the other spawning guard. Actually, I did ghost the first guard; it was the second, stationary guard, the one staring directly where I had to go, that I simply could not get past without alerting. (I could easily have BJed him, of course.) A couple more shadows here and there, and voila, these parts of the mission are ghostable without making any changes in gameplay for anyone else.

    I haven't played past that point yet, so I don't know whether it would take more than a minor tweak to make the last part ghostable. But I was actually working on a clean (albeit very challenging!) ghost right up until the guard I mentioned above; that busted me, and the vault busted me big time.

    So for all those designing missions, it's almost always possible to make incredibly tiny changes during beta-test that will allow players to ghost the mission... assuming they're good enough ghosters! Please, unless it's one of those Japanese-style missions that are more like Doom or Quake, get someone like Peter (or even me !) to help with the beta-testing and add an extra dimension of challenge to your missions.

    Thanks,

    Dafydd

  14. #64
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Austin, TX
    Oh well, I guess I didn't have that in mind during creation. Still with those minor changes, later
    spoiler:
    in the city and the observatory with all the haunts
    the changes would have had a massive impact on the design of the mission in order to ghost. Unfortunately I guess this mission will not be completely ghostable. Other than that I hope everyone is enjoying it, heh.

  15. #65
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2002
    Location: Garland, Texas
    Okay, I'm not stuck but there is a golden chest/box on a table in the room in the mansion that leads up to the attic (strange sounds up there - I keep expecting to be attacked). Anyhow, I cannot find a key for this chest. Is it in the attic?

    Nice ambient sounds. I liked the way to disable the watchers. :)

    I'm playing on Expert if that matters.

  16. #66
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2002
    Location: Garland, Texas
    Quote Originally Posted by Polychromic
    Okay, I'm not stuck but there is a golden chest/box on a table in the room in the mansion that leads up to the attic (strange sounds up there - I keep expecting to be attacked). Anyhow, I cannot find a key for this chest. Is it in the attic?

    Nice ambient sounds. I liked the way to disable the watchers.

    I'm playing on Expert if that matters.
    Hmmm. Nevermind.

    I could have sworn that chest key vanished from my inventory after using it in the
    spoiler:
    hidden room behind the library
    .

    Aha! I was right about that
    spoiler:
    scarecrow
    ! Kind of silly though.

  17. #67
    Is there any way to
    spoiler:
    disable the watchers in the vault room? I've found the switch to disable the other security measures. Or do I just have to put up with the wailing alarm?


    Thanks!

  18. #68
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2002
    Location: Garland, Texas
    Quote Originally Posted by JACKofTrades
    Is there any way to
    spoiler:
    disable the watchers in the vault room? I've found the switch to disable the other security measures. Or do I just have to put up with the wailing alarm?


    Thanks!
    spoiler:
    If you stand in the archway behind where the guard is, there is a dark spot. Deal with the guard, then stand there and wait for the watchers to go back to green. Then you can lean forward to open the vault and run into it without setting off the alarm.


    Sucks that not all the loot is frobbable, eh?

    BTW, I don't think there is any vault combo note on expert. There is an unfrobbable note in the room where you disable the other watchers though.

  19. #69
    @Polychromic

    Yup, that's what I wound up doing. Just took a little experimenting to figure out the right way to do it.

    Thanks

  20. #70
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: Cal-i-for-NI-a
    feeling kinda dumb here...cannot find
    spoiler:
    key to even get into the mansion!!!

  21. #71
    Member
    Registered: Nov 2003
    Location: Austin, TX
    Quote Originally Posted by Polychromic

    Sucks that not all the loot is frobbable, eh?
    Loot is set to 0.

    Also, the note should be in the same spot on all difficulty settings.

    As for nil8hate,
    spoiler:
    There is a switch outside the church behind a crate.
    Last edited by HipBreaker; 7th Apr 2005 at 23:01.

  22. #72
    Member
    Registered: Jan 2003
    Location: Cal-i-for-NI-a
    ahhhhhhhhhhhhh...thanks

  23. #73
    Member
    Registered: Apr 2003
    spoiler:
    Ok, I'm in the room with the telescope. I take it there must be a secret button in here that hides the scientist. Can't find him!!

  24. #74
    Member
    Registered: Jul 2003
    Location: Seattle
    Yeeehaaaa!

    Great job, HipBreaker!

    Only problem I may have had was that the darkloader screen says there should be a movie, but no movie played.

  25. #75
    Ghost
    Registered: Aug 2003
    Sir Lance, I think the switch you're looking for is in the music room... check the unlit torches.

    Anybody get all four secrets?

    It's odd that after you kill the big bad, all the haunts and zombies die... except for the ones in the sewer, making it hard to get back into the mansion to find more loot.

    I never found the Chest Key -- can somebody please enlighten me?

    Thanks,

    Dafydd

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